> OK, this may be just a semantic quibble -- Yes, I used the term "misapplied
> mysticism" badly, especially since "misapplied" already has an in-game
> meaning.
It may have had in HQ1 but the term does not appear at all in HQ2 or (more suprisingly) Sartar: Kingdom of Heroes.
> Assuming you above scenario is correct, Sheng Selleris used a
> mystic insight in a non-mystic way (the bonus you describe),
No, he didn't use a mystical insight (if my scenario is correct). He became spiritually polluted (or non-transcendent) and _that_ conferred the bonus. A mystical insight is like understanding the Trinity. How are you going to abuse that to achieve worldly power?
> much the way
> that a lot of Illuminates use a partial mystic insight (say, "Good and Evil
> are both transient concepts that are irrelevant in the face of the Ultimate"
> or "as we are All One, Evil is a sort of stupid concept")
Illumination is one of two things. The classic circa RuneQuest position is the understanding that the world (and even its gods) are at some level unreal. Lunar Illumination is following the pattern of the Red Goddess to achieve mystical awareness - the state of occlusion IMO shouldn't be presented as a failing as it is in "Under the Red Moon" but a necessary stage for further illumination.
That's said, it's unclear to me how HQ2.0 will handle Lunar Illumination since they've done away with cult secrets (in the sense of each cult having secret knowledge or feats).
I do not believe that an illuminate's moral solipsism represents a perversion of a mystical insight (or fragment thereof). It is a legitimate conclusion from the insight and adopting it is not spiritually detrimental to the illuminate (although it may very well be practically detrimental to other people). True mystical insights are awarenesses or understandings of the ineffable (Durapdur, Dayzatar, Ouroboros or Irensavel) and are simply meaningless to abuse.
> This, I would think, should
> be the pattern for most failed mystics
Depends on what you mean by failed mystics. Do you mean the Zolathi who went through the Seleran Hells or the monks who had a slight relapse in their meditations? Looking at the literature, the failed mystics are primarily Seleran (in Genertela that is). I'm not aware of any Lunar, Nysaloran or even Dayzatar monk actually acting like a "failed mystic" You can easily have a former holy person turning to crime and banditry but I don't don't think such people qualify as failed mystics.
As for Seleran Zolathi, all that's needed is some bonus based on how long they spent in the torture camp which can't be improved.
> Ingolf is a slightly different case.
Ingolf is a draconist, not a mystic. In Vithelan Mythology, the dragon is associated with the demon Dogsalu who was the sum of the fears of the three magicians in trying to oppose Vith. He later became attuned towards the mystical idea but the only people that think he's any great are the untrustworthy Kralori snake-worshippers.
> His mystic path seems to have given him
> "cool mystic powers," which, as far as I can tell, he was supposed to not
> use in the world (except maybe in some sort of ritual way) until he was
> ready (presumably to become a dragon).
The trouble with this interpretation is compare it to all the other leaders of the EWF who use draconic powers like there's no tomorrow. Did anything bad happen to them _through_ the supposed misuse of their powers (ie not by being done in by their enemies and supposed friends)? Not as far as I can see.
So Ingolf was only supposed to use his powers in a ritual way? Are we seriously supposed to believe that the Long Mountain Dragon School did _not_ have a ritual for battle?
> I suppose those [draconic powers] might have been crazy
> spells, feats, or charms, but they seem different to me.
If anything, I consider Draconists (human and dragonewt) to be invoking a future you/me/it where the future you/me/it is a fully fledged true dragon. Since Dragons can transcend time and space, it only makes sense that they would aid themselves when they weren't a dragon. However the key flaw here is placing limits on their future you/me/it to render it impossible to exist or no longer true, which is done through improper use of draconic magic.
What Ingolf did IMO was selectively heroform portions of future himself and practically screw up his karma to no end. He may have been researching a safe way to do this he was forced to use it prematurely.
>I think this
> temptation to affect the world was possibly the problem of the EWF -- the
> more potential power the leadership gained, the greater the temptation to
> "settle" for being gods or similar worldly beings became, and more and more
> of the leadership fell for it, forgetting that the Dragons weren't remotely
> interested in that.
Except that I've pointed out before the key agent of betrayal was the Inhuman King and the Blue Moon Assassins. If the EWF succumbed to temptation, the manner of their end is curiously unmystical. Even the God Learners had a more fitting means of being destroyed by their own flaws.
--Peter Metcalfe
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