More spoilers ahead.
>Thanks for the advice!
No problem. I've gained a lot more help here than I've given.
>> Making sure that you have a lot of clan magic might help - not
>>sure, but probably having 0 or negative is bad. <g>
>
>Is simply having a lot of clan magic a "good thing" in general, even if
>unspent? We can't prove it, but when we've had 10+, and especially on
>those rare occasions of 20+ or 30+, held in reserve, things generally seem
>to go well. Then again, the fact that we have that much in reserve attests
>to the fact that matters were already going well, so it's hard to say.
I'm not sure, but I have noticed a few differences - I suspect there's some effect, but I'm not sure how much.
>> I don't normally TRY to hero-quest for the first ten years of
>>the game. It's much more important to me to explore, make friends,
>>increase my population and wealth and gain treasures. After THAT, I
>>begin hero-questing. If you need Ernalda Feeds The Tribe that early,
>>you might be doing something wrong, like trying to grow too quickly.
>>What's the rush?
>
> From comments others made on the list (in the archive), we'd come under
>the impression that it was expected. Our expectations have been revised,
>and we feel less incompetent. 8)
Don't feel incompetent at all! The way it's set up, KoDP has a steep learning curve - learning the seasons, learning where (and how and when) to explore, learning which deities are worth worshipping, learning how to give proper answers to Orlanthi problems - I STILL tend to give women the choice of whom they marry, despite the fact that even they seem to despise me for it. Oh, well.
Say, just a thought, but you ARE aware that even just knowing the details of the legend, you're supposed to actually follow them...right? You go to the symbol of the parent teaching the child, go to the legend in question, and click on the circle that's been filled in (at least, if you have knowledge of that heroquest). If you know the secret version of the heroquest - I've learned four in one game! - you'll see some sections highlighted as being very important. Look especially for decisions and statements made by the god you're emulating, and DO THESE THINGS in the quest. It took me the longest time to realize that I was supposed to just take the damage the biting things were giving me in the Uralda quest - I thought you were SUPPOSED to end up in limbo. Boy, did I feel stupid when someone told me how to read the legend...
>Ah-ha! One of the things we have -no- feel for yet is how hard or easy
>the various quests are.
Hmm, let's see: in my experience:
Lhankor Mhy Finds the Truth: Easy if you have a strong fighter to bring with you; moderate if you have to ask the gods for help. Pretty much anybody can succeed at this one with a good enough fighter (renowned+) backing them up.
Ernalda Feeds the Tribe: Moderate-Difficult; make sure you have a good leadership so you can convince the gods to help you. That's pretty much all you need, but the fact that your quester has to be female cuts down on the available candidates like you wouldn't believe.
Uralda: Very hard, requires leadership and combat ability (and probably 'animals' as well - this might actually replace leadership or combat; I admit to not using this one that much) - can kill your hero-quester or get her lost in limbo.
Orlanth Versus Aroka: Easy; accept the help of the Storm Bull and do what he says, and make sure your character has as high a Combat ranking as possible. Around 'renowned' you have nothing to fear. Even at lower levels you can succeed, and this quest is quite short.
The Making of The Storm Tribe: Moderate. You need to follow the details of the legend - not that it's a good idea to vary from them in ANY of the quests. With exceptional fighting ability, you can do this even if you're not Orlanthi - I sometimes send Humakti if I have 'em. With a good enough Leadership, you can also use the 'direct the others' in the end, which reduces your chance of being hurt even more.
Humakt: Difficult. There's so much to deal with here - you need a high combat and a high leadership to deal with Orlanth (and the undead!) so much. A high leadership also helps at the beginning to get the sword from Eurmal - I especially love doing it by asking him politely, because it's just so funny to see him think it through. <g>
Elmal Guards the Stead: Hard. You need exceptional levels of combat, and at least a good level of leadership. This is a long quest, and you're expected to get mauled three times during it. OW! Watch the temptation to give of clan magic - if you do so for all three times, you're likely to end up with -12 magic. Giving of tears seems to work just as well - although I admit to being a little worried in general. If you can get past the three attacks, you're fine - assuming you have the leadership to deal with the bringer of lies. Follow the legend when you do this one - there is no possible way to succeed otherwise.
Issaries: Easy. You need bargaining and leadership for this one, and it's a lot easier to bring in helpers with you, but not really required, either. Bring a treasure you can afford to lose - I reccomend doing the Orlanth and Aroka heroquest just to get a treasure, then trading it in this one. Don't be afraid to ask the poor villagers for a treasure! Sure, it's cruel, but it's a GOOD treasure - and you can have several of them, which means you can trade 'em for other treasures. DO NOT try to trade the villager's treasure to the long-toothed people. Actually, except for getting the board of nails and the cat's eye out of this, this is one of the less useful heroquests IMO - there's not much to be gained here. Sure, you can make one of your nobles into a shrewd bargainer, but I prefer to have huge masses of wealth instead, which means I don't need to worry about exact figures.
>> Making a tribe doesn't require you to have a good leader ...
>
>We caught on to the "don't have to be king right away" bit; the "snowball's
>chance" referred to the Storm Tribe heroquest.
Oh, I see. You don't need to send an Orlanthi; just someone with high combat and leadership. And actually, leadership isn't too important; if you wait for Ernalda to bring the regalia (this is recommended anyways, as I've never seen it fail and it's what the legend suggests) all you really need to do is lead the battle.
>> You really don't need to send a good fighter/bargainer - just
>>a bargainer will do. Just send 30 warriors with him, and try not to
>>do it in the spring or fall - nobody has ever touched me when I sent 1
>>weaponthane and 30 warriors. It also doesn't get the weaponthanes off
>>patrols. I could probably send a lot fewer and still not get
>>attacked, but I've never tested it.
>
>We hadn't tried that tactic... after all, "Fire" season is "Raid" season,
>so we've always raided out pet whipping-clan. Time to give it a shot!
I prefer to raid during Storm season - and even then, I prefer not to raid very often, say once every 2-3 years, just to make sure I don't lose my edge. Raiding your neighbours builds up a lot of bad feelings for when you want to build a tribe. Raiding them too much means they move away. I don't really want more land, as I'm struggling to keep the population I have now; I'm more interested in strong, friendly neighbours.
But different people have different strategies, and this is also how I play a lot of other games. <g>
>A related question: we had the Raven Banner once, and eventually traded it
>away. Call us cowards (and any good Humakti will 8) but we wanted to know
>in advance whose life we were going to throw away. It's the rare battle
>that's worth the life of your finest warleader; but I think we might have
>been willing to sacrifice a generic weaponthane every now and then. (How
>callous.... 8)
As far as I'm aware, you lose a single warrior (carl or cottar), not a weaponthane or noble. I don't mind the Raven Banner as much as the ones that can disappear after use, such as the Burning Standard.
Dave
"Let me get this straight - you don't have a skill for wedgies, but a noogie is d12 initiative?" -Keith, 02/01/01
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