From: owner-runequest-rules@ (RuneQuest Rules Digest) To: runequest-rules-digest@lists.MPGN.COM Subject: RuneQuest Rules Digest V2 #49 Reply-To: runequest-rules@mpgn.com Sender: owner-runequest-rules@ Errors-To: owner-runequest-rules@ Precedence: bulk RuneQuest Rules Digest Friday, March 12 1999 Volume 02 : Number 049 RuneQuest is a trademark of Hasbro/Avalon Hill Games. All Rights Reserved. TABLE OF CONTENTS [RQ-RULES] Sandy's Grimoire [RQ-RULES] mysticism, suffering and trolls Re: [RQ-RULES] mysticism, suffering and trolls RE: [RQ-RULES] Sandy's Grimoire Re: [RQ-RULES] Sandy's Grimoire [RQ-RULES] Re: Sandy's Grimoire [RQ-RULES] Sorcerery 3.5 Re: [RQ-RULES] Sorcerery 3.5 [RQ-RULES] Re: Mysticism RE: [RQ-RULES] Sorcerery 3.5 Re: [RQ-RULES] Sorcerery 3.5 Re: [RQ-RULES] Sorcerery 3.5 Re: [RQ-RULES] Sorcerery 3.5 RULES OF THE ROAD 1. Do not include large sections of a message in your reply. Especially not to add "Yeah, I agree" or "No, I disagree." Or be excoriated. If someone writes something good and you want to say "good show" please do. But don't include the whole message you praise. 2. Use an appropriate Subject line. 3. Learn the art of paraphrasing: Don't just quote and comment on a point-by-point basis. 4. No anonymous posting, please. Don't say something unless you're ready to stand by it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 16:18:51 GMT From: simonh@msi-uk.com (Simon Hibbs) Subject: [RQ-RULES] Sandy's Grimoire Nikk Effingham : >Ahh, but you can ORDER the spirit to learn magic spells, you can >force it to, it doesn't really have a way of getting out of it. >However, you can't force a creature to donate POW. Phil isn't talkign about forcing a spirit to do anything. As he said in the paragraph you quoted : >...In the spirit's opinion, it might be a fair exchange.... Perhaps the sorcerer can find a spirit that will be willing to go through the apprentice bonding ritual. Why should a spirit be any more unhappy about that than a human apprentice? Simon Hibbs *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 16:32:15 GMT From: simonh@msi-uk.com (Simon Hibbs) Subject: [RQ-RULES] mysticism, suffering and trolls Bob Stancliff : >> Transcendence through self-mutilation. Lovely. I suppose >> Danfive Xaron is another, less extreme form of this. > I would consider them to be more extreme, they practice >self flagellation and removing their own body parts that >offend them. Self flagelation is one thing. Thousands of Gerran initiates die during the festival of blood ceremonies. Danfive Xaron is mainly about submission to authority and attonement. Gerra is purely about suffering as an end in itself. > Technically, none of the darkness deities are trolls, they >are the parents of the mistress race. They all have the >same ancestry to the true darkness, but XU might not be a >mother of the trolls. Kyger Litor, Korasting, Kaarg and Zong are not trolls? Simon Hibbs *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 15:48:28 -0500 From: "Bob Stancliff" Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] mysticism, suffering and trolls > > Technically, none of the darkness deities are trolls, they > >are the parents of the mistress race. They all have the > >same ancestry to the true darkness, but XU might not be a > >mother of the trolls. > > Kyger Litor, Korasting, Kaarg and Zong are not trolls? Kyger Litor is depicted as a troll... by trolls. There is a group of humans that worship her near the Shadow Plateau that depict her as a black human. Worship seems to define the shape of the deity in Glorantha. Kyger Litor mated with the Man Rune (grandfather mortal) to form the Mistress race, the first Trolls. She and her siblings, like Xiola Umbar, (and Korasting?), were Darkness beings without true human form. I believe that Kaarg and Zong were Mistress race heroes that became deified through hero cults, not the same thing I was talking about. It has been too long since I read Troll Pack to recall the genealogies. Bob Stancliff *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 17:32:37 -0600 From: "Rich Allen" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Sandy's Grimoire > Well, not quite. In the case of a familiar the familiar knows and > can cast the spell. The ability of the sorcerer to cast the spell > is a side effect of the minlink like bond between sorcerer and familiar. Ah. This is another area that should have been given much more space in the rule books. So a familiar can actually cast a spell stored in it's Free INT without sorcerer intervention... that opens up a lot to the game that I thought wasn't possible. So the transfer of spells from a sorcerer to the familiar should be a ritual. Sort of a combination of removing the spell ability from the sorcerer's mind, and teaching the spell to the familiar at the same time. Here's my next question then... I had planned to change the way familiars work in my sorcery rules, allowing them to become vessels, but not letting them store spells for the sorcerer in their Free INT. Does anyone think it would make familiars too powerfull if they could act as a vessel AND store spells the way they can now? Rich Allen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 09 Mar 1999 19:20:25 -0500 From: Tal Meta Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Sandy's Grimoire Rich Allen wrote: > > Here's my next question then... I had planned to change the way familiars > work in my sorcery rules, allowing them to become vessels, but not letting > them store spells for the sorcerer in their Free INT. Does anyone think it > would make familiars too powerfull if they could act as a vessel AND store > spells the way they can now? In a way, that's how SS treats them now; they free up the sorc's free INT and provide both mps and spell support at need. One thing I allowed in the past that (that I won't be allowing again) is the sorcerer being able to see through the familiar's eyes. One of my story arcs in my last campaign revolved around the sorcerer's familiar getting kidnapped, and I needed the player's cooperation to NOT just use the familiar's eyes as a teleport sighting aid to rescue him. - -- talmeta@bellatlantic.net - Heretic & Dilettante ICQ - 12594453 AIM - talmeta1 Homepage - *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 9 Mar 1999 21:19:42 -0500 From: "Loren Miller" Subject: [RQ-RULES] Re: Sandy's Grimoire I think it's likely that somewhere there exists a variant of the Apprentice Bonding ritual that lets the Adept Sorceror sacrifice the POW instead of the Apprentice-to- be, or that some art exists that generally lets the Sorceror sacrifice POW in place of someone else. This sort of thing isn't a big reach for the rules given that we've seen similar things in published scenarios. And it's an easier way to explain Sandy's Grimoire than the hair-splitting that has been going on. +++++++++++++++++++++++23 Loren Miller "If men cease to believe that they will one day become gods then they will surely become worms." --Henry Miller, "The Colossus of Maroussi" *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 18:06:14 -0600 From: "Rich Allen" Subject: [RQ-RULES] Sorcerery 3.5 Well, I've finally got my sorcerery rules written down in enough detail to ask everyone to take a look at them. The URL is http://www.mindspring.com/~rico Open the file called "Sorcery3.5.htm". I also have a half-forgotten writeup of roundless combat for RuneQuest that you can take a look at if you want, that's the file called "combat.htm". I know these rules will probably need some work... Tell me what needs to be further explained, expanded, etc. Please keep in mind, however, that these rules are intended to be generic in setting. I.e. no specific guidelines for Glorantha, Questworld, or even Greyhawk. These are up to the individual GMs. Also note that the division of the spells between Low and High Magic were done quickly, based on my impression of the spells. Arguments for or against certain placements are welcome! Rich Allen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 09:38:19 -0500 From: Tal Meta Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Sorcerery 3.5 Rich Allen wrote: > > I know these rules will probably need some work... Tell me what needs to > be further explained, expanded, etc. Please keep in mind, however, that > these rules are intended to be generic in setting. I.e. no specific > guidelines for Glorantha, Questworld, or even Greyhawk. These are up to the > individual GMs. Have you ever read the shared-world Liavek anthologies? The magic system in those books actually parallels Reiley's system to a degree, except in the following ways: One invests the entirety of one's Luck (POW) into the vessel chosen, such an investiture lasts for only one year, after which it must be redone. - -- talmeta@bellatlantic.net - Heretic & Dilettante ICQ - 12594453 AIM - talmeta1 Homepage - *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 22:00:23 +0100 From: Nils Weinander Subject: [RQ-RULES] Re: Mysticism Nikk: > > Has everyone seen Sandy's rules for Mysticism? I hope so, they sure > are good so pick up a copy if you haven't. > > I was wondering, after reading these rules, if anyone has any ideas > on other branches and forms of Mystical and Transcendent followings? > I'm posting this to this digest rather than the Glorantha digest > because I'm more interested in seeing a working RQ rules mechanic > for other forms of Mysticism, so excuse any Gloranthan references, > I think this question holds true for other game worlds as well. An important thing to notice is that these rules were created quite a while ago, before Greg had done any work on the Gloranthan east, the Vithelan mythology etc. So, these rules are no longer valid for orthodox Gloranthan mysticism, as practiced by the eastern meditators for example. They do apply to martial artists as noted below, and other expressions of "active mysticism", but orthodox Gloranthan mystics reject the world and all forms of magic. As you progress mystically you accumulate magic power, but if you _use_ it you fail as a mystic. > adn Enlightenment. I was wondering if people had any ideas for the > powers/abilities/eventual goals of other mystics. I'm NOT looking > for, and don't believe, that most mystical sects give you abilities > to enhance combat, cast fireballs etc... but do give you SOMETHING > for all your hard work. Simply saying that a mystical path "connects > you to the comic forces" or what have you doesn't do it for me. But that is explicitly what mysticism is all about. There are benefits however. As the mystic rejects the world and its influences, she also becomes more immune to these influences. So, the mystic aquires invulnerability to magical and mundane attacks, detection spells etc. > I was thinking that all mystical paths could work akin to Sandy's > Mysticism - you have a skill, you can increase it and then spend it > on the Mystical powers. For example, take Illumination. We could > change the rules so that you have the Illumination skill and rather > than increasing it with meditation like Sandy's eastern mystics do, > you increase it by listening to riddles etc... You spend it not on > powers to increase your physical ability etc... but on the Illuminate > powers we already have (immune to gift/geases etc...). I think this > would work and would be quite slick as a game mechanic goes. > > What does everyone else think? I think it could work. Here are some other examples of powers: * For each 10% skill, add 1 to defensive POW * For each 10% skill, decrease opponents' attack skills by 5% (as per the Shimmer spell) * For each 10% skill gain 1 point of Detection blank (permanently). * For each 10% skill gain 1 point of Countermagic ______________________________________________________ Nils Weinander | Everything is dust in the wind nilsw@ibm.net | http://www.geocities.com/Paris/8689/ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 16:36:57 -0600 From: "Rich Allen" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Sorcerery 3.5 > Have you ever read the shared-world Liavek anthologies? Hmm, haven't seen those, who's the editor? Rich Allen *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 09:09:15 -0500 From: Tal Meta Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Sorcerery 3.5 Rich Allen wrote: > > > Have you ever read the shared-world Liavek anthologies? > > Hmm, haven't seen those, who's the editor? Will Shetterley & Emma Bull. I believe the series petered out after only 3 volumes (at least, I only have 3, myself), but the magic system was much better organized than the Sanctuary project was. - -- talmeta@bellatlantic.net - Heretic & Dilettante ICQ - 12594453 AIM - talmeta1 Homepage - *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 09:26:45 -0500 From: "Bob Stancliff" Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Sorcerery 3.5 > > Have you ever read the shared-world Liavek anthologies? > Hmm, haven't seen those, who's the editor? > Rich Allen I believe it is Will Shetterly (Shatterly?)... they are fun. Bob *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 17:25:18 -0000 From: "Dom Twist" Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Sorcerery 3.5 >Will Shetterley & Emma Bull. I believe the series petered out after only >3 volumes (at least, I only have 3, myself), but the magic system was >much better organized than the Sanctuary project was. That implies that Sanctuary's magic system was organised.........it didnt even come close........... *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of RuneQuest Rules Digest V2 #49 ************************************ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@mpgn.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. RuneQuest is a Trademark of Hasbro/Avalon Hill Games. With the exception of previously copyrighted material, unless specified otherwise all text in this digest is copyright by the author or authors, with rights granted to copy for personal use, to excerpt in reviews and replies, and to archive unchanged for electronic retrieval.