From: owner-runequest-rules@ (RuneQuest Rules Digest) To: runequest-rules-digest@lists.MPGN.COM Subject: RuneQuest Rules Digest V1 #164 Reply-To: runequest-rules@mpgn.com Sender: owner-runequest-rules@ Errors-To: owner-runequest-rules@ Precedence: bulk RuneQuest Rules Digest Tuesday, October 6 1998 Volume 01 : Number 164 RuneQuest is a trademark of Hasbro/Avalon Hill Games. All Rights Reserved. TABLE OF CONTENTS RE: Re: [RQ-RULES] Failed Enchantments [RQ-RULES] One-Use Matrix [RQ-RULES] Re: RuneQuest Rules Digest V1 #163 Re: [RQ-RULES] Failed Enchantments Re: [RQ-RULES] One-Use Matrix [RQ-RULES] Sexual dimorphism in the RuneQuest system Re: [RQ-RULES] One-Use Matrix Fwd: Re: [RQ-RULES] Sexual dimorphism in the RuneQuest syst Fwd: Re: [RQ-RULES] Sexual dimorphism in the RuneQuest system Fwd: Re: [RQ-RULES] One-Use Matrix Fwd: Re: [RQ-RULES] Missile Combat Fwd: Re: Re: [RQ-RULES] Failed Enchantments Fwd: Re: [RQ-RULES] One-Use Matrix RULES OF THE ROAD 1. Do not include large sections of a message in your reply. Especially not to add "Yeah, I agree" or "No, I disagree." Or be excoriated. If someone writes something good and you want to say "good show" please do. But don't include the whole message you praise. 2. Use an appropriate Subject line. 3. Learn the art of paraphrasing: Don't just quote and comment on a point-by-point basis. 4. No anonymous posting, please. Don't say something unless you're ready to stand by it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 17:15:59 +0100 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: RE: Re: [RQ-RULES] Failed Enchantments >it already requires that 2 POW be spent in the process of >making a 1 POW divine matrix But that 1 POW divine matrix is much more useful than a spirit magic matrix, and he only needs to sacrifice once for Spell Matrix Enchantment. philip.hibbs@tnt.co.uk http://members.tripod.com/~PhilHibbs/ Any view of things that is not strange is false - Neil Gaiman, Sandman *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 17:33:14 +0100 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: [RQ-RULES] One-Use Matrix In my RQ game recently, an NPC river priest gave the characters one-use spell enchantments of Breathe Water and River Eyes, and one of the players complained "But you can't do that in the rules". I told him not to be silly, the rules just don't describe how it is done because it is uncommon. Can anyone think of a reasonable RQ rule for this kind of enchantment? philip.hibbs@tnt.co.uk http://members.tripod.com/~PhilHibbs/ Any view of things that is not strange is false - Neil Gaiman, Sandman *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 17:36:20 +0100 From: "Paul Bestwick" Subject: [RQ-RULES] Re: RuneQuest Rules Digest V1 #163 unsubscribe runequest-rules-digest *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 13:41:15 -0400 From: Richard Ohlson Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Failed Enchantments Hibbs, Philip wrote: > >it already requires that 2 POW be spent in the process of > >making a 1 POW divine matrix > > But that 1 POW divine matrix is much more useful than a spirit magic matrix, > and he only needs to sacrifice once for Spell Matrix Enchantment. > Yes, and what does Grampa the Rune Lord need with 10 uses of shield? If the man can barely walk, he might as well start tossing 'em into matrix's and giveing them to the cult. They can either become part of the temple defenses, part of the Chief Priests reserve magic, or he can spread 'em out among his favorite nephews. Don't forget, if he's acts as a priest for his own shrine, then he can do the seasonal worship ceremony which nets him a pow-check every month. And if he blows himself to a 5 POW making "gifts for the cult" then he's got a good shot at getting a point back each month. And yes, when he finally dies he'll be a little tiny sparkle in the sky, but a bunch of people will remember him everytime they toss up shield 2. Rich *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 13:45:42 -0400 From: Richard Ohlson Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] One-Use Matrix Hibbs, Philip wrote: > In my RQ game recently, an NPC river priest gave the characters one-use > spell enchantments of Breathe Water and River Eyes, and one of the players > complained "But you can't do that in the rules". I told him not to be silly, > the rules just don't describe how it is done because it is uncommon. > > Can anyone think of a reasonable RQ rule for this kind of enchantment? > > Spell trading kind of allows that, though it's fairly expensive. A piece of truestone that only has those two spells in it would work. Maybe the priest has a Matrix with a lost spell that allows that. Or, when the litttle lawyer makes River Priest, he can learn the secret spell. Heck, maybe there is a secret shrine at the bottom of the River, that is really some anchient mystery that the RIVER has access to, and can be a campaign hook. "Ok, just swim to the mouth of the river, convince the dragon to let you by, swim under water for about four hours, then enter the great temple... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 6 Oct 1998 16:29:36 -0400 (EDT) From: bjm10@cornell.edu Subject: [RQ-RULES] Sexual dimorphism in the RuneQuest system Paging through my RQ3 critter book, and going through various Web sites devoted to RQ, I was reminded of the fact that human females allegedly have an average SIZ three points lower than that of human males. Does anybody realize what an incredibly absurd level of sexual dimorphism that is? Pulling numbers out of memory, I seem to recall that, in the real world, women generally have an average weight within 90% of the average man within a given population. They tend to be shorter than would be an average man of a given weight, but that's another matter. Okay, so, presuming that an "average man" weighs in at roughly 72kg (a ballpark figure). This would mean that an "average woman" should weigh in at roughly 65kg. This means, if the RQ women are three less than men rule is accurate, that three points of SIZ, if RQ is trying to use a realistic model, amount to about 7kg. Now, this is further complicated by the fact that the SIZ scale is not first-order linear, but we'll leave that off for the moment. So, if RQ is realistic, then 3 points of SIZ (the three between SIZ 10 and SIZ 13) equal 7kg, or 2 and 1/3 kg per point of SIZ. But the RQ rules tell us that 1 point of SIZ is 6kg in one place and say that it's a linear function that becomes exponential in another. This would mean that a 3 SIZ difference would make for as much sexual dimorphism as seen in elephant seals! What to do? I propose the following: Female humans should have a SIZ average of ONE point less than males. It makes the overal effects *far* less absurd. As for other attributes, I'm still working on that. Female Uzko, of course, are significantly larger than males, as befits any master race. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 21:02:10 -0400 From: Tal Meta Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] One-Use Matrix Hibbs, Philip wrote: > > In my RQ game recently, an NPC river priest gave the characters one-use > spell enchantments of Breathe Water and River Eyes, and one of the players > complained "But you can't do that in the rules". I told him not to be silly, > the rules just don't describe how it is done because it is uncommon. > > Can anyone think of a reasonable RQ rule for this kind of enchantment? Somewhere, either on the net or in a published source, I found the following spell... STORE SORCERY Ritual (Enchant) This enchantment must be Multispelled with the spell it is intended to affect, which must be a non-ritual spell. Both spells are cast into a non-living object, generally something small and portable. The stored spell is held in the object, ready for use. To use it, a being need only grasp the object, designate a target, and state that he is activating the spell. The spell operates automatically, and the user need not know any sorcery. Once used, the entire enchantment dissipates. Perhaps a similar divine spell exists, or there's a varant that allows divine magic to be so stored? - -- talmeta@bellatlantic.net - I *am* one of the Chosen Few! ICQ - 12594453 AIM - talmeta1 TANJ Lives! - Alternate Homepage - *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 22:30:27 -0400 From: Tal Meta Subject: Fwd: Re: [RQ-RULES] Sexual dimorphism in the RuneQuest syst From: "Bob Stancliff" Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Sexual dimorphism in the RuneQuest syst > Paging through my RQ3 critter book, and going through various Web sites > devoted to RQ, I was reminded of the fact that human females allegedly > have an average SIZ three points lower than that of human males. The difference between Siz 8 and Siz 18 is about the difference between 4.5 feet and 7 feet... picture a thin Danny diVito next to Wilt Chamberlin. > Pulling numbers out of memory, I seem to recall that, in the real world, > women generally have an average weight within 90% of the average man > within a given population. They tend to be shorter than would be an > average man of a given weight, but that's another matter. I suspect that should read 'average height' and due to the cubic volume formulas, that ends up being noticably less than 90% of the weight or mass... more like 75%. > Okay, so, presuming that an "average man" weighs in at roughly 72kg (a > ballpark figure). This would mean that an "average woman" should weigh > in at roughly 65kg. In America, the average woman is near 130 or 140 lbs (60-65kg), but the average man is closer to 180 or 190 lbs (85-90kg). The height differences for these is at least 6 inches. > So, if RQ is realistic, then 3 points of SIZ (the three between SIZ 10 > and SIZ 13) equal 7kg, or 2 and 1/3 kg per point of SIZ. False premise leads to false conclusion, and no one said RQ was realistic... some guys made it up. Bob Stancliff (stanclif@ufl.edu) http:\\commnections.com\upgrades *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 22:08:12 -0400 From: Tal Meta Subject: Fwd: Re: [RQ-RULES] Sexual dimorphism in the RuneQuest system From: styopa@iname.com Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Sexual dimorphism in the RuneQuest system At 04:29 PM 10/6/98 -0400, you wrote: > > >Paging through my RQ3 critter book, and going through various Web sites >devoted to RQ, I was reminded of the fact that human females allegedly >have an average SIZ three points lower than that of human males. > [snip, snip, snippety snip] > >Female humans should have a SIZ average of ONE point less than males. It >makes the overal effects *far* less absurd. > >Female Uzko, of course, are significantly larger than males, as befits >any master race. I would also suggest give them a default "Long Winded exposition of a rather simple and basically correct point" of 40% +40% if they're married, as any husband would agree.....:) (duck) heh heh heh I agreed but couldn't resist. - -Steve (styopa@iname.com) or at work (Steve@necadon.com) http://surf.to/styopa *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 22:05:34 -0400 From: Tal Meta Subject: Fwd: Re: [RQ-RULES] One-Use Matrix From: styopa@iname.com Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] One-Use Matrix At 05:33 PM 10/6/98 +0100, you wrote: >In my RQ game recently, an NPC river priest gave the characters one-use >spell enchantments of Breathe Water and River Eyes, and one of the players >complained "But you can't do that in the rules". I told him not to be silly, >the rules just don't describe how it is done because it is uncommon. > >Can anyone think of a reasonable RQ rule for this kind of enchantment? Why does anyone need a rule? You made the judgement as the DM - that's the rule. Or are you talking about "a general rule to allow the giving of reuseable spells on a one-use basis to persons unattached to a religion"? That would be implied in the rules, IMO. According to most cults, Initiates and/or Lay Members get certain divine magic as one-use. Who gives this? I'd say senior priests do it. So, I'd say they can give them to "infidels" if the circumstances for their church warrant it. (But also, any priest who starts handing these out except in emergencies (and not just "ahhg the broo is attacking" but "our church is going to be wiped out unless..." type emergencies!) is going to find his spells and ceremonies failing rather quickly.) - -Steve (styopa@iname.com) or at work (Steve@necadon.com) http://surf.to/styopa *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 22:11:43 -0400 From: Tal Meta Subject: Fwd: Re: [RQ-RULES] Missile Combat From: "Bob Stancliff" Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Missile Combat > > Even heavily armoured troops will suffer because of the way the > > rules mechanics work i.e. more chance of a special or crit, > > due to the greater chance to hit. > > Any thoughts on the above and whether they ring true with the real world ? > > Paul Bestwick > > I`d say the bonus to the attack skill should not increase the > chance to get a special or critical. After all, these are meant to > represent a very good shot or good luck. You don't shoot any better > when you shoot at a gathering of people, and the amount of luck > involved should not be changed either. > An example: > I think the bonus is 5% per individual (but it doesn't really matter). > An archerer shoots at a closely packed troop of 400 soldiers. > This gives him a bonus of 5*400 = 2000%. If this should be used to > calculate critical chances, he would get a crit. as long as he rolled > under 96. > -Terry This is a telling example of the problem. An arrow shot into a group is MUCH more likely to hit someone, but also MUCH less likely to special. Near the end of the archery discussions, I think I recommended using 1/2 of the normal hit chance to compute specials since they would be less common during mass actions (it might have been in reference to something related, but not this). My players have all ruled that the missiles from MultiMissile have to hit the same target, but it would be an interesting variant when fired into a group to have the missiles scatter based on your hit chances. Bob Stancliff (stanclif@ufl.edu) http:\\commnections.com\upgrades *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 22:25:33 -0400 From: Tal Meta Subject: Fwd: Re: Re: [RQ-RULES] Failed Enchantments From: "Bob Stancliff" Subject: Re: Re: [RQ-RULES] Failed Enchantments > >it already requires that 2 POW be spent in the process of > >making a 1 POW divine matrix > > But that 1 POW divine matrix is much more useful than a spirit magic matrix, Sorry Phillip, but I strongly disagree!! The spirit spell matrix may be 1/4 to 1/3 as strong as the divine matrix, but it can be used several times a day limited by MP's... the divine matrix is, at best, a once per day item, and is often unable to be recharged for several weeks. In some campaigns you may only need it once a season, and then it is ok The enchantments that a spirit magician should be making are spirit binds, not spell matrices. That leverages the spent POW quickly when a 2 POW spell spirit bind can have Bladesharp 8 (much better than Truesword because it is at least once per day and it increases hit %). My campaign has proven to me that the fastest path to individual magical power is spirit magic. If a shaman is available to teach the spirit manipulation spells, then increadible feats are possible by an individual. > and he only needs to sacrifice once for Spell Matrix Enchantment. So? That means that the first time a priest wants to make a matrix, say for Shield 1, he has to sacrifice for Shield 1, Spell Matrix Enchantment, and sacrifice a POW for the enchantment itself (3 POW total, 2 POW thereafter). Bob Stancliff (stanclif@ufl.edu) http:\\commnections.com\upgrades *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 22:29:06 -0400 From: Tal Meta Subject: Fwd: Re: [RQ-RULES] One-Use Matrix From: "Bob Stancliff" Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] One-Use Matrix > In my RQ game recently, an NPC river priest gave the characters one-use > spell enchantments of Breathe Water and River Eyes, and one of the players > complained "But you can't do that in the rules". I told him not to be silly, > the rules just don't describe how it is done because it is uncommon. > > Can anyone think of a reasonable RQ rule for this kind of enchantment? It can easily be described as a divine intervention. That is the excuse given by the River Voices scenario in 'River of Cradles' and those are permanent enchantments made by the god. This same kind of ability is attributed to shamen. They are said to be able to craft rituals for any occasion, given time. The results may be permanent, but are usually temporary. RuneQuest does not even TRY to address the possible effects of ritual magic that Greg envisioned for Glorantha. He speaks of rituals that take years to complete but that never fail, and rituals that reincarnate the dead spirit of a goddess into a new human body. Bob Stancliff (stanclif@ufl.edu) http:\\commnections.com\upgrades *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of RuneQuest Rules Digest V1 #164 ************************************* *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. RuneQuest is a Trademark of Hasbro/Avalon Hill Games. With the exception of previously copyrighted material, unless specified otherwise all text in this digest is copyright by the author or authors, with rights granted to copy for personal use, to excerpt in reviews and replies, and to archive unchanged for electronic retrieval.