And I think the key word here is FORCED -- just as each of the other LBers were confronted with their opposites, and could not deal with it, Eurmal was forced to become his opposite, too -- he was forced to face up to his own responsibility as an entity of the cosmos. And this worked in the _favor_ of the quest, because before this he was NOT a reliable asset.
On the LBQ, everything must become its opposite at some point. Hmm, I had not considered this -- the LBQ MUST include a trickster, for just this reason. If the questors don't bring a trickster, there will be no one to save them when Orlanth becomes weak, Chalana is in constant pain, Lhankor is stupid, Issaries is a fool, and Ginna Jar (their group spirit) does not exist. They all become Trickster, so he must become then.
Flesh Man is a possible monkey wrench here -- he is a madman, so presumably he becomes sane again at this point. However, I seem to recall that he was killed at some point on the quest (?), so perhaps he does not face this, and meets them all again near the end, in the Deep Hell. In this way, he can be seen as the tanist, the sacrifice needed to allow the quest to continue at some point.
Dave Dunham responding to Patrik
>> Is there anyone who has any ideas or theories about how the
>> Sartarite kolating (shaman) fits in their tribal society as of
>> the 1620's?
>
>My guess is: poorly. He's probably the hermit who lives in the wilds. He
>may have an apprentice who helps get him food, and he no doubt collects
>gifts from folk. (Possibly larger gifts than the RQ3 rules imply, since
he
>doesn't necessarily get them often.)
This is supported by the Paulis Longvale narrative in Cults of Terror/Lords of Terror:
[In the Malia section, after converting a village from surreptitious propitiatory worship of Malia to reliance again upon Chalana Arroy] "Hahlgrim left soon thereafter, to seek a shaman in the wilds who could protect the farmers permanently."
One also needs to remember that the kolatings are not a *distinct* part of Orlanthi religion, unlike in Prax, where they are specifically a part of the Waha cult, the dominant male religion in the land. Sure, there are non-Waha shamans in the Wastes, but probably not a whole lot. As there is no shaman-specific cult we know of among the Orlanthi, the shamans are likely to be varied in their Tradition, and less likely to be found within tribal, clan, or Orlanth-cult practices. If they are outside of normal society in this respect, they are more likely to live outside of normal society -- they might live in a clan area, even in a village, but they would not be part of the clan in the same way that the Wind Lord or Storm Voice would be.
Peter Metcalfe:
>(although where Shang-Hsa, Yanoor and the False Emperors reside, no-one
>knows).
Well, since Yanoor went prematurely to the afterlife, without ascending to Dragonhood as is proper, I assume that he is in the temporary afterlife. When Godunya dies, he will finally be liberated to the proper consciousness which was denied him by the God Learners.
It seems to me that such an abdication of power is certainly an option for the Kralorelan Emperor, at any time. It is damaging to his soul and the kingdom, but it is an acceptable course of last resort, since a new Dragon Emperor will eventually liberate him -- no long-term damage done.
This is as opposed to his becoming enslaved or perverted by the GLs, never dying, and so never releasing himself or anyone else to the next stage of existence. THAT is unacceptable, and so Saintly Yanoor** fled life.
>The Worship of the Sun, Moon and Stars has changed under the influence
of >transplanted Lunars into Kralorela.
First of all, what transplanted Lunars?
Second of all, how has their worship of the Sun, Moon, and Stars _changed_ (considering it is unlikely they had any Moon Worship to change, and considering I find it unlikely that they worship the Moon at all, even nowadays)?
If you are using the presence in Kralorela of "Yelm," "Dendara," and "Eiritha" as evidence that there are Dara Happans in Kralorela, I reject that idea categorically -- these are not the real names of those gods, and never have been. It is simply that no one knew better when Genertela was published. Hell, Eiritha certainly isn't the name of the cow goddess in Dara Happa or even among the Orlanthi, why suppose it is so in Kralorela?
>>An obvious example is Dragon Pass, extensively occupied by trolls
during
>>the Inhuman Occupation. While they didn't explicitly force trolls
>>somewhere, they did for the most part expell them from Tarsh and
Sartar.
>The Trolls were kicked out by the Dragonewts and not by humans. I
>don't recall Arim the Pauper, the Colymar clan or even the Grazers
>having any problems with Trolls.
While, it is specifically stated in Trollpak/Haunted Ruins that the Sazdorf Clan was forced out of their home in the Indigo Mountains by either the Torkani or the Telmori, I can't recall which. But this is a minor case -- troll dominance was broken primarily by the dragonewts and the trols' inter-tribal warfare. And by the death of the Only Old One, I am sure that helped to weaken them.
>>The God Learners are my guess, too, unless the early settlers of the
Leftarm
>>Isles did that - they were sort of Malkioni after all, and knew about
castles.
>They weren't Malkioni until the God Learners came. They bought
>the fable about them being Malkioni but this is on par as the
>Romans thinking themselves descendants of the Trojans under Prince
>Aenas or even the Britons under Brutus the Trojan. There is also
>the theory of British Israelitism.
Except, where would these God Forgotters have been exposed to the myths of Malkion? My understanding is that they have claimed to be Malkioni since the Dawn, long before there was any contact with the West in Kethaela. I am of the belief that they represent a very old colony of Malkioni, who lost most of their Malkioni ways until the contact with new Malkioni in the Second Age revived these customs.
Ken Jewelzz on Dinosaurs
> There aren't any listed in RQII besides the Bolo Lizard( which isn't
>exactly a dino,as they're described as "dinosaur-like"; though stat-wise
very
>simular to the Deinonychus ).
Well, this is not quite true -- there were none in the RQ2 rulesbook, but there were Gloranthan dinosaurs published in Griffin Mountain and Borderlands. Mention is also made in various RQ2 and RQ3 publications of triceratops, and in Dragon Pass we also get mention of pterodactyls and trachodons (3 types of which were in Borderlands).
It is implied in various RQ3 publications that the full range of dinos exist, though stats for most have never been published (Gateway Bestiary did have a number). Some RQ3 stats were written for some (probably by Sandy), but never got included anywhere, probably for lack of space.
There is also brief mentions in relation to Odayla, the Orlanthi Hunting Gods, that one fairly common form of hunting is digging huge pits in which to trap dinosaurs for eatin' purposes. Trollpak mentions the occasional dinosaur (and mammoths!) in Dagori Inkarth. I think there are occasional brontosaurs in the River of Cradles area, as well as other creatures. Balazar and the Elder Wilds certainly have their share of dinosaurs, though I imagine they were more common in the First Age (when some dragonewts herded them there).
Finally, GRoY and the Entekosiad mentions that there were once dinosaurs in much of Peloria, but they seem to be extinct now.
Perhaps Sandy would like to share the ones he has, or would like me to post the ones I have access to?
Nick suggesting an early Cradle-wreck:
>Cradles had magical guardians and defences, so something would have
>to have nobbled these in order to cause a Cradle-wreck. The most obvious
>*big* magic-affecting thing would, of course, be the Sunstop of 375 ST.
>Easy to believe that, if a Cradle were floating down the Zola Fel when
>this happened, it'd have run aground with its defenders "off-line".
Ooh, this is a Way Cool suggestion. And it makes me wonder what other types of magic in Glorantha went "off-line" during the Sunstop?
Frederic Ferro
>?Would it contradict anything if the Pharaoh's (final) death occurred in
>Earth season, Week of Life in that year 1616? (the Year Ritual should
>logically happen around that date, I suppose)
Nothing published that I know of gives the date. And, considering that the Lunars say it is Jar-Eel who killed him, and Jar-Eel is said to be an incarnation of Hon-Eel, who is an Earth/Fertility Heroine of the Lunar Empire, the date works well from the Lunar Side of things too.
Michael Schwartz:
>>And the process of reading it will cause certain problems in the
>>mentality of the scribe translating it....
>
>Origin of the Cult of Silence? Any takers?
Probably not, since the Cult of Silence is a Pamaltelan cult which originated two or three centuries ago. :)
>Frankly, given a choice of "Things Man Was Not Meant To Know", I'd
>imagine most player-characters might prefer the mind-withering
chaos-born
>horrors of the Book of Drastic Resolutions (not the 'zine) to the Purple
>Book of Refuge.
Giving it this title just reminded me of the old pun, "New Writers of the Purple Sage" -- anyone think Minaryth Purple could have written this book in a fit of madness some time?
The New Writers of the Purple Sage would then be a group of religious fanatics who began worshiping the writer of the book, sometime in the near future say 1640 or so. Eventually, they would be the ones to found the Londarios Library, also called the Purple Library.
Stephen Martin
ilium_at_juno.com
- -----------------------------------------------The Book of Drastic Resolutions
End of The Glorantha Digest V5 #384
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