From: RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RQ Digest Maintainer)
To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Daily automated RQ-Digest)
Reply-To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RuneQuest Daily)
Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Sat, 02 Apr 1994, part 1
Sender: Henk.Langeveld@Holland.Sun.COM
Content-Return: Prohibited
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X-RQ-ID: Intro
This is the RuneQuest Daily Bulletin, a mailing list on
the subjects of Avalon Hill's RPG and Greg Stafford's
world of Glorantha. It is sent out once per day in digest
format.
More details on the RuneQuest Daily and Digest can be found
after the last message in this digest.
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From: SMITHH@mr.mgh.harvard.edu (Harald Smith 617 726-2172)
Subject: games/sports
Message-ID: <01HANIWB7TD2PMTZVI@mr.mgh.harvard.edu>
Date: 1 Apr 94 02:35:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 3483
Hello everyone--
Although the speculation about national/regional sports has been
interesting, I think for a 'Bronze Age' flavored world most such
sports are extremely unlikely.
Since most of the world's population does not live in cities, but
in small villages, you are unlikely to have enough people to play
sports that require large teams. Most games such as soccer or
baseball are urban developments of the early modern to modern
world. Far more likely in the villages are wrestling matches
(certainly popular in my development of Imther and also IMO in
any Orlanthi based culture) or games involving a limited number
of teens or young adults utilizing the cultural weapons be they
javelins, spears, bows, etc. And in the nomadic areas where most
people spend their time looking after the herds or hunting (just
surviving day-to-day), you are unlikely to have any sports except
at major tribal gatherings (again picturing games or competitions
which emphasize the cultural weapons or skills).
Instead of transposing earth games, I think we should be starting
with the local village/tribal cultures and work up, developing
unique Gloranthan games like Shield Push. The games is towns and
cities are most likely then enhancements, enlargements, or
formalizations of the old village/tribal games.
--Harald Smith
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From: jpolk@opus.starlab.csc.com (James Polk)
Subject: Sports, Broos, RQ:AiG
Message-ID: <9404011440.AA01723@opus.starlab.csc.com>
Date: 1 Apr 94 14:40:03 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 3484
Ooops, forgot to load my text file. Let me try again!
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From: jpolk@opus.starlab.csc.com (James Polk)
Subject: Broos, Sports, RQ:AiG
Message-ID: <9404011442.AA01807@opus.starlab.csc.com>
Date: 1 Apr 94 14:42:49 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 3485
Joe Lannom re: Groups of Broos
How about a Scourge of Broos, or a Trouble of Broos?
Gloranthan Sports:
It seems to me villages cannot support the big team sports of which
many people speak. I think wrestling would be popular, and also
skill contests relating to local jobs, such as smithing, lumberjacking,
and herd raiding.
Additionally, in any society which spends 90+% of its time trying to
keep themselves alive (Nomads in the Wastes, the RQ 2 Balazarlings),
these contests would occur only during special events, such as Sacred Time
celebrations. When one spends all one's time trying to get enough to
eat, games don't seem very important.
RQ:AiG:
I would like to ask people to _stop_ speculating on the whys and where-
fores until Greg has a chance to tell the RQ Daily world his side.
Thoughts about how RQ will die without RQ:AiG seem premature. In fact,
from what I have read, RQ:AiG may still be published, albeit after some
changes.
I see a lot of intense emotion in some of the messages and ask people
to give themselves (and others) a chance to calm down before
continuing the debate.
- james
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From: sandyp@idcube.idsoftware.com (Sandy Petersen)
Subject: various subjects
Message-ID: <9404011625.AA28580@idcube.idsoftware.com>
Date: 1 Apr 94 04:25:56 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 3486
re: RQ4
MOB mentions that Steve Martin is no expert on RQ rules. This is
probably true. However, I am, and I, too had serious reservations
about the rules changes in RQ 4.
Joe Lannom sez:
many sensible things about broos. And also ...
>I don't remember exactly where, perhaps in the Borderlands pack
>(running that, currently), the broo's reproductive habits are
>described.
Hmm.In the RQ III Creatures book it mentions that broos can
hybridize with almost anything.
>Broo, when born, try VERY hard to get away, as they are usually born
>to someone/thing that is NOT pleased at being a host for such an
>abomination
Most animals trot off into a quiet area to give birth, especially
when feeling ill. Hence, I suspect many larval broos get away, given
that they are quite precocious (able to walk, bite, etc. at birth).
Another factor helping the larvae escape is the fact that quite often
an entire herd will "birth" at once, since they were all impregnated
on the same night by the same broo. I suspect that fairly often, an
entire group of several dozen feral broos escape at once to grow up
together.
My own theory is that most broos do not take long at all to
reach maturity -- a year or two, tops, much like a cow or other herd
animal.
Carl Fink sez:
>It was always my impression that Trollball was a parody of American
>Football. Of course, Sandy Petersen is reading this, and he sort of
>invented it. Why are we speculating?
Despite my authorship of (half of) TROLLPAK and long-time
defense of and research into trolls I did not invent Trollball.I
think Charlie Krank was the chief villain behind this sport. And yes,
Trollball is a sort of parody of sandlot football, but of course less
violent. Trollball is as much a mockery of trolls as anything.
Other sports:
Mostali: Human-tossing (modeled after a popular American tavern sport
involving the tallness-challenged)
Yelmalio: King of the Hill
Morocanth: Pin the hand on the human (modeled on a popular Praxian
game)
Babeester Gor: Kickball (not the version you're thinking of)
Uleria: submarine races
Broos: Let's not think about it.
Carl Fink also sez:
>I had always figured that krarshtkids were fragments of the Maw
>squeezed off when Larnste stomped her.
Sold. a convincing argument.
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From: PATERNO@D0GS04.FNAL.GOV
Subject: RE: RuneQuest Daily, Fri, 01 Apr 1994, part 1
Message-ID: <940401105343.4e802067@D0GS04.FNAL.GOV>
Date: 1 Apr 94 04:53:43 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 3487
MOB says:
"I would actually like to practise haruspication on the
looney right renascent
Thatcherite fascist bucaneers who tried to close our
school, very Roman,
and could be written into our biology program."
It's bad enough to have the RQ:AiG politics cluttering
a friendly discussion group. Could we please keep the
real-world politics out?
Marc
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From: f6ri@midway.uchicago.edu (charles gregory fried)
Subject: broo-hoo-hoo!
Message-ID:
Date: 1 Apr 94 17:12:33 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 3488
Joe,
How about this one:
A sphincter of broos.
I think that gets the idea across....
-- GF
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From: watson@computing-science.aberdeen.ac.uk (Colin Watson)
Subject: realities; changing the rules
Message-ID: <9404011728.AA12103@condor>
Date: 1 Apr 94 17:28:07 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 3489
> What's the difference between a reality that was always "there,"
> but was unknown before you entered it, and a reality called into
> being by your attempts to exit your old world?
To the participant (RQ character) there is no perceptable difference.
But from a external creator's-eye-view, we (the GM & players) know that there
are many possible Gloranthan realities out there. For starters, other people's
Gloranthas, though different from our own, are equally valid. Also, much
history of the past and future has been published. We may not choose to use all
of it, but its apparent that our RQ characters *could* experience any of these
possible realities if we wanted them to.
A character might only be aware of one Gloranthan reality. We (the GMs &
players) should at least acknowledge know that there are many.
It's not the character's beliefs which shape its reality; if anything its
the players beliefs which determine it.
For me, the "multiple realities" model provides the benefit of One True World
(which basically boils down to objective consistency) but with the flexibility
to have Many True Realities. It explains why certain source material (whether
published or home-grown) can conflict with other source material. Both
source are equally valid depending upon which reality you view from.
What more could you ask for? :-)
___
And, if I may, I'll tenuously link this to what Sandy said:
> I resort to one of three techniques when I am changing an old rule or
> introducing a new one, and the players don't like the alteration to
> their game. [...]
A fourth technique would be to induct the characters into a mini Heroquest
and then tell the players afterwards that the rule-change was a side-effect of
shifting to another reality.
___
CW.
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From: jacobus@sonata.cc.purdue.edu (Bryan J. Maloney)
Subject: What to call a group of Broo
Message-ID: <9404012148.AA21399@sonata.cc.purdue.edu>
Date: 1 Apr 94 11:48:37 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 3490
Well, one thing does sort of leap to mind on this:
A MOB of Broo.
How's that sound, eh?
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From: ECZ5RAR@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU (Anthony Ragan)
Subject: RQ:AiG
Message-ID: <9404020027.AA22102@Sun.COM>
Date: 2 Apr 94 00:27:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 3491
Hi all,
(Sorry to post this here, but I don't get the RQ4 group and since the
letters were cross-posted here.....:>)
Like most of us, I don't know why Greg denied approval of RQ:AiG -- I hope
the matter gets sorted out soon and then we can all look forward to the
Glorious Reascent of Runequest. :>
This crisis gives all concerned a chance to reassess the kind of product
we'd like to see so, with the hope of having a bit of influence, let me
throw in my two bolgs' worth:
1) Keep it Simple. I love Chaosium's Basic Roleplay system -- I think
it's an amazingly flexible vehicle for roleplay. But RQ in its current
incarnation (RQ3, I've never seen any draft of RQ4) involves too many
clumsy mechanics that get in the way: strike ranks (nice idea, clumsy
execution); variable modifiers based on stats that change (a pain to keep
track of at tense moments); and fatigue. I'm sure there are others that
escape me at the moment. Now, I love tactical options in combat and some
measure of realism (if such a word can ever be logically applied to an
rpg), but things that involve extensive book-keeping get in the way (IMHO,
of course) of the excitement.
What I as a consumer would like to see is a simplified RQ based on
Basic Roleplay, a la Call of Cthulhu or Elric. (I think Loren proposed
something similar as RQ Lite) I don't think anyone will deny that these
are elegant games. The more bookkeeping-intensive elements could be
kept in an appendix to be added in modular fashion by those who like them.
2) Write the rule book in such a way that those of us who don't
want to play in Glorantha will have an easy time adapting it to our own
preferred settings. Don't get me wrong, Glorantha is a marvellous setting,
just not my preferred place to play. Wouldn't it be possible to have a
core rules section and then a section/supplement that explains how to
adapt these very flexible rules to the Gloranthan setting? I know
some people will scream that "RQ is *nothing* without Glorantha!" I
respectfully disagree. I think that RQ could very well be a successful
general fantasy game, with Glorantha being its special, but not only
world.
Well, that's all I wanted to say.More than anything else, though, I'd
like to see this dispute settled and work on RQ4 re-commenced with
renewed enthusiasm.
cheers!
--Anthony Ragan
ecz5rar@mvs.oac.ucla.edu -OR- IrishSpy@aol.com
Rune Chia Pet of Ernalda, Snotling in Chief
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From: argrath@aol.com
Subject: Several threads
Message-ID: <9404012027.tn340332@aol.com>
Date: 2 Apr 94 01:27:28 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 3492
David Dunham asks about the location of Wexten in Ralios. I
asked Greg Stafford about this at the RQ Con, and he said it was
too small to make the map. Put it where you want it.
James Polk says:
"As a player, I am quite ready to play these games with a GM who
tells me "That's the way fit is because my daddy said so." My
character's father is a god, who knows more than the GM's daddy,
so my "dagger" can too kill my foes at 50 paces without having to
touch them. :-) "
I know you're just joking, but there's an important point here.
In Gloranthan, Iron is a metal invented by Mostali. Period.
There is no periodic table. If there are discoverable and
testable rules comparable to physics and chemistry, nobody in
Glorantha knows them (or if they do, they're not telling). I
fail to see how someone who obviously accepts the power of magic
(or else you wouldn't play the game) refuses to accept red blood
that doesn't have iron in it.
Joerg says:
"Hashish, or anything else which makes "drunken", is forbidden to
the orthodox muslim as well."
Even at the level of generalization you're using ("orthodox
muslim," whatever that is), this is less than accurate. The
Prophet forbade alcohol. This prohibition was extended in
various historic times to various other substances by various
groups, but your blanket statement obscures more than it reveals.
But hey, it's an interesting argument. Now let's switch sides.
;-)
I said, hoping to stir up agitation and foment disorder:
>>As for Urox, I believe his emergence as a separate cult is a
>>second or third age development. The same with Humakt. Before
>>that, they were just what we would call subcults of Orlanth.
Sandy said:
> My failure to concur with this is unfortunately
>un-backed up by any evidence for the Bull. However, I submit
>that the tales of Arkat and his betrayal provide strong evidence
>for Humakt being a separate cult even at the dawn. Plus Humakt's
>own mythology, which places great weight on being separate from
>Orlanth.
My evidence for this (frankly inspired by the Elmal/Yelmalio
split) is as follows (and I'm not deeply attached to the idea, so
flame if you must):
A WF issue with the Sartar High Council, where Storm Bull was
clearly an Orlanth subcult. Theory here: early Chaosium thinking
reflects early Gloranthan history. Hey, what the hell.
Reference to a first age "Barntar" cult in the same sense that
Humakt/Urox are cults.
The fact that Zorak Zoran was the major war cult of the First
Theyalan Council. Unlikely if Humakt had been around, but it
explains why a later-emerging Humakt cult is so anti-ZZ. So two
theories from one bit of evidence--very parsimonious!
As for Arkat, one of his titles is Humaktson, but does he really
do anything Humakti-like? When the Humakt cult was casting
around for its history ("we know we left it here someplace"), it
naturally seized upon Arkat as a prestigious member.
Humakt's mythology certainly does place an emphasis on separation
from Orlanth. IMHO, this is a cultural artifact of the cult's
own separation from the Orlanth cult. People always put their
origins back further than they really are. I note in today's
Daily that Nick agrees with me.
Well, anyway, it makes an interesting theory for some Lhankor Mhy
scholar to propound (and have his thesis rejected for being too
God Learnerish).
General note:
Get a grip, people! This is a hobby, and a peculiar one at that.
If you write for it, expect to have none of what you write be
published. I have years of my work that hasn't been published,
but I keep at it because I enjoy doing it. I suggest everyone do
the same, and keep on sharing your ideas.
Charles Gregory Fried said something about that poll of U.S.
citizens regarding the existence of the Holocaust. It turns out
that that poll question was worded in a very confusing double
negative, something like, "Does it seem impossible that the
Holocaust might not have happened?" When responsible pollsters
did another poll, the percentage of Holocaust-doubters dropped
rather dramatically, to less than 1% if I remember correctly.
In any case, subjectivism is a good way of understanding current
cultural phenomena, and not a great tool for historical
revisionism. If anything, subjectivists are less likely to
engage in historical revisionism than ideologues of any other
stripe.
Post-modernism is an architectural movement. Spy magazine had a
good article a while back debunking the term, and last Sunday's
Washington Post had an article with people trying to define the
term and failing. One guy accused of being a post-modernist said
he hoped he wasn't one.
Sandy, I know you like trolls, and I agree that they shouldn't be
Barney-ized. One of my favorite troll PC's was a Gorakiki-
mosquito cultist who had a bronze mosquito mask with a long
proboscis that he used to suck blood out of his victims. In my
campaign, a troll hero killed several thousand humans at one time.
Cullen Grace:
The first part of your message of 31 Mar, 9:24 GMT, was cut off.
Can you send it again?
--Martin
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