From: owner-runequest-rules@ (RuneQuest Rules Digest) To: runequest-rules-digest@lists.MPGN.COM Subject: RuneQuest Rules Digest V2 #33 Reply-To: runequest-rules@mpgn.com Sender: owner-runequest-rules@ Errors-To: owner-runequest-rules@ Precedence: bulk RuneQuest Rules Digest Friday, February 12 1999 Volume 02 : Number 033 RuneQuest is a trademark of Hasbro/Avalon Hill Games. All Rights Reserved. TABLE OF CONTENTS [RQ-RULES] Curing Chaos Features RE: [RQ-RULES] Curing Chaos Features RE: [RQ-RULES] Ogres as PCs RE: [RQ-RULES] Ogres as PCs RE: [RQ-RULES] Curing Chaos Features [RQ-RULES] Woman at Lords? RE: [RQ-RULES] Woman at Lords? Re: [RQ-RULES] The Grimoire Re: [RQ-RULES] Re: Ogres RE: [RQ-RULES] Ogres as PCs RE: [RQ-RULES] Son of Gygax has been spawned.. RULES OF THE ROAD 1. Do not include large sections of a message in your reply. Especially not to add "Yeah, I agree" or "No, I disagree." Or be excoriated. If someone writes something good and you want to say "good show" please do. But don't include the whole message you praise. 2. Use an appropriate Subject line. 3. Learn the art of paraphrasing: Don't just quote and comment on a point-by-point basis. 4. No anonymous posting, please. Don't say something unless you're ready to stand by it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 05:22:43 "GMT" From: "rexabean@ozemail.com.au" Subject: [RQ-RULES] Curing Chaos Features Dear all, So what happens when a PC picks up a chaos feature from a fluffed dice roll ? I know an Orlanthi of mine failed a climb roll and fell onto a massive chaos crystal which promptly grew him a third arm (which he equally promptly cut off). Despite the injuries he gave himself he still survived the huge amount of wizardry going off in the epic battle. Now this was the culmination of a mjor episode in the campaign I was playing in, but does this mean I have to decide to kill my PC myself just because of 1 bad die roll. He kept showing up as chaos tainted and the arm kept trying to slowly grow back. Now maybe we are a bunch of softies; because we don't kill off a couple of PC's every session but prefer to develop them over several years of realtime playing (2-3 times a month), although really unlucky PCs do die. So maybe it is a stylistic question ? Anyway the PC in question went to a Chalana Arroy temple who claim to have cured him (it was out of session since he is not a main character). He now wanders around scratching his chest a lot, looking furtive and visits the CA temple every season to make a donation. I have not played him for a while so I am not entirely convinced he was really removed of his chaos taint The real question is surely in all the battles with serious chaos at high levels won't RuneLords be exposing themselves to primal chaos and nasty HeroQuest powers that may infect them involuntarily with chaos taint. So do half the surviving Storm Bulllers have to kill themselves anyway, after a big battle, because they didn't get out of the splash zone fast enough ? Or are there ways to "get rid of it" (that may just be illumination and thus sidestepping the issue). Or are we all just doomed (Elrician type perspective). Maybe trolls, who after all used to live on the edges of chaos, have ways to protect themselves from the taint or get rid of it once acquired. Cheers, Andrew __________________________________________________________ Message sent by MyMail http://www.mymail.com.au/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 08:33:55 -0000 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Curing Chaos Features >So what happens when a PC picks up a chaos >feature from a fluffed dice roll ? I know an Orlanthi >of mine failed a climb roll and fell onto a massive >chaos crystal which promptly grew him a third arm If the referee dishes out chaos taints as easily as this, then you as a group must accept the consequences. Life's a bitch, then you die. >So do half the surviving Storm Bulllers have to kill >themselves anyway, after a big battle, because they >didn't get out of the splash zone fast enough ? Sometimes, I'm sure this happens, yes. Opinions expressed may not even be my own, let alone those of any organisations, nations, species, or schools of thought to which I may be affiliated. http://www.snark.freeserve.co.uk/ Failure is not an option, it's integral to the o/s. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 08:36:53 -0000 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Ogres as PCs >Personally, I think that if a human character can have such >a diverse range of personality options, so can any other race. I agree, but the range is /not/ the /same/ as the range of human personality. It's difficult, if not impossible, for us to understand the full range of Uz or Aldryami psychology. It's like the difference between male and female, but much more so. Opinions expressed may not even be my own, let alone those of any organisations, nations, species, or schools of thought to which I may be affiliated. http://www.snark.freeserve.co.uk/ Failure is not an option, it's integral to the o/s. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 08:43:35 -0000 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Ogres as PCs >Gaming tradition has been mentioned as proof that non-human races are >rigid in their style of play, but my library of RPGs doesn't support that. If I came over as saying that, then I over-stated my case. An example of what I'm trying to get across is, in a Gloranthan game I'm playing is, the ref's girlfriend is playing a trollkin. This trollkin has a pet rat, cooks porridge, always wears clothes, does the shopping, he acts as a sort of mother figure for the whole party, and in general is just not trollish in any way. She sees being an independant trollkin (technically owned by my character to keep the uz away) as being just like a human, and believes that that's what a civilised trollkin would be like - just like us. It spoils the whole point of playing a trollkin, IMO. The only trollkinish thing that he does is say "please don't eat me" every now and then. Opinions expressed may not even be my own, let alone those of any organisations, nations, species, or schools of thought to which I may be affiliated. http://www.snark.freeserve.co.uk/ Failure is not an option, it's integral to the o/s. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 10:25:03 -0000 From: Ashley Munday Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Curing Chaos Features This is a bit of a gaming philosophy thing 'ere. Picking up a chaos feature the way your Adventurer did is no different to hacking your leg off when you fumble - if you put your character in the situation and it happens, well, that's life. Getting a bit Gloranthan here... (sorry Rich, this should be on that other list!) Chaos isn't the sort of thing that gets picked up casually - unless the referee wants it to happen. Likewise, it aint the sort of thing someone gets rid of easily - unless the referee wants it to happen. Ash - -----Original Message----- From: rexabean@ozemail.com.au [mailto:rexabean@ozemail.com.au] Sent: 12 February 1999 05:23 To: runequest-rules-digest@lists.MPGN.COM Subject: [RQ-RULES] Curing Chaos Features Dear all, So what happens when a PC picks up a chaos feature from a fluffed dice roll ? I know an Orlanthi of mine failed a climb roll and fell onto a massive chaos crystal which promptly grew him a third arm (which he equally promptly cut off). Despite the injuries he gave himself he still survived the huge amount of wizardry going off in the epic battle. Now this was the culmination of a mjor episode in the campaign I was playing in, but does this mean I have to decide to kill my PC myself just because of 1 bad die roll. He kept showing up as chaos tainted and the arm kept trying to slowly grow back. Now maybe we are a bunch of softies; because we don't kill off a couple of PC's every session but prefer to develop them over several years of realtime playing (2-3 times a month), although really unlucky PCs do die. So maybe it is a stylistic question ? Anyway the PC in question went to a Chalana Arroy temple who claim to have cured him (it was out of session since he is not a main character). He now wanders around scratching his chest a lot, looking furtive and visits the CA temple every season to make a donation. I have not played him for a while so I am not entirely convinced he was really removed of his chaos taint The real question is surely in all the battles with serious chaos at high levels won't RuneLords be exposing themselves to primal chaos and nasty HeroQuest powers that may infect them involuntarily with chaos taint. So do half the surviving Storm Bulllers have to kill themselves anyway, after a big battle, because they didn't get out of the splash zone fast enough ? Or are there ways to "get rid of it" (that may just be illumination and thus sidestepping the issue). Or are we all just doomed (Elrician type perspective). Maybe trolls, who after all used to live on the edges of chaos, have ways to protect themselves from the taint or get rid of it once acquired. Cheers, Andrew __________________________________________________________ Message sent by MyMail http://www.mymail.com.au/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 10:25:02 -0000 From: Ashley Munday Subject: [RQ-RULES] Woman at Lords? Phil mentions his refs girlfriend's Trollkin Adventurer (plus pet rat: Is it called Basil?). The fun thing about this * is trying to make a rationale for why the character behaves that way. If the player doesn't want to do it, start spreading rumours! Here's a couple of suggestion: He's a closet Xiola Umbar cultist Xiola Umbar worshipper; He grew up amongst Ernalda cultists that treated him like one of the girls; He's possessed by the same passion spirit that got Graham Norton. Ash * Having a referee's GF playing is often no fun for the other players. It's amazing what offers of sexual favours or threats to withold them do to impartiality. I cave in really easily... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 10:26:39 -0000 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Woman at Lords? >He's a closet Xiola Umbar cultist Xiola Umbar worshipper; He *IS* a XU worskipper. >* Having a referee's GF playing is often no fun for the other players. I've seen it go downhill that way, but there isn't a problem in this particular case. >(plus pet rat: Is it called Basil?). It's dead now, a Telmori ate it. Opinions expressed may not even be my own, let alone those of any organisations, nations, species, or schools of thought to which I may be affiliated. http://www.snark.freeserve.co.uk/ Failure is not an option, it's integral to the o/s. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 10:38:48 +0000 From: Simon Hibbs Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] The Grimoire Bob Stancliff : > Enough of the argument, I will drop the subject and you can say whatever. No, I've said eveything I want to say on that subject. None of this has any effect of the multispelled Diminish CON / Smother combination I suggested, which still works just fine. I've no personal stake in Sandy's Venom suggestion. >I consider that the reality makes the subject moot, because by the time you >manipulate enough Reduce to have a significant effect on the hit >points per location, the Venom will be as large as most people would cast >normally. The time might be better spent casting two or three Venoms at >the same intensity. Venom affects general hit points, so HPs per location don't come into the equation. However, your point on multispelled venoms is spot on. You can all but guarantee a kill with a multispelled battery of venom spells. Seven venom 7s costs 14 MPs and does a minimum damage of 28 points, if it gets past defensive spells and the MP vs MP roll. It's the sorcerer's equivalent of Sever Spirit. Simon Hibbs *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 10:49:10 +0000 From: Simon Hibbs Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Re: Ogres Nikk : >The Baths of Nealt cannot be survived. Even Harmast Barefoot cannot >survive them and used another HeroQuest instead. Sandy Petersen >described it as being the fact that every sin you committed is >inflicted upon you in searing, agonising pain Insane heroquesting tactic : Get killed by Gunda the Guilty using her spear, which makes her take on the sins of the poeple she kills. Get ressurected, then immediately do the Baths of Nelat quest. >Personally, i think Simon's Humakti Quest is the best, I'd even rule >that when you split into two halves, ONLY the ogre half is chaos >tainted, allowing you to carry on a normal, chaos free life. I was thinking about that too, but I don't think even the power of Death itself can cut away the taint of chaos. I think the only hope for a chaotic is illumination. Simon Hibbs *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 11:20:39 +0000 From: Simon Hibbs Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Ogres as PCs Rich Allen : >Aside from the fact that you're once again pushing Glorantha as the baseline >for RQ3, I agree with you here...... When I'm explicitly talking about Broo, aldryami, mostali and uz then yes, clearly I'm talking about glorantha. > ......But where is it said that a race with >different (or even completely alien) instincts, etc., cannot be just as >diverse as humans are _within_ those different instincts and emotions? It isn't, and certainly never has been by me. >Where does it say that those differences are so far apart that the diversity >doesn't cross-over, sharing characteristics with human instincts? Ditto. > Gaming tradition has been mentioned as proof that non-human races are >rigid in their style of play, but my library of RPGs doesn't support that. By who? Certainly not by Phil, who simply pointed out that humans are the dominant species on glorantha and the vast majority of other fictional settings, which is largely true. He said nothing about rigidly running non humans according to inflexible stereotypes, but merely that humans are generally more flexible. Humans are more flexible, therefore non humans are completely inflexible is not a logical inference to make. They are merely less flexible, as you say when you talk about them behaving '_within_ those different instincts and emotions' (your emphasis). Sandy and Greg have been very clear about this, particularly in their descriptions of uz, mostali and aldryami psychology. i.e. that they possess only an id, ego and superego respectively. > ..........My >even larger library of fantasy and Sci-Fi books also give non-human races >huge variations within the archetypes. The key phrase here is 'within the archetypes'. Nobody is saying that trolls can't have a variety of personality types, emotional responses and aspirations. On the other hand we know that they do not have many of the emotional responses associated with feelings of community, morality and impartiality. These concepts have no meaning for trolls, yet they are the whole body of aldryami psychology. For aldryami there is no 'self', there is only the forest, of which they are a part. Sure there are exceptions, just as there are insane or unusual humans. This discussion reminds me of one of the Elric books. Elric and Moonglum meet a young woman who is outcast from her people because of her deformity. To them she seems perfectly normal, until she shown them two faint scars on her back. She is one of the Myrrhn, a winged people similar to wind children. To you and I she might seem perfectly normal and healthy, but to her own people she is a hideously mutilated cripple. It made me stop and think about what it means to be 'normal'. Simon Hibbs *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 10:15:55 +0000 From: Simon Hibbs Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Son of Gygax has been spawned.. Ashley Munday : > .......Young Phil >revealed himself earlier by saying: "However, trolls is trolls, and dwarfs >is dwarfs. Humans in most game settings have a peculiar advantage of being >flexible and adaptable" > >Reminds me of the good old days. I'll have to dig out my AD&D "Racial >Superiority Manual." It's got nothing whatsoever to do with racial superiority. The fact is Glorantha was developed by a human being, for an audience of human beings. The non-human species are either commentaries on particular aspects of the human psyche taken to an extreme, or explorations of the human tendency to anthropomorphise the things and creatures around us. The difference in glorantha is that whereas the inteligent animals in Narnia (for example) are basicaly people in fur coats, Glorantha is a genuine attempt to do justice to the notion of inteligence, myth and culture outside the parameters of normal human experience. Phil : > .......It's like people feeling sorry for a race >that doesn't have sexual intercourse. It simply doesn't matter to them, they >get their kicks some other way, that we probably can't understand. Except in star trek, where for many alien races one of the most amazing dicoveries in millenia is this earth thing called 'kissing'. Simon Hibbs *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of RuneQuest Rules Digest V2 #33 ************************************ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. RuneQuest is a Trademark of Hasbro/Avalon Hill Games. 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