From: owner-runequest-rules@lists.ient.com (RuneQuest Rules Digest) To: runequest-rules-digest@lists.ient.com Subject: RuneQuest Rules Digest V4 #28 Reply-To: runequest-rules@lists.imagiconline.com Sender: owner-runequest-rules@lists.ient.com Errors-To: owner-runequest-rules@lists.ient.com Precedence: bulk RuneQuest Rules Digest Wednesday, April 11 2001 Volume 04 : Number 028 RuneQuest is a trademark of Hasbro/Avalon Hill Games. All Rights Reserved. TABLE OF CONTENTS Re: [RQ-RULES] Stormbringer Summoning Rules Re: [RQ-RULES] Stormbringer Summoning Rules Re: [RQ-RULES] MNM's elementals in general Re: [RQ-RULES] MNM's elementals in general Re: [RQ-RULES] MNM's elementals in general RULES OF THE ROAD 1. Do not include large sections of a message in your reply. Especially not to add "Yeah, I agree" or "No, I disagree." Or be excoriated. If someone writes something good and you want to say "good show" please do. But don't include the whole message you praise. 2. Use an appropriate Subject line. 3. Learn the art of paraphrasing: Don't just quote and comment on a point-by-point basis. 4. No anonymous posting, please. Don't say something unless you're ready to stand by it. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2001 00:38:35 -0000 From: "Leon Kirshtein" Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Stormbringer Summoning Rules > > > > Here are a couple of sample demons from the book: > > > >From which book? Those are new to me. > >In the Stormbringer with which I'm familiar all demons are custom >designed, it doesn't include anything like demon "races". > >As far as I was aware that notion didn't appear until the Elric! >re-write. Did I miss something? > I believe it was in the Stormbringer 3rd or 4th Edition it also appeared in the Sorcerers of Pan Tang supplement. Leon Kirshtein www.geocities.com/leonbk/ "No good deed shall go unpunished." _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.ient.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2001 20:14:28 -0600 From: Stephen Posey Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] Stormbringer Summoning Rules Leon Kirshtein wrote: > > > > > > > Here are a couple of sample demons from the book: > > > > > > > >From which book? Those are new to me. > > > >In the Stormbringer with which I'm familiar all demons are custom > >designed, it doesn't include anything like demon "races". > > > >As far as I was aware that notion didn't appear until the Elric! > >re-write. Did I miss something? > > I believe it was in the Stormbringer 3rd or 4th Edition it also appeared in > the Sorcerers of Pan Tang supplement. Hmmm, I didn't realize there were any such drastic changes to the rules across editions like that. I'll have to track down a newer version. Thanks for the info. In any case, I've created a synopsys of the 1st Edition Demon Summoning Rules if anyone's interested. Stephen Posey slposey@concentric.net *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.ient.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2001 14:18:42 +0300 (EEST) From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Marko_Per=E4l=E4?= Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] MNM's elementals in general Thanks for your comments MurfNMurf@aol.com. I liked the ideas, although I think you thought variant elementals as too powerful. I was thinking of more like 3d6 damage to lava-gnome. Arterall even if did melt stone the melting would not happen in one or two mr but after a minute or two. It simply doesn't conduct heat as well as metal of same temperature. 3d6 should be enough for that purpose unless the target is entirely engulfed, in which case the damage could be doubled. Also i'd not think lava-gnome as a hybrid of elementals, since lava-gnome is made of loose earth, even if the loose part is because of intence heat that keeps stone molten. And usable for summoning gnomes. That would also be a balancing factor, since cooling the lava-gnome would turn it to stone and destroy or paralyse it. The POT of acid and poison gas in undine and sylph is dependant on materials used in summoning and not of the elemental itself. That'd also balance these elementals, because undine needs to have atleast 95% of water in it, which limits the POT of acid. I don't know how much. Sylphs POT of poison doesn't really need limits, because having a poison cloud of serious strength would be very expensive to create. Even if an actual stoorworm cloud would be used at right time, its POT would decrease, before elemental would have settled to the cloud. Atleast this is the way I see these :) Marko Perälä *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.ient.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2001 10:54:35 EDT From: MurfNMurf@aol.com Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] MNM's elementals in general - --part1_d6.4e727b2.2805ca2b_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 4/11/01 6:25:14 AM Central Daylight Time, Marko writes: > Thanks for your comments MurfNMurf@aol.com. I liked the ideas, although I > think you thought variant elementals as too powerful. I was thinking of > more like 3d6 damage to lava-gnome. Arterall even if did melt stone the > melting would not happen in one or two mr but after a minute or two. Well, like going by the _book's_ definition of lava damage, I thought it might be a lil _too_ high powered, but your 3D6 suggestion certainly doesn't make them _quite_ 13D6 scarry; which makes me a lil less nervous :) On the one hand I like the 3D6 idea, but on the other I'm just assuming that lava would be of some unknown magnitude _hotter_ than flames. If not 3D6, then some _other_ number between 3 & 13D6. As far as melting stone goes, a couple of minutes as opposed to a couple of melees sure sounds reasonable to me, but then that made we wonder about actual, RW lava. Just how quickly would lava be able to melt stone? Any members of the list out there have a decent Lava Lore%? > simply doesn't conduct heat as well as metal of same temperature. 3d6 > should be enough for that purpose unless the target is entirely engulfed, > in which case the damage could be doubled. I like the idea of double damage for being engulfed. very nasty. For a minute I was wondering whether it'd be appropo, since none of the other Elementals can do double damage with engulfment. But we're not talking getting set on mere _fire_ or somesuch here, we're talking being swallowed up by molten _lava_; so sure, why not? Hell, why not allow the poor sucker engulfed a roll to hold his breath, too? lol! > as a hybrid of elementals, since lava-gnome > of loose earth, even if the loose part is because of intence heat that keeps stone > molten. And > usable for summoning gnomes. That would also be a balancing factor, since > cooling the lava-gnome would turn it to stone and destroy or paralyse it. I got into the whole hybrid thing wondering how exactly to game-mechanics the liquid/solid/fire aspects of something made of lava.Treating the Lava Elemental as essentially a flaming Gnome mechanics-wise would be very easy to do (and would get rid of my headache as well). Of course, the Gnome's pit attack becomes much nastier in this case; no dropping into a pit, then trying to jump out before SR 10 when it closes up. I could see it being more a case of the Elemental flowing beneath the ground, then quick-heating the ground away under the target so the target then drops into a pit of lava and takes double damage. Any Lava Lore experts out there have any idea how fast lava flows? Or flows averagely (is that even a word?)? I know it comes out of the ground, and obviously moves at different rates, depending... > The POT of acid and poison gas in undine and sylph is dependant on > materials used in summoning and not of the elemental itself. > So this'd be your average specimen, but it sucks up the desired agent from some sort of large container full of the stuff before causing trouble then? > also balance these elementals, because undine needs to have atleast > 95% of > water in it, which limits the POT of acid. I don't know how much. Sylphs > POT of poison doesn't really need limits, because having a poison cloud of > serious strength would be very expensive to create. Expensive moneywise, I guess? I can see it. If you want to have a 10m3 Acid Undine, assuming a 95% water content, that'd work out to be 05% of 10m3 of poison; something like what, 500 liters of acid?$$$$$$$$$$ :) > stoorworm cloud would be used at right time, its POT would > decrease, > before elemental would have settled to the cloud. > Atleast this is the way I see these :) > I meant using a Stoorworm's (if that's even the right Creature) gas/poison cloud as the basis, game mechanics-wise, for performing this Poison Sylph's attack. I'm kind of at a loss to explain just _how_ the Sylph absorbs the Poison gas myself. Maybe it could just _suck_ the gas out of whatever _cavity_ the Stoorworm stores the stuff in (Yuuuck!), in the same way the Undine can suck the air out of a waterbreather? A good source for gas/poison cloud attack mechanics is the "No Man's Land" book for Call of Cthulhu, btw. Best of Luck. -Ken Murphy- - --part1_d6.4e727b2.2805ca2b_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 4/11/01 6:25:14 AM Central Daylight Time, Marko writes:


Thanks for your comments MurfNMurf@aol.com. I liked the ideas, although I
think you thought variant elementals as too powerful. I was thinking of
more like 3d6 damage to lava-gnome. Arterall even if did melt stone the
melting would not happen in one or two mr but after a minute or two.

  
  Well, like going by the _book's_ definition of lava damage, I thought it
might be a lil _too_ high powered, but your 3D6 suggestion certainly doesn't
make them _quite_ 13D6 scarry; which makes me a lil less nervous :)
  On the one hand I like the 3D6 idea, but on the other I'm just assuming
that lava would be of some unknown magnitude _hotter_ than flames. If not
3D6, then some _other_ number between 3 & 13D6.
  As far as melting stone goes, a couple of minutes as opposed to a couple
of melees sure sounds reasonable to me, but then that made we wonder about
actual, RW lava. Just how quickly would lava be able to melt stone? Any
members of the list out there have a decent Lava Lore%?

  It
simply doesn't conduct heat as well as metal of same temperature. 3d6
should be enough for that purpose unless the target is entirely engulfed,
in which case the damage could be doubled.


  I like the idea of double damage for being engulfed. very nasty. For a
minute I was wondering whether it'd be appropo, since none of the other
Elementals can do double damage with engulfment. But we're not talking
getting set on mere _fire_  or somesuch here, we're talking being swallowed
up by molten _lava_; so sure, why not? Hell, why not allow the poor sucker
engulfed a roll to hold his breath, too? lol!

  Also i'd not think lava-gnome
as a hybrid of elementals, since lava-gnome
is made
of loose earth, even if the loose part is because of intence heat
that keeps stone
molten. And
usable for summoning gnomes. That would also be a balancing factor, since
cooling the lava-gnome would turn it to stone and destroy or paralyse it.


   I got into the whole hybrid thing wondering how exactly to game-mechanics
the liquid/solid/fire aspects of something made of lava.Treating the Lava
Elemental as essentially a flaming Gnome mechanics-wise would be very easy to
do (and would get rid of my headache as well). Of course, the Gnome's pit
attack becomes much nastier in this case; no dropping into a pit, then trying
to jump out before SR 10 when it closes up. I could see it being more a case
of the Elemental flowing beneath the ground, then quick-heating the ground
away under the target so the target then drops into a pit of lava and takes
double damage.
  Any Lava Lore experts out there have any idea how fast lava flows? Or
flows averagely (is that even a word?)? I know it comes out of the ground,
and obviously moves at different rates, depending...

 The POT of acid and poison gas in undine and sylph is dependant on
materials used in summoning and not of the elemental itself.

  So this'd be your average specimen, but it sucks up the desired agent  
from some sort of large container full of the stuff before causing trouble
then?

That'd
also balance these elementals, because undine needs to have atleast
95% of
water in it, which limits the POT of acid. I don't know how much. Sylphs
POT of poison doesn't really need limits, because having a poison cloud of
serious strength would be very expensive to create.


  Expensive moneywise, I guess? I can see it. If you want to have a 10m3
Acid Undine, assuming a 95% water content, that'd work out to be 05% of 10m3
of poison; something like what, 500 liters of acid?$$$$$$$$$$ :)

Even if an actual
stoorworm cloud would be used at right time, its POT would
decrease,
before elemental would have settled to the cloud.
 Atleast this is the way I see these :)

  I meant using a Stoorworm's (if that's even the right Creature) gas/poison
cloud as the basis, game mechanics-wise, for performing this Poison Sylph's
attack. I'm kind of at a loss to explain just _how_ the Sylph absorbs the
Poison gas myself. Maybe it could just _suck_ the gas out of whatever
_cavity_ the Stoorworm stores the stuff in (Yuuuck!), in the same way the
Undine can suck the air out of a waterbreather?
  A good source for gas/poison cloud attack mechanics is the "No Man's Land"
book for Call of Cthulhu, btw.
  
  Best of Luck.
 -Ken Murphy- - --part1_d6.4e727b2.2805ca2b_boundary-- *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.ient.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 11 Apr 2001 19:51:35 +0300 (EEST) From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Marko_Per=E4l=E4?= Subject: Re: [RQ-RULES] MNM's elementals in general MurfNMurf@aol.com wrote > Well, like going by the _book's_ definition of lava damage, I thought it >might be a lil _too_ high powered, but your 3D6 suggestion certainly doesn't >make them _quite_ 13D6 scarry; which makes me a lil less nervous :) > On the one hand I like the 3D6 idea, but on the other I'm just assuming >that lava would be of some unknown magnitude _hotter_ than flames. You forget that 3d6 is already magically enhanced fire and there are not many who'd have contact with that immence heat any more than a blink of an eye. Stone lets only a little amount of heat out so a brief touch will not be much more dangerous than that. The real damage happens when gnome gets a good hold of a victim. Lava-gnome engulfing victim does 6d6 damage. That is the way I remember salamanders doing it. Engulf = 3d6 and brief touch = half of that. > Any Lava Lore experts out there have any idea how fast lava flows? Or >flows averagely (is that even a word?)? I know it comes out of the ground, >and obviously moves at different rates, depending... I'm not an expert, but I do know that lava is a lot heavier than water. Therefore it moves a lot slower in nature. ( 1/5 of waters move perhaps ) Of course this doesn't apply to gnomes, since they move on elementals power, not the speed of lifeless material. Lava is more flexible than rocky dirt so lava-gnome might move faster than regular ones. > Expensive moneywise, I guess? I can see it. If you want to have a 10m3 >Acid Undine, assuming a 95% water content, that'd work out to be 05% of >10m3 of poison; something like what, 500 liters of acid?$$$$$$$$$$ :) You got it right. Also it has to be remembered that acid are rarely pure acid in them selves. 500 liters of pure acid is very rare mixture. 10m3 of acid normally has a concentration of only 0,01 percent. Having more of pure acid would be so powerful that the acid-undine would burn its way through the ground. 500 liters of pure acid would be extraordinary and very impractical. 50 liters is more like it. A true sadist could do a lot with an evoke acid-spell. It can save lots of money in acid-making, although it is a very easy spell to misuse. I remember one trap I invented before thinking these variant elementals was a room that was an undine binding enchantment. When unwanted people enter it, door animates and shut itself and undine fills the room. Then it makes a hole in the middle of itself. Then an evoke acid spells targeted there. Finally the undine sucks victims to the acid. Great for hostage situations! Make the undine kill your captors and separate you from them in the process. The undine can pull you away and put you to a corner with an air pocket. Acid won't even harm structures, because the undine is in between. I presume an undine can keep liquids from mixing up even if it could't undo a mixture that has already happened. >I'm kind of at a loss to explain just _how_ the Sylph absorbs the >Poison gas myself. Maybe it could just _suck_ the gas out of whatever >_cavity_ the Stoorworm stores the stuff in (Yuuuck!), in the same way the >Undine can suck the air out of a waterbreather? I think that if an elemental is wanted to have a special ability like ones discussed here, they would have to be part of the original materials used in the summoning so elemental would manifest itself into them and have them from the beginnning. If a sylph sucked poison from a stoorworm corpse, it would not stay as a permanent part of it but as an impurity that fades away in time. Marko Perälä *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.ient.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. ------------------------------ End of RuneQuest Rules Digest V4 #28 ************************************ *************************************************************************** To unsubscribe from this list send mail to majordomo@lists.imagiconline.com with the line 'unsubscribe runequest-rules' as the body of the message. RuneQuest is a Trademark of Hasbro/Avalon Hill Games. With the exception of previously copyrighted material, unless specified otherwise all text in this digest is copyright by the author or authors, with rights granted to copy for personal use, to excerpt in reviews and replies, and to archive unchanged for electronic retrieval.