From: owner-runequest-rules@ (RuneQuest Rules Digest) To: runequest-rules-digest@lists.MPGN.COM Subject: RuneQuest Rules Digest V1 #82 Reply-To: runequest-rules@mpgn.com Sender: owner-runequest-rules@ Errors-To: owner-runequest-rules@ Precedence: bulk RuneQuest Rules Digest Wednesday, April 22 1998 Volume 01 : Number 082 RuneQuest is a trademark of Avalon Hill Games. All Rights Reserved. TABLE OF CONTENTS [RQ-RULES] Cwim, Swapping Weapons RE: [RQ-RULES] Cwim, Swapping Weapons [RQ-RULES] Cwim, Swapping Weapons [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range [RQ-RULES] New Sorcery Spell [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range Re: [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range RE: [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range RE: [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range RE: [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range [RQ-RULES] Boost Damage [RQ-RULES] Tap INT RE: [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range RE: [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range RULES OF THE ROAD 1. Do not include large sections of a message in your reply. Especially not to add "Yeah, I agree" or "No, I disagree." Or be excoriated. If someone writes something good and you want to say "good show" please do. But don't include the whole message you praise. 2. Use an appropriate Subject line. 3. Learn the art of paraphrasing: Don't just quote and comment on a point-by-point basis. 4. No anonymous posting, please. Don't say something unless you're ready to stand by it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:10:46 +0000 From: "Simon Phipp" Subject: [RQ-RULES] Cwim, Swapping Weapons Bob Stancliffe on Cwim: > Direct frontal attack is stupid, the only way to beat him is > attrition. Every time he spits a monster or throws a gorp you kill > that and drag the spit monsters away so that he can't reabsorb them. > Eventually he will lose enough size that he becomes attackable or > starves. Or else he casts Mobility and chases those really slow bison around Prax. He can use Endurance to keep his Fatigue levels up. On Pektok and STR training: > Cute, but once your character starts, raised stats, gifts, and > chaos > features do not change your trainable limits. They did in RQ2. > This rule was intended to reduce the ability of bound spirits. > It > forced free Int to be assigned for targeting spells. > > Fetches have at least as much autonomy as allied spirits, even if > they have different powers. They should be able to cast spells on > the shaman. But, I play the Fetch as being the Shaman on the Spirit Plane, not a as a separate spirit. Why can the shaman suddenly cast two lots of spells? Loren Miller: > I simplified the roolz so that the difference between the > skills was in how many skill-use checkmarks you needed before you > got an experience roll and d6 increase. This does work really well - I used it in my campaign. James Bickmeyer: > I can't remember who, but someone said they have experienced their players > changing weapons just to get the checks. > >I too have experienced the problem of players switching weapons in the >middle >of combat, to just get that check mark. Ho, ho. This happened in our multi-GM campaign, especially with Trog the Minotaur who used 2 weapons and went "RH Attack, LH Parry, next round LH Attack RH Parry, next round change and hope he survives, repeat". He used to try it when Berserk but we shouted him down. Fortunately he had an INT of 8 or something similar and hardly ever made a skill increase so we humoured him. Simon Phipp *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:25:03 +0100 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Cwim, Swapping Weapons >> ..chaos features do not change your trainable limits. >They did in RQ2. >But, I play the Fetch as being the Shaman on the Spirit Plane, not >a as a separate spirit. Why can the shaman suddenly cast two lots >of spells? Because his mind and spirit have been expanded? Anyway, if you want to hark back to the 'good' old days of RQ2, a fetch was explicitly summoned as a pre-existing spirit with it's own INT and POW, rather than being created by the Shaman from his own POW. philip.hibbs@tnt.co.uk or phibbs@compuserve.com http://members.tripod.com/~PhilHibbs/ A single death is a tragedy a million deaths are a statistic Josef Stalin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 08:21:44 -0500 From: stancliff@commnections.com Subject: [RQ-RULES] Cwim, Swapping Weapons RU>> Fetches have at least as much autonomy as allied spirits, even if RU>> they have different powers. They should be able to cast spells on RU>> the shaman. RU>But, I play the Fetch as being the Shaman on the Spirit Plane, not a RU>as a separate spirit. Why can the shaman suddenly cast two lots of RU>spells? The split personality was a side effect of the second INT stat. Your way a shaman doubles his INT and get the ability to have unlimited POW with no restriction or penalty, except that the fetch can't throw spells. Several rules including how to ally spirit cults get thrown out the window because the fetch no longer has it's own personality. Bob Stancliff (Stancliff@commnections.com) (http://commnections.com/upgrades) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 17:42:31 +0100 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range I feel that there is a need for two types of ranged spell: Those that are fully ranged, ie they stop working when the target is out of range, and those that are ranged when cast, but are not limited by range thereafter. At present, all ranged spells are in the former category. This is fair enough for spells like Dominate, it would be unreasonable to be able to dominate a wolf at 10m range, and have it run to the next town and eat someone. However, is it right that if you Palsy an opponent, then run away, that they can instantly get up and run after you? Or that you cannot Haste your companion so that they can run quickly to the other side of town with a message? philip.hibbs@tnt.co.uk or phibbs@compuserve.com http://members.tripod.com/~PhilHibbs/ A single death is a tragedy a million deaths are a statistic Josef Stalin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 18:51:41 +0100 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: [RQ-RULES] New Sorcery Spell This is a new spell that a character in my campaign created. Lightning Bolt (instant) This spell produces a bolt of lightning from the sorceror's hand, which will cause 1 hp damage per point of Intensity, minus one per three meters of distance to the target. Range does not affect this spell. If there is no target to 'ground' the bolt, the caster takes the full Intensity in damage to his hand. Note that the target does not need to be 'grounded' in the literal (electrical) sense, a bird flying is a valid target. If the sorceror can see a Projected sense, he may safely target this unless the origination of the sense is non-corporeal. No MP resistance roll is necessary, and metal armor will not protect. Does anyone want me to post the other new spell "Scrying Enchantment" from my web page? philip.hibbs@tnt.co.uk or phibbs@compuserve.com http://members.tripod.com/~PhilHibbs/ A single death is a tragedy a million deaths are a statistic Josef Stalin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 14:18:48 -0500 From: stancliff@commnections.com Subject: [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range RU>I feel that there is a need for two types of ranged spell: Those that are RU>fully ranged, ie they stop working when the target is out of range, and RU>those that are ranged when cast, but are not limited by range thereafter. At RU>present, all ranged spells are in the former category. This is fair enough RU>for spells like Dominate, it would be unreasonable to be able to dominate a RU>wolf at 10m range, and have it run to the next town and eat someone. RU>However, is it right that if you Palsy an opponent, then run away, that they RU>can instantly get up and run after you? Or that you cannot Haste your RU>companion so that they can run quickly to the other side of town with a RU>message? My personal feeling is that the effect of a ranged spell is centered on the target, not the caster, and travels with them when they leave the casting range. The effect should remain on the target until the duration ends because that is where the locus of magical force is. Why shouldn't you be able to Dominate someone for a week, and command them to go to the next town to get something? It is a very powerful spell and should have that level of ability. It should also be rated Hard and take lots of time to improve, plus, dominating a sentient should be considered evil. Don't bother arguing that under Sandy's rules, the spell is effectively permanent, Presence should never have been invented. By removing the need to manipulate Duration, the spells that can be cast are much more powerful, and I feel that they are too powerful. IMO Bob Stancliff (Stancliff@commnections.com) (http://commnections.com/upgrades) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:25:07 GMT From: "Nikk Effingham" Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range > I feel that there is a need for two types of ranged spell: Those that are > fully ranged, ie they stop working when the target is out of range, and > those that are ranged when cast, but are not limited by range thereafter. At > present, all ranged spells are in the former category. This is fair enough > for spells like Dominate, it would be unreasonable to be able to dominate a > wolf at 10m range, and have it run to the next town and eat someone. > However, is it right that if you Palsy an opponent, then run away, that they > can instantly get up and run after you? Or that you cannot Haste your > companion so that they can run quickly to the other side of town with a > message? I'm almost with you on this one. I think that its silly that everytime all the warriors with Boost Damage walk 10m away from the sorceror, the spell fades.... But I don't actually see much problem with a sorceror dominating someone and then sending it to do a task. In my interpretation of Dominate, the wolf would barely understand the order and just charge off and eat the first thing it met. It's against its nature to run off and eat some unknown four limbed creature (the child) when it has nice tasty ones lying around that don't scream when you come close (for instance, a vole). All IMHO, Nikk Nikk Effingham eng7nje@leeds.ac.uk http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/7556/ "If absolute power corrupts absolutely Where does that leave God?" -- George Daacon *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:19:03 +0100 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range Bob Stancliff: > My personal feeling is that the effect of a ranged spell is centered >on the target, not the caster, and travels with them when they leave >the casting range... > ...Presence should never have been invented. By removing >the need to manipulate Duration, the spells that can be cast >are much more powerful, and I feel that they are too powerful. No offense intended, but I will bother talking about Sandy's rules, beacuse others on the list may be interested. On one hand, you suggest making Ranged spells extremely powerful, and on the other, you say that Sandy's rules are too powerful. Sure, Sandy's sorcerors gain that, but they also lose the ability to cast as many spells as they want, so cannot cast DB10 on the entire party. My Dominate Wolf could be covered in your suggestion, by saying that the spell still exists beyond 10m, but loses it's Active status, and the sorceror can no longer exert his control. Other ranged spells, such as Palsy, could still work because they require no input from the sorceror to keep palsying. philip.hibbs@tnt.co.uk or phibbs@compuserve.com http://members.tripod.com/~PhilHibbs/ A single death is a tragedy a million deaths are a statistic Josef Stalin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:28:19 +0100 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range Nikk: >I think that its silly that everytime all the >warriors with Boost Damage walk 10m away from the sorceror, >the spell fades.... Boost Damage is a touch spell under Sandy's description, so doesn't suffer from Range problems. I can't remember about the RQ3 description. >But I don't actually see much problem with a sorceror >dominating someone and then sending it to do a task. Do you see a problem with casting Fly on something, and sending it up into the sky, or across a wide ravine, without putting enough Range into the spell? philip.hibbs@tnt.co.uk or phibbs@compuserve.com http://members.tripod.com/~PhilHibbs/ A single death is a tragedy a million deaths are a statistic Josef Stalin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:40:52 GMT From: "Nikk Effingham" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range > Do you see a problem with casting Fly on something, and sending it up into > the sky, or across a wide ravine, without putting enough Range into the > spell? Actually, no to an extent. Yes, to another. I would allow the Flying object to travel as far as the range would allow. If the sorceror was then forced to move out of range, the object would hover there, as oppossed to fall from the sky. Until the caster stop concentrating that is. Nikk Nikk Effingham eng7nje@leeds.ac.uk http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Lair/7556/ "If absolute power corrupts absolutely Where does that leave God?" -- George Daacon *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:37:22 +0100 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: [RQ-RULES] Boost Damage >Boost Damage is a touch spell under Sandy's description, so doesn't suffer >from Range problems. I can't remember about the RQ3 description. Phil, you're a pillock, you're reading the wrong writeup! The new version is Ranged, the old one is Touch. philip.hibbs@tnt.co.uk or phibbs@compuserve.com http://members.tripod.com/~PhilHibbs/ A single death is a tragedy a million deaths are a statistic Josef Stalin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:39:49 +0100 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: [RQ-RULES] Tap INT I posted this to the Glorantha list a while ago, but I just remembered it, and thought I really had to post it again, it's such a stroke of genius. How To Get Free Presence In Sandy's Sorcery System: Boost INT can be used to restore points lost to disease or Tap spells, so Tap your own INT, then Boost it back up to its original level, using Permanence (costing a point of POW) so that the Boost does not take up Presence. All my characters will do this from now on! Unfortunately, this only works under sandy's previous writeup, as in the latest version, Tap just gives MP or FP. Boo! Boring! philip.hibbs@tnt.co.uk or phibbs@compuserve.com http://members.tripod.com/~PhilHibbs/ A single death is a tragedy a million deaths are a statistic Josef Stalin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:54:44 -0500 From: stancliff@commnections.com Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range RU>On one hand, you suggest making Ranged spells extremely powerful, and on the RU>other, you say that Sandy's rules are too powerful. Sure, Sandy's sorcerors RU>gain that, but they also lose the ability to cast as many spells as they RU>want, so cannot cast DB10 on the entire party. Rules are trade-offs. You can lose Presence and keep Range, Limit manipulation to (lowest used skill% / 5), and limit the number of simultanious spells to INT. High INT would still be an advantage for sorcery use, but would not be critical. This fixes most of the complaints listed regarding RQ3 sorcery, especially limiting the ability of students.. RU>My Dominate Wolf could be covered in your suggestion, by saying that the RU>spell still exists beyond 10m, but loses it's Active status, and the RU>sorceror can no longer exert his control. The only difference is whether the last command given is still being enforced. Is Dominate listed as an Active spell that must be concentrated on to do anything? This would probably answer the issue, since it would have to stay in range to allow Active control. Bob Stancliff (Stancliff@commnections.com) (http://commnections.com/upgrades) *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:45:41 +0100 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Sorcery Range >I would allow the Flying object >to travel as far as the range would allow. If the sorceror was >then forced to move out of range, the object would hover there, >as oppossed to fall from the sky. That's the way I would rule it. Active spells become Inactive when beyond the spell's range. To allow Control to still work, but Fly not to, you would have to build in some other distinction between the two. Personally, I'm happy to pause both at the Range limit. Sandy is too, he just replied: "Suggestions on how to distinguish? Perhaps active or transient spells require you to be in range, but not passive spells?". philip.hibbs@tnt.co.uk or phibbs@compuserve.com http://members.tripod.com/~PhilHibbs/ A single death is a tragedy a million deaths are a statistic Josef Stalin *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of RuneQuest Rules Digest V1 #82 ************************************ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. RuneQuest is a Trademark of Avalon Hill Games. With the exception of previously copyrighted material, unless specified otherwise all text in this digest is copyright by the author or authors, with rights granted to copy for personal use, to excerpt in reviews and replies, and to archive unchanged for electronic retrieval.