Nick Brooke wrote:
>
> Jeff wrote:
>
> > Yes, you only get ONE ruleset. You can't do the others. If you start
> > using the others, you have to join that magic set and leave your
> > previous one. I thnk this is covered in the rules under Magic and
> > changing systems.
>
> Er... page ref? I'm lost.
I seem to recall ths
> > I think that it means that there are some supposed theists who practice
> > animist magics. The Kolati are *accepted* shamen
> ^^^^^^
> (No such thing as "accepted shamen" when I'm proof-reading!)
>
Whatever... =)
> > and spirit talkers in the normally Theistic Orlanthi way of life. I
> suspect
> > that their clansmen help out at ceremonies and get some benefits of their
> > spiritual powers.
>
> They could gain them themselves as attributes/feats through "misapplied
> sacrifice" if the clansman is a theist worshipper; or (much more commonly)
> the Kolating Spirit-Talker could ask his spirits to do their spirit stuff
> (with fetches and fetishes and integrations etc.) at the behest of his
> theistic friends. What's clear to me is that there is no such thing as a
> Theistic worshipper with properly-obtained Animist magic.
Apparently, though, the Kolati are practicing Animists. NOT Theists. No misapplied worship, though they probaly would get missapplied Orlanti spirits and the like. Lord Snow, in the example, could be an aspect of Valind, frex.
> And the quote on HW p.167 talks about theists who practice *both* sacrifice
> *and* ecstatic worship. Theistic cultures, yep. Individual theists, never.
> If it's not your magic rule set, it's misapplied. No multi-class
That's how I figure it.
> sorcerer/shaman/priests in Glorantha. (Sorcerers with expensively developed
> spells which duplicate shamanic and priestly powers, yes. Sorcerous cultures
> venerating non-sorcerous entities as if they were saints (etc.), certainly.
> But *not* sorcerers who possess affinities and spirits alongside their
> grimoires and spells).
Yep. I seem to rcall there *are* rules for this but it could be Rules Version Confusion. But I do recall that you can only use one set of worldview without something dramatic happening like being enlightened or a Godlearner.
> > I think the person would have changed their belief cycle and started over
> > again. No otherworld penalties for the new system but the old one might
> > as well have never been -- or worse, would have a mad on for our
> > apostate.
>
> Yep. Is there a page reference for doing this?
Its in the magic section. Under changing system.s But I could be wrong.
> > IF he's changed systems, no. If he's just 'misapplied' then yes.
> > A theist, even missapplied anismist worship, is still a theist.
> > You have to make a complete break.
>
> That sounds right to me. And it is *possible* to make a complete break; and
> in doing so you lose every magical power from your previous system (possibly
> this is the only "Hero Point cost" for changing systems, BTW). The only
> thing that carries through is your inability to learn more than one
> Secret -- if you learned a Saint's Secret as a sorcerer, you can't change
> systems and learn any other Secret.
>
> > Yes, you can change magic systems. its rough to do though. Its called
> > Illumination or enlightemment. Or being one of those wacky Lunars.
>
> Page references, please. It seems to me more likely that the Lunars have a
> belief system encompassing all the systems, rather than that they can
> routinely exploit more than one of them.
Nick, Nick, I don't have a copy of the rules that has *page numbers* on it. Just a galley copy.
> > Or, they are what they are. The Animist perception of the great sun
> > spirit and the theist perception of the Glorious Yelm.
>
> (Or Elmal).
>
> Yep, that would work for me.
I try to be an objectivist rather than a 'one true sun' type/
> >> BTW, how do you create a Misapplied Worshipper during character
> >> generation? Is it as simple as just dividing the standard ability
> >> values for every "misapplied" ability by two (or three, depending)?
>
> > You can do it by saying you do it.
>
> Of course I can say I do it. Does the fact that misapplied powers are meant
> to be more expensive than normal ones mean that my starting ability values
> for misapplied abilities are appropriately reduced? ISTM that this should be
> stated explicitly.
Yeah. There's no cost for getting a missapplied worship at start, but increasing it is going to be expensive. of course, a narrator could give you that magic keyword at only a 13 if you were very concerned about the points it costs. I don't bother myself, and make sure they pay for it in otherways -- like extra hp cost and perhaps more time spent to get the effect.
> > There are a few examples in the text which can serve. I like the St.
> > Tarurox (i think), the Sorcerous version of Storm Bull/ Urox. They are
> > just plain wonky.
>
> Page reference?
Ah, that's something someone wrote up elsewhere as an example of missapplied worship of Stormbull. It amused me no end. Its not in the HW rules, I suspect. I rather guess it was deleted from the examples.
Jeff
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