From: RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RQ Digest Maintainer)
To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Daily automated RQ-Digest)
Reply-To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RuneQuest Daily)
Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Tue, 26 Jul 1994, part 1
Sender: Henk.Langeveld@Holland.Sun.COM
Content-Return: Prohibited
Precedence: junk
X-RQ-ID: Intro
This is the RuneQuest Daily Bulletin, a mailing list on
the subjects of Avalon Hill's RPG and Greg Stafford's
world of Glorantha. It is sent out once per day in digest
format.
More details on the RuneQuest Daily and Digest can be found
after the last message in this digest.
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From: 100102.3001@compuserve.com (Peter J. Whitelaw)
Subject: HQ
Message-ID: <940725101716_100102.3001_BHJ46-1@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 25 Jul 94 10:17:16 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5288
Jon Green says:
>Endorsed! Please, peeps, where's the material on HeroQuesting? GREG?
Well, I was at the Con and I am pleased to be able to tell you that Greg said
that he will write them 'next year' ;-)
All the best,
Peter
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From: SYS_RSH%PV0A@hobbes.cca.rockwell.com (Like, I wanna be a veterinarian, coz I luv children...)
Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Sun, 24 Jul 1994, part 1
Message-ID: <01HF49TG0N1E8Y5APU@hobbes.cca.rockwell.com>
Date: 25 Jul 94 04:24:02 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5289
ANDOVER@delphi.com:
hey, thanks for the Ambrose info! I knew it was there! (It's been
some 15 years since I read that.)
--Scott
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From: SYS_RSH%PV0A@hobbes.cca.rockwell.com (Like, I wanna be a veterinarian, coz I luv children...)
Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Sun, 24 Jul 1994, part 1
Message-ID: <01HF4AKTWSWY8Y5API@hobbes.cca.rockwell.com>
Date: 25 Jul 94 04:45:21 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5290
RobMH said
>It's a good story, but not one I could
>take extremely seriously. ... I'm sure a great many literate peoples
>(and even Europeans) were reading silently before the monk's
>illumination. Watcha think?
The dates I recall were late Dark Ages/Early Middle Ages, and applied
specifically to English. (But see post about St. Ambrose! 4th
century.) Other literate peoples may well have picked up on things
sooner, but I'm certain that it was a relatively late development in
Europe (which wasn't particularly literate at the time, at least
compared to modern life).
It does seem that one shouldn't have had such a problem reading
silently in Latin, but I don't recall if said monk was reading an
English or Latin version of the Bible. (I think it was English...he
was translating the book at the time.)
But then again...after 15 years, I could just be all wrong. :) It
does seem rather apochryphal.
--Scott
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From: SYS_RSH%PV0A@hobbes.cca.rockwell.com (Like, I wanna be a veterinarian, coz I luv children...)
Subject: Ogres ogres ogres...sounds like my boss! :)
Message-ID: <01HF4AN7VVLU9365GA@hobbes.cca.rockwell.com>
Date: 25 Jul 94 04:47:16 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5291
Actually, uh, I, uh, don't exactly play ogres as written...I, uh,
well, play them as parthenogenetic females (and still Chaotic) with
only a very occasionaly male popping up. Doesn't do much for
feminism in Sun County, I can tell you.....
--Scott
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From: RobMH@aol.com
Subject: Sandy's Mr. Man
Message-ID: <9407251045.tn132762@aol.com>
Date: 25 Jul 94 14:45:47 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5292
Sandy,
I just got around to reading "Mr. Man Speaks." A wonderful piece, thanks for
sharing. Seems likely that the PCs were somewhat cowed.
Have you read Laura Bohannon's essay "Shakespeare in the Bush," in which the
anthropologist's attempt to tell the 'universal' story of Hamlet runs into a
very crossed-cultural reinterpretation?
--Rob Heinsoo
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From: SYS_RSH%PV0A@hobbes.cca.rockwell.com (Like, I wanna be a veterinarian, coz I luv children...)
Subject: Eh....
Message-ID: <01HF4ARM1V5U8Y59FO@hobbes.cca.rockwell.com>
Date: 25 Jul 94 04:50:48 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5293
how about
non-human Cacodemon cultists? An elf ogre would consume elves,
etc.
And a troll ogre would be...ordinary. :)
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From: niwe@ppvku.ericsson.se (Nils Weinander)
Subject: Not very much today
Message-ID: <9407251712.AA07341@ppvku.ericsson.se>
Date: 25 Jul 94 21:12:23 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5294
Pam wrote (in a very good summary of Yelorna across the Lozenge):
>So, Nils, does Teshnos have a Yelornan counterpart?
Most likely in my opinion. The Genertela book says that both Teshnos and
Kralorela have set up female-only companies to fight the Trowjang amazon
raiders because of fear of what the amazons might do to captured males.
The Tesnos women fighters would probably be Yelornans, of the Noon caste
in my terminology. Since they have the specific purpose of fighting raiders
they are probably highly trained, warlike and very mobile killing machines.
(Which on the other hand doesn't work well with the general sloth of the
teshnans, hmm...)
_____
Rob Heinsoo writes:
>Which God or Goddess do you identify with most? If you were a Gloranthan
>avatar of yourself, which cult do you think you would belong to?
I'd probably be e really lousy Lhankor Mhy, but my foremost admiration
goes to the Humakti.
_____
David Dunham's Vinga story:
Wonderful story!
_____
Some weeks ago I posted something weird on runes in Kralorela. I have read
the comments and will write some more on it when I have more time. Thanks
for the input, Joerg et al.
_____
/Nils W
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From: raphael@research.canon.oz.au (Andrew Raphael)
Subject: Re: There is trouble in the Forest
Message-ID: <199407251757.AA26192@mama.research.canon.oz.au>
Date: 26 Jul 94 13:57:01 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5295
paul@phyast.pitt.edu (Paul Reilly) writes:
>When a swatch of forest is burned, some plants are harmed, others reap
>various benefits. Fire is a natural part of the forest's life cycle.
>Some plants breeding cycles are connected with fires (any more info on
>this, anyone? Sandy?)
I remember making a comment in passing about this a few days after
the Sydney bushfires. You need a different sort of forest, of course.
I understand Californians have learnt the hard way not to build houses
too close to eucalypts. Australians have to re-learn it every so often.
You could use May Gibbs "Big Bad Banksia Men" for the Aldryami or runners
of such a forest. Blackened, multi-mouthed, & covered in coarse spines.
You may ignore Snugglepot & Cuddlepie. Unless you want to be really
nasty & use them as pixies.
Don't forget the platypuses in the river, either.
>Sumac Aldryami: Of course, that's just what an Oakie WOULD say.
>Fire is natural. If the Oakies suppress natural fires, it's our duty
>to compensate.
Damn straight. :-) Those Oakies are upsetting the ecosystem! Burn 'em!
Burn 'em!
I'm not familiar with sumac. Is that "poison oak"?
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From: DevinC@aol.com
Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Mon, 25 Jul 1994, part 1
Message-ID: <9407251529.tn144436@aol.com>
Date: 25 Jul 94 19:29:38 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5296
Devin Cutler here:
Regarding avatars, I would be a worshipper of Seven Mothers or of Etyries in
specific. Little on Glorantha, IMO, compares with the freedom that Lunars
have, especially to advance in society.
That and I prefer civilization to to the wilds.
Regards,
Devin Cutler
devinc@aol.com
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From: alex@dcs.gla.ac.uk (Alex `I Conned@dcs.gla.ac.uk, We Won' Ferguson)
Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Mon, 25 Jul 1994, part 1
Message-ID: <9407252204.AA25659@hawaii.dcs.gla.ac.uk>
Date: 25 Jul 94 22:04:51 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5297
Hi.
Been quiet without us, I see. ;-)
Alex.
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From: bchugg@leland.stanford.edu (Barron Chugg)
Subject: Initiation et al.
Message-ID: <199407252315.QAA07532@popserver.Stanford.EDU>
Date: 25 Jul 94 08:17:27 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5298
Hello All.
_____________________
Kevin:
> A point people seem to miss about initation in Glorantha is that
>it is more than what happens on earth....
> ...Normally, it's not really dangerous if you
>meet the qualifications. If you are playing games however. . .
Good point and one I had not completely considered. I agree that
initiation is more mystical than portrayed in the rules ("Ya pays ya money
and ya gets ya benefits...") and the mystical side should be more
emphasised.
On the particular example, maybe in the third age initiation _has_ become
more mundane and less mystical.
>Normally, meeting the skill requirements is just the minimum necessary.
Yeah, good point. Becoming a RLvl should not be like getting into
college. Many other influences should be considered. How well has the
initiate served the cult? How many times (if any) have they received
divine intervention (a sure sign of divine favor)? Have they donated
anything of note to the cult? Have they gone on any pilgramiges or
whatever?
___________________
Michelle:
> I like this idea generally.
Why thank you.
> A few comments. Arriving ahead
> of time for a worship service in terms of days seems odd to
> me.
My thinking was that there are many "pre-rituals" that the general public
is not welcome at (cult secrets if you will). Also there are probably
physical preparations to be made (grunt work, but sacred grunt work). Then
again, there is time for the priests to interact with and observe the
candidate.
> Also, I prefer that a PCs
> direction/adventuring comes at the behest of the cult.
This is one of the main ways to keep the PCs in close touch with their
cult. Also it gives the priests a chance to test the applicant some more.
_______________________
Robert M:
>The Barron quills:
But it is not necessary to refer me to "your excellency". }:-)>
>The only difficulty I can find with this is its removal of scope for those
>future heroquesters.
Yeah, I see you argument. My ideas work best in a smaller, local scale.
Where the PCs are fixed in a given communicty/culture. For more world
spanning games (or any game of "homeless wanderers") you'll want a more
relaxed set of criteria. Since your PCs are not focused on initiathood and
stuff, I'd just stick with the standard rules.
> Most characters *don't* want to become high priest!!
I think that _any_ rune level is a powerful and important position within
a community and thus should be chosen carefully. You don't have to have
aspirations _that_ high in order to be tested.
> So saying, I think it is
>important to allow potential heroes the ability to bypass all this cult-related
>sitting-in-the-temple stuff, and get them out there.
As a sort of aside, I agree. Often heroes are the people that are able
to exist outside of their society and, maybe even challenge the societies
beliefs. I just can't imagine that these people make up the majority of RQ
characters.
>I'm not saying that a good roleplay of some pretty "mundane" holy days is not
>useful or fun; but not the 20-25% of the time!
Well, I doubt anyone roleplays a priest PC's 90% time in temple business.
I mean, that would be awfully boring. But the 20% can give the GM a
chance to impart "hidden knowlege" to the character, as well as giving the
player and character a better view of how the cult works and what rituals
look like. (Reference Jeorg's comments about defining cult rituals.)
>So, while some more rules about orthodox cult progression paths are needed,
>remember (IMHO) that there can always be some who will do it by a different
>way.
There should always be ways to bypass set progression. I just don't
think that it should be the norm to do so.
> Instead of holding up the left elbow of the 8th assistant priest to the
>chief-sub priest, let the heroes investigate who put the red wine in the
>alter cup instead of the "blood of humackt" two hours before the ceremony
>(while the chief priest was praying to it! :-)
I think that they can do both. That's a great start for a scenerio,
though. Here's the candidate trying to help out one priest while all hell
is breaking loose in the background and he has to deal with the hell _and_
carry out his role in the ceremony (lest baaaaaad things happen). Great
premis...
Your main point is good: that these are not for every campaign. When I
think about RQ I tend to think locally. If someone else is thinking in a
broader context then these ideas would be something of a problem. I guess
you could get around them by saying the itinerant adventurers _are_
fulfilling some special role in the cult ecology and are thus treated
differently. I don't think that this would be stretching it much for most
cults.
--------
Looking forward to Convulsion reports...
Barron
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From: kchrist1@students.wisc.edu (Kent E. Christensen)
Subject: Magazines with RQ Stuff
Message-ID:
Date: 25 Jul 94 16:22:19 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5299
Does anyone know off-hand which Different Worlds, White Dwarf, and White Wolf
magazines contain RQ info? (I am assuming that all issues of Heroes and
Wyrm's footnotes do.) Please e-mail a respnose, as I do not subscribe to
this list.
Thanks,
Kent
kchrist1@students.wisc.edu
---------------------
From: ddunham@radiomail.net (David Dunham)
Subject: Vinga
Message-ID: <199407260358.AA14068@radiomail.net>
Date: 26 Jul 94 03:58:24 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5300
Ahem, apparently "How Vinga Joined Orlanth's Household" was in fact told by
a Sartarite storyteller who'd learned it in Ralios. In East Ralios, Elmal
is Orlanth's loyal housecarl -- "thane" is a title reserved for clan
chiefs.
In the "Adventures in Glorantha" draft, Vinga is mentioned as a subcult of
Orlanth (this doesn't necessarily mean Greg thinks this is so). I'd been
running it this way, but now that mine is the second myth in which Vinga
dances, I've thought about changing the requirements slightly. It's still
an Orlanth subcult.
Skills: Compose, Dance, Drive Chariot, Orate, Religion (Orlanth), Ritual,
Weapon, World Lore
Virtues: Energetic, Generous, Just, Proud, Valorous.
Cult Magic: Bladesharp, Demoralize, Glamour, Heal, Mindspeech, Mobility,
Protection, Strength.
Wind Ladies: 18 in Sword and three of Awareness, Battle, Dance, Drive
Chariot, Oratory, Riding, Stealth, Weapon. In addition, the temple will
assign another skill which should be mastered. This is sometimes one of the
preceding, but may be Speak Darktongue, Swimming, Plant Lore, or any other
skill the temple has need for.
Wind Lady Divine Magic: Bless Woad, Command Sylph, Enchant Iron, Flight,
Sanctify, Shield, Summon Sylph, Wind Run, Wind Words, Worship Vinga.
I figure the subcult doesn't have priestesses, only rune ladies (and MAYBE
acolytes). Anyone have a better name for them?
---------------------
From: john.hughes@anu.edu.au (John P Hughes)
Subject: Non-Convulsion Sulking
Message-ID: <9407260644.AA11952@cscgpo.anu.edu.au>
Date: 27 Jul 94 02:39:49 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5301
RANDOM INSULTS
Howdy folks. Been off-line a few weeks, up country in a
realm where the RQ Digest is yet to penetrate. It was a
little strange to realise even in the 20 and quite a bit-th
century, there are areas of the globe free from Alex's
quiping and Joerg's learned (and lengthy) refutations. :-)
Do you realise how many pages 6 weeks of the Digest covers
when you print it out, even in 7 point, twin column? Spooky.
Henk, when can we expect the on-line, interactive Index? :-)
Eroded, Son of Rock, thank you very much for your answers
on Doraddi lineages. Great stuff. I'll be in touch.
Joerg, I was quite taken by your Heortland material. Damned
fine, as we've come to expect from you. Give the man an iron
breastplate! Liked the background material a lot, but I
wonder if it might be worth adding a little more unique
detail to the fairly generic Celto/Germanic cultural base.
This isn't a criticism, it's just that apart from the spiritual
imperatives, it might have been Ralios or Far Point as much
as Heortland.
Thanks to those who made kind comments about my Alda
Chur Festival material. (yes, I know, this is Ancient History
by Digest standards. Doubtless soon we'll have commentary
from Nick Brooke). As to my comment about Gargarth being
tribal God of the Vantaros, I have to admit I queried that
myself as I printed out my notes. Maybe I meant Odayla.
"Course personally, nothing about those traitorous, Lunar-
licking, pseudo-Solar, sheep-loving Vantaros would surprise
ME. I KNOW what they get up to in their steads on Godday.
Interbred with Tusk Riders most of them. And the things
that Harvar Ironfist says about us clean-living Orlanthi in
the hills. Him and his toadying lackey, that Divad Llah. The
shame of it all. I went to Alda Chur once, you know they have
public urinals? Everyone just sits around on the marble
thrones gossipping and admiring the statuary. Public Urinals!
Plus they TAKE THEIR CLOTHES OFF TO GO TO BED! Some
things are just beyond public decency. I tell you..."
Thank you Tarful Thunderstone. We shall resume normal
transmissions soon as the fault has been taken outside and
beaten to a pulp.
Which reminds me...
WORSHIPPERS ARE REQUESTED TO REFRAIN FROM BRAWLING
IN THE HOLY OF HOLIES. PLEASE DO NOT SPIT ON THE ALTAR.
(Sign in the Ironspike Wind Temple).
HUMAKTI POTTERY
Lord of the Long Road
Humakt, Name-Quester
Cut short my days, destroy me.
God of the Great Silence
Bronze-Dyer, Illusion Render
Betray my hope, destroy me.
Wielder of the Truth that cuts
the pain that frees
Destroy me once, destroy me twice
till only you remain.
Great Ironbroker of corpses,
StraightWill, Terrible Secret
I do not claim to judge you
to proclaim, 'this is just' or 'this is evil'
for you alone know Truth.
I know only to obey
surrender to your sharp command
that I may walk the long road, hear the silence
and free me from myself.
For all I have is death, and company of swords
to lift the weight of falsehood from my soul.
Let fortune dye our blades blood red
that we may suffer, suffer into truth.
Let us maintain the watch against
diversion and falsehood
And guard ourselves against the coming of heroes.
The Dawn Muster.
Don't worry, I haven't given up my day job.
SOME DORADDI RIDDLES
This is by way of consolation for those of us who didn't
make it to Convulsion. Of course, those of you who did are
welcome to try as well, but wait until the hangover fades
first.
As the background is relatively unfamiliar to many, most of
these riddles are about everyday life and objects rather than
mythology.
Answers soon!
1. A white hut without door or windows; goodness and life
within.
2. My hut has no fire, no lamp. The door is closed.
3. The one who fights slowly.
4. A chief who sits among thorns.
5. My mother's hut with one supporting post; healing, eating
and lineage within.
6. Five hunting dogs go into the same hole.
7. Going I found it, returning I found it not.
8. Our great bull rubs the reeds on Banini Lake.
9. The tree moves; fruits out of season.
10. Two little holes that devour all: only spirits do not go
there.
11. Plants make it: good to eat. red below, black in middle,
white on top.
12. The little animal that comes fiercely: when it reaches
the path of its mate, the fierceness departs.
13. She carries her belly on her back.
14. The walker gives birth to the non-walker: the non-
walker to the walker.
15. It digs about the deserted village: it sees things that are
no longer there.
Hint: 4 & 6 are somehow linked. 13 is very difficult. 7 would
only be true in certain seasons of the year.
One more that is really difficult, because I've forgotten the
answer (0 INT). {insert gratuitous Homerism: 'Duhh!'}.
Suggestions most welcome for:
?? Keraun comes and the children dance; the mother does not
dance.
CAMPAIGNING IN ALONE
Someone asked for information on Northern Sartar,
specifically Alone. Here are some notes of mine on the gors
and gallt (forest and marsh) of Far Point. Hopefully lots
more coming soon via Codex.
"The elements reign here in frightful and eternal combat,
and spirits and other immortal creatures seem plentiful;
though for the most part shy and unobtrusive. Even so, it is
not a fit place for civilised man. The country, though quite
varied in character, either bristles with forests or is foul
with swamp, and is constantly chilled by great troll magics.
The trees are older than time, and exceed all marvels with
their limitless age and size. Hills are raised up where roots
collide. There are no roads or villages, but isolated steads
joined by treacherous and winding trails. Horses and other
pack beasts are of no assistance in the hills and marshes.
The heights are remarkable for beasts of chase: stag, roe,
spreadhorn and horned boar. It is rumoured that fearful
aurochs still haunt the wilder parts of the forest. Moreover,
a fair sufficiency of otter, alynx, and polecat, which in hard
winter are caught by traps, snares, and other devices. On
account of the great rain, the entire country is dotted with
rivers, mires and marshes. Therein are netted innumerable
eels, snapping turtles and large water wolves, with
pickerals, roaches, burbots and lampreys, which we call
watersnakes, and sometimes salmon. From these products is
made a fearsome fish sauce called blackburn or sticklepick,
famed in more civilised climes but wholly repugnant to me
after viewing the manner of its manufacture."
Jaxarte Whyded
The Journey through Far Point.
STEPHEN MARTIN'S NEIGBOURS - ELECTRONIC LIFE IN
CONCORD CA?
Are there any Digest Internet surfers who reside in
reasonable proximity to Stephen Martin? Concord California
that is. (Is that in SanFran or what?)
I need to get some files to Steve fairly quickly (tick tick
tick...) and would be really grateful if there was someone in
the area who could download and print a bin-hexed Macintosh
Compact Pro archive of Microsoft Word (or, even better Pagemaker
4.0/5.0) files for delivery to Steve. About 50 pages in all.
Yes I know he has his own electronic address, but this
exercise is a little technical.
If there is someone who can help, please e-mail me. By way
of consolation, the file is a complete draft of a Sartarite
novella, and you're welcome to keep a copy.
MORE POTTERY
Men appear with shining weapons,
The birds of battle screech.
The grey wolf howls, the spear rattles,
Shield answers shaft. The Red Moon trembles
On her way below the clouds:
Sword points,
gleaming,
dipped in blood.
Evil deeds will now be done
Provoking pitched battle.
Awaken death-keen warriors!
Far Point arise!
grasp shields, gird yourselves
Step forward and be brave!
The Call of Starbrow.
See Ya Later Mates, and other gratuitous Ockerisms (for
cultural identity is such a fragile thing, as the Dark Troll
said to the broo).
John.
---------------------