Re: So what've we got for John?

From: Joerg Baumgartner <joe_at_...>
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 13:58:59 +0200 (CEST)


>John Hughes
>> As someone who has devoted a lot of time in the past to developing
>> the Whitewall story, both in game background, scenario seeds and
>> fiction (Kallyrkala), I will make an effort to have this information
>> available to the tribe in a convenient format concurrent with or
>> before the publication of any Whitewall supplement. Obviously, many
>> people here have made similar investments, and I invite anyone
>> interested to think about articles for publication. If there is
>> interest and energy, we can move more quickly. An enormous amount has
>> already been done. I would be looking at either a series of free PDFs
>> in magazine format or, if there is interest, perhaps a special issue
>> of one of the fanzines.

> OK, from my memories of the WIKI and various people's work, this is what
> we've got, and what we'd like to have but haven't got. The Wiki's had
> problems in the last year or so: Charles has been busy with other things,
> and I haven't ben able to edit it for ages: don't know about other people?

I think I encountered similar problems last time I tried to work on the Wiki.

> I did consider starting up a� new Wiki and transferring and tidying both
> at the same time, but then went back to writing fiction instead.

Let's make a call for volunteers as soon as we have a platform.

> Physical layout of the general area and of the City itself: got, mostly.

In text. What I would like to have is a 2D or better 3D map of the place.

> We never detailed the various underground
> parts and tunnels, but probably best not to tie those down anyway. We have
> maps, we have locations of important
> sites, we have descriptions of many of them (I have a few to transfer from
> works of fiction).

All maps made by me are in an early develomental stage, and I would adapt them to any required or wanted changes.

That would include changes to incorporate material from the History of the Heortling Peoples - a course which I would advocate.

All the myths we made can be kept, anyway - even if HotHP marks them as "factually wrong", they could have been made right in the Imperial Age by either of the three conflict partners (GLs, EWF or Old Day Traditionalists).

> Overall timeline, general trends, major events: got.

> Detailed timeline: spotty, and probably best left that way. Tying things
> down tightly makes it less useable.

Agreed. If we produce a campaign arc, it should provide a topology of events/adventure opportunites, rather than a fixed schedule, unless High Holy Days figure so importantly that there is no way around them.

> NPCs on the Orlanthi side:
> Got some, but some gaping holes.
> In particular, we have no real idea of most of Broyan's Ring: the
> non-Sartarite part of it. I seem to remember Jeff
> coming up with a list of names - but that's all it was, just a list of
> names that might as well have come off the
> Random Heortling Name Generator for all the good it did. The "locals"
> should outnumber our Sartarites, so we need
> to do some development there.
> Donald and I know about one or two minor Volsaxi clans, though haven't
> named them, and one Volsaxi warband (but it gets wiped out in 1619, so
> doesn't help much).
> Then again, we're not trying to produce a complete WW Book (are we? are
> you?) and perhaps the reason we haven't produced anything about the
> Volsaxi is the same reason they probably aren't needed: no-one's
> interested, because we all start our campaigns in Sartar!

I think that the Volsaxi influence is not that great - after all their lands get overrun by the Lunars while Brian is holed up.

> Sartarites: yes, we know about them, in exhaustive detail. Rob did a lot
> of work on how they interact, in particular.
>
> The Aeolians have been mentioned recently: do we have any?
> Would any of the herobands from existing publications be likely to show up
> here?

I think there would be some (as well as ordinary Hendriki) outside the walls, later on in the siege. If only as ditch diggers or hostages' entourage.

> NPCs on the Lunar side:
> At least here we're balanced. We know things about the commanders, we
> have a fair idea of the units present at any given time.

We sort of lack some colour in the understructure - camp followers, Lunar camp life...

> An overview of logistics: supplies needed, stores held, what has to be
> imported. This is where the "sneaking
> supplies into Whitewall" scenario will come in, so we do need to get the
> background consistent. An area where we
> seem to have produced a lot of the wacky ideas on the fringes as one-off
> things to try, but not the basic everyday
> essentials. Also, Donald and I had to look at supply routes when trying
> to get Penny's work to fit, and we need to
> integrate that.

> Mythic history, magical strong points and weaknesses:
> we've had some good ideas there, but they need tidying up and making sure
> they're consistent.
> What temples are where, how the basic magical defences work, what changes
> when Orlanth becomes more and more tied to WW.
> The idea, which I love, that the Orlanthi did a "double-dare", accepted
> that Orlanth was going to die, and made
> sure that it would be on their terms, escalating the whole thing as a
> result.

> Broyan's tie-in with Vingkot - make sure we know how this works, and what
> long-term quests he and his ring are
> doing when.

In that case you will have to deal with the "what an abomination, he has the Kodigvari tattoos" theme introduced in Greg's "10 women well loved" draft (Harmastsaga located in Heortland) and subsequently applied to Broyan as well (which, to be fair, may have been alluded to but never stated already in King of Sartar).

> Big events in detail:

> We have detail: far too much detail! about the Bat. What we actually need
> is enough freedom that the real answer is "your players did it". Give some
> options, and enough basic facts that the GM can invent what they need,
> perhaps. A collection of ways in which the Bat has been dealt with so far?

In that case add Arkat overcoming the bat (and skinning it) in the First Age.

> The final fall: again, we can come up with plenty of ideas, but how the
> players can get involved will vary
> enormously from one group to another, and what really happens will have to
> be variable to let it work for them.

The final fall, as I recall it, was rather disappointing, as far as player contributions go, unless your players are content to sit in the ice as one of the dozen or so companions of Broyan.

I'd hate to see "this far, we needed you, now go save your hindsides while we chosen few sit it out and bluff the Lunars", but I wouldn't be happier with "you join mighty King Broyan and his immediate circle in the ice". What I would like to see is Kallyr (or someone else) frantically organizing oodles of support heroquests/rites that keep the besieging Lunars mistaking the magical resistance of Broyan with active defense.

> We also have assorted works of fiction by many people, set in and around
> WW and the plots mentioned above. Quite what we do with them, I'm not
> sure. The various complete short stories can be sorted out: either publish
> as-is, or ransack them for scenario potential, or both.

I'd go the nostalgic way and make them sidebar stories as in Cults of Prax.

> OK, that was from memory. What did I miss?

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