From: owner-runequest-rules@lists.imagiconline.com (RuneQuest Rules Digest) To: runequest-rules-digest@lists.imagiconline.com Subject: RuneQuest Rules Digest V2 #143 Reply-To: runequest-rules@lists.imagiconline.com Sender: owner-runequest-rules@lists.imagiconline.com Errors-To: owner-runequest-rules@lists.imagiconline.com Precedence: bulk RuneQuest Rules Digest Friday, September 3 1999 Volume 02 : Number 143 RuneQuest is a trademark of Hasbro/Avalon Hill Games. All Rights Reserved. TABLE OF CONTENTS [RQ-RULES] Death by DI [RQ-RULES] Death by DI [RQ-RULES] Awakening our spiritual part Re: [RQ-RULES] Death by DI Re: [RQ-RULES] Death by DI and overDIing [RQ-RULES] DMD - Mephistopheles for RQ/Greyhawk SV: [RQ-RULES] DMD - Mephistopheles for RQ/Greyhawk Re: SV: [RQ-RULES] DMD - Mephistopheles for RQ/Greyhawk RE: [RQ-RULES] Webpage RE: [RQ-RULES] Webpage RULES OF THE ROAD 1. Do not include large sections of a message in your reply. Especially not to add "Yeah, I agree" or "No, I disagree." Or be excoriated. If someone writes something good and you want to say "good show" please do. But don't include the whole message you praise. 2. Use an appropriate Subject line. 3. Learn the art of paraphrasing: Don't just quote and comment on a point-by-point basis. 4. No anonymous posting, please. Don't say something unless you're ready to stand by it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 08:38:45 -0400 (EDT) From: simon_hibbs@lycosmail.com Subject: [RQ-RULES] Death by DI Andrew Barton : >By the letter of the RQ3 rule on DI, if the player roles a number >equal to the character's POW, the spirit is indeed reduced to POW 0 >before going to the service of its god. I'd find this statement much easier to acept if you quoted the wording from the rules that you have the problem with. I, and I'm sure many others, don't have the RQ3 rulebook to hand when using email so i find it impossible to verify or comment meaningfully on this statement. >This makes no sense, though. It is clearly stated elsewhere >that a spirit with POW 0 'ceases to exist, even spiritually'. >I think the DI rule is a drafting error. Quite possibly. I think it's clearly not the intent of the rulebook to imply that the gods are served by the 0 POW spirits of those that have been chosen to join them. >I've always followed the RQ2 rule: a DI roll equal to POW means >that the spirit goes to serve its god, but retains its POW. It's the sensible interpretation, yes. It's somewhat depressing that there's even any argument about it. Jim Gould : >Sort of like pouring a glass of water with a goldfish in it into another >glass. If you dump the whole thing, the goldfish goes, too. > >In the case of POW loss due to things like Soul Waste, there's no water left >for the goldfish. *laughs* That's excellent! Richard : >Wandering a bit from the topic, how many GMs out there gave every NPC their DI >roll? In my view, the players are not ordinary people and so I do not expect the rules applied to them to be exactly the same as the rules applied to all NPCs. I don't think the DI rules can be applied across the whole population in a rigorous manner. Of course the chpoice of where you draw the line is up to the individual GM and the style of campaign. In mine, the rules serve the purpose of helping me run games set in Glorantha, rather than glorantha merely being a colourfull backdrop for my RQ3 game. It's a good point that it may well be reasonable to give at least some prominent NPCs DI chances. Simon Hibbs *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.imagiconline.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 08:39:21 -0400 (EDT) From: simon_hibbs@lycosmail.com Subject: [RQ-RULES] Death by DI Bob Stancliff : >> Simon Hibbs >> Are you saying that the rain god is incapable of making >> it rain unless we worship him each time? You are >> clearly an unbeliever to doubt to power of the gods so. > > You have this so backward... A DI is a specific request for a miracle in >exchange for unsacrificed (current) Pow. No one DI's for Orlanth to >bring rain in his good time, but if you want it NOW then you better be >prepared to give up several Pow to bring clouds and cause precipitation, >because the god is not going to foot the bill for a requested miracle >within Time. That would break the Covenant. Would it? I'm not so sure. I don't remember reading any fine print in the myths which says that divine aid can only be granted in exchange for a pound or fl.... er, characteristic POW. I see no reason why the loyal sevice of one's soul in the heavenly host for 101 years, or whatever, couldn't count as quite a sufficient sacrifice. In order for magic to be worked a link has to be established with the 'other side'. This is usualy done through sacrificing Magic points, for minor magic and POW for major magic. However there are other ways to contact the otherworld and provide a conduit through which the gods can influence the world. The death of a living creature is one way to establish a link with the otherworld. When a living thing dies it looses no POW, yet a link with the otherworld is established through which the deceased spirit can enter the underworld. I believe that in the case of a character dying on a DI roll it is their death that opens the way and allows the god to act, where normaly POW has to be expended to create the link. You say this of the spirits of those slain through DI : > A normal summon ghost should bring it back to ask it's opinion. If the >spirit wants to remain with the gods it will be hostile, if it is willing >to listen it will be neutral, and if it wants to help it will be friendly. What is the POW of such a ghost? I believe (form memory) that the spell requires me to enter into spirit combat with it. What are it's MPs? Simon Hibbs *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.imagiconline.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 08:59:16 -0400 (EDT) From: simon_hibbs@lycosmail.com Subject: [RQ-RULES] Awakening our spiritual part Brad Furst : >I would be pleased to discover that the above quote was the final word on >this subject, because I think Philip is correct. Real World metaphyicians >recognize that there is more to life and existence than a life >parameterized by POWer. They may use words like ba or ka or spirit or >soul; I don't want to argue terminology. POW 0 is a dead body, but the >intangible potential (for example, that part which in RQ is awakened >usually only by shamans) remains whether or not RQ has parameters for use >away from the material plane. Remember that that intangible potential >exists for other RQ characters, too. It is just that RQ has provisions >only for shamans to use it. Not so. Theists have their Allied Spirits and Sorcerers have their Familiars. In metaphysical terms each of these, along with the Shaman's Fetch, is the spiritual manifestation of the magicican's otherworldly self. The equivalent for Mystics is probably supposed to be a secret, but not a very well kept one. Animism is the most primitive of the magical traditions and to the magician's magical counterpart is the most obviously ephemeral and unpersonalised. Theists are next up the theological evolutionary ladder and their spirit world allies are immaterial, but take on a more individualised form. Sorcerers are materialists - their familiars are fromerly incomplete creatures made whole through the donation of part of the magician's being. However, the symbology is still there. get greg talking about this sort of thing at a convention and he'll go on about it for hours and hours. Simon Hibbs *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.imagiconline.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 11:20:05 -0400 From: "Bob Stancliff" Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Death by DI > I see no reason why the loyal sevice of one's soul > in the heavenly host for 101 years, or whatever, couldn't count > as quite a sufficient sacrifice. As a loyal follower, you are going to spend a huge portion of your afterlife aiding your god, so there is no reason for the god to take you early to something you are going to do anyway. The god certainly doesn't care about time, so he is in no hurry. > In order for magic to be worked a link has to be established > with the 'other side'. I don't necessarily agree, but I will accept the premise. > The death of a living creature is one way to establish a link > with the otherworld. When a living thing dies it looses no POW, yet a link > with the otherworld is established through which the deceased spirit can > enter the underworld. The link between the soul and the spirit world always existed. The spirit was sent from the otherworld to be born. Removing the spirit from the body allows the spirit to return to its natural home. There is no 'portal' or newly created link. A sacrifice is a completely different process. The spell of a sacrifice uses the death of a creature to power the magic of some kind of summoning so that the caster doesn't have to. Without the sacrifice spell to redirect the victim's spirit, the victim would simply die. > > A normal summon ghost should bring it back to ask it's opinion. If the > >spirit wants to remain with the gods it will be hostile, if it is willing > >to listen it will be neutral, and if it wants to help it will be friendly. > > What is the POW of such a ghost? I believe (from memory) that the spell > requires me to enter into spirit combat with it. What are it's MPs? The Daka Fal 'Summon Ancestor' doesn't require a spirit combat. The spirit would have Pow and MP's =0, which would make it easy to coerce or control, if that were desired, but the intention of summoning it was to Gift Pow so that it would be stronger. Bob *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.imagiconline.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 1 Sep 1999 22:16:26 +0100 From: Michael Cule Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Death by DI and overDIing In message <37CC4E65.D1C6168F@idirect.com>, Richard Pace writes >Wandering a bit from the topic, how many GMs out there gave every NPC their DI >roll? Whenever I remember to yes. The only game I recall which specifically gives PCs only this bonus was one of the versions of Tekumel. - -- Michael Cule *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.imagiconline.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Sep 1999 12:31:42 -0400 From: Tal Meta Subject: [RQ-RULES] DMD - Mephistopheles for RQ/Greyhawk Lords of the Nine MEPHISTOPHELES Runes: Law (Malign), Evil, Ice Ruler of Caina, Eighth Layer of the Hells, sometimes known as the Icy Prince. Cult in the World From his citadel of Mephistar, perched upon the mighty glacier Nargus, Mephistopheles rules Caina with an iron fist and a cold, hard, logic. Caina is considered the domain of those who committed Heresy, and in many cases it is populated by failed Heroes, as well (in many cultures, attempting to become a god is the blackest of heresies...). Though his runic ties are strongest to Ice, he has a acquired a number of powers linked to the Infinity Rune, as well. Should Mephistopheles become more powerful than he is today (by overthrowing Asmodeus, for example), it is entirely likely that these ties would solidify into a full association with the Infinity Rune. Among scholars of the diabolical, Mephistopheles is among the most misunderstood of the Host. Ranked third in power and prestige (behind Baalzebub and Asmodeus), he is nonetheless seen as perhaps the next successor to the throne of Hell. Mephistopheles never has a large number of servants in the world, but those he has have served him for centuries. The very nature of Mephistopheles' gifts insure that those who serve him will do so for a great number of years to come. Manifestations Mephistopheles generally takes the form of of a tall, indigo colored humanoid with a diabolicaly handsome appearance. Strong muscles ripple on his frame, and his hair is a dull, nonreflective black. His wings, horns and claws are a vivd shade of dark blue, as well. When summoned to this plane, the cold of his own demense accompanies him, freezing nearby liquids and sending blistering cold gusts of wind in every direction. When he speaks, Mephistopheles voice is a whisper, carried on the coldest breeze of all. Lesser Contracts Requirements: Mephistopheles is cautious about those whom he enters into bargains with. Supplicants must already have achieved acolyte or similar status in another cult, and be willing to subvert it's teachings to become more in tune with those of the Icy Prince. In return, Mephistopheles will give his servant the following rewards: v) For each point of POW sacrificed, the supplicant create an effect similar to Evoke Cold, with a number of Art levels equal to twice the POW sacrificed. This is useable once per week. 3) For this sacrifice, the supplicant gains the services of an imp to serve as both a familiar and an advisor for a period of 1 year. 6) For this sacrifice, the supplicant gains one service from an Ice Devil. It may be called upon (once) whenever it is needed, to guard the supplicant or to seek out and slay his enemies, or whatever else is appropriate. In any case, the service cannot take more than 24 hours to complete. Greater Contracts Requirements: Mephistopheles demands absolute obedience from those who would enter into a Greater Contract with him. In general, they must be willing to subvert everyone and everything around them to comply with the tenets of their master's philosphy, and be willing to destroy those whom they cannot subvert. In addition to the abilities above, the bearer of one of Mephistopheles Talismans may perform any of the following feats by utilizing the POW stored within their Talismans: 1) For each point of POW sacrificed, the supplicant may take one year from the lifespan of another, and add it to his own (this will not make him younger, it merely extends his allotted number of years. The 'victim' of this pilfering may not resist. 2) For this sacrifice, the supplicant may take a year from the life of another and use it to make himself younger. The target of this theft does not grow older, they merely suffer a shortening of their years, as above. 9) For this sacrifice, Mephistopheles will replace the living heart of the supplicant with one crafted of magical ice. This ice will not melt within the body, in fact, it will preserve the body in it's current state forever, so long as the supplicant never allows anything or anyone to touch the heart. This is the means by which Mephistopheles grants immortality to his servants. (Touching the heart is taken metaphorically, of course). Mephistopheles' Talismans are heart-shaped (human, not valentine), typically forged from an alloy of ice and tantulhor. Each radiates cold, and if dipped in water will freeze it at a rate of 1 cubic foot per minute, to a maximum number of cubic feet equal to the POW stored within itself. Spirit of Reprisal Duke Hutijin: Mephistopheles' primary envoy is Hutijin, a massive devil whose primary duties include commanding companies of pit fiends in his master's service. Those who cross Mephistopheles can expect that Hutijin will be sent to collect their souls and their Talismans. For all intents and purposes, Hutijin is a pit fiend, though one of exceptional intelligence and leadership ability. His head is shaped a bit differently, and his wings a bit smaller, but the stats for the normal pit fiend suffice to describe him. - -- talmeta@cybercomm.net - Heretic, Dilettante, & God-Machine ICQ - 12594453 AIM - talmeta Homepage - *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.imagiconline.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Sep 1999 19:25:51 +0200 From: "Erik Sieurin" Subject: SV: [RQ-RULES] DMD - Mephistopheles for RQ/Greyhawk > Mephistopheles' Talismans are heart-shaped (human, not valentine), >typically forged from an alloy of ice and tantulhor. What's tantulhor? Erik, who blithely ignores that curiosity killed the cat *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.imagiconline.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 02 Sep 1999 15:27:57 -0400 From: Tal Meta Subject: Re: SV: [RQ-RULES] DMD - Mephistopheles for RQ/Greyhawk Erik Sieurin wrote: > > > Mephistopheles' Talismans are heart-shaped (human, not valentine), > >typically forged from an alloy of ice and tantulhor. > > What's tantulhor? A metal similar in weight to iron, that can be worked into a smooth, nearly unbreakable finish. Figure that with the right combinations, items made from an alloy of this metal could have 2-6x the normal AP for their type. Of course, the process of alloying metal and ice is unlikely to be something the devils are willing to share... (I'm borrowing it from Ed Greenwood's articles on the Nine Hells, published in Dragon 75, 76, and 91.) - -- talmeta@cybercomm.net - Heretic, Dilettante, & God-Machine ICQ - 12594453 AIM - talmeta Homepage - *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.imagiconline.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 2 Sep 1999 16:47:08 -0500 From: "Pastorello, Michael" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Webpage Hello all. I am starting a new campaign in Houston and was searching on the web for a points based character generation system. I used this system previously but cannot find my copy's of them. If anyone knows where they are now posted on the web I would really appreciate it if you could point me in the right direction. Thanks. Mike Pastorello *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.imagiconline.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 1999 08:52:29 +0100 From: "Hibbs, Philip" Subject: RE: [RQ-RULES] Webpage http://members.xoom.com/_XOOM/wakboth/chargen.htm Philip Hibbs http://www.snark.freeserve.co.uk/ Opinions expressed may not even be my own, let alone those of any organisations, nations, species, or schools of thought to which I may be affiliated. *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.imagiconline.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of RuneQuest Rules Digest V2 #143 ************************************* *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.imagiconline.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. 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