> Is Argrath White Bull the same person as Argrath of Pavis
> (I think probably, and if they are different people, then I think
>that neither of them is the same as Argrath the King)
Interesting! I think the reverse is the case! Rather than start a new thread about who Argrath the King really was (Was he a stickpicker? Was he a bastard son of a bitch?), I'll just observe that in light of such range of views, I doubt Greg will give you a straight answer...
> Possibly in an attempt to win an award for 'most obscure topic for
>discussion', I would like to refer back to an obscure point mentioned by
>John Hughes (as an aside in another discussion) about the significance of
>the list of Kallyrs companions not mentioning her 'Food Man' (though it
>does mention a her conventional cook). Now, I have still never heard of the
>significance of the position of 'Food Man' as an important companion to
>chief/ruler, though I would be interested to hear a reference - however it
>sounds reasonable enough to me - frex if the position was important, then
>Geo is obviously 'Food Man to Sartar'.
The Camp of *Umath* myth in KoS contains the full list including the foodman and the cook (BTW full marks to John for spotting that Foodman was left off Kallyr's list, it escaped me). Kallyr appears to have felt that the standard Orlanthi Ring was a bit too restrictive and decided to experiment with an older (more democratic? less patriachal?) form. As Argrath (King) does not follow such a system in his quests, Kallyr's experiment may have been unworkable.
> Now where this discussion is leading is to Johns theory that the
>Food Man of Kallyr was Argrath himself, tactfully omitted from later lists,
>so as not to cause any reminders of previous low station of the High King.
Or probable confusion with the origins of the King. I don't think Argrath the Foodman is the same as Argrath the King. But I won't go into this on the digest to spare the readers...
> The reason I bring up this theory is because Argrath is known to
>have accomplished the heroquest of the Dinking Giants Cauldron. What sort
>of thing is this cauldron? Is it a magical cornucopia or inexhaustible
>source of drink? If so it lends a lot of support to the theory that Argrath
>served Kallyr initially as provisioner. If it does not, what does it do?
>Cauldrons exist with all sorts of magical effects - the Black Cauldron of
>Welsh myth, which resurrests the dead, though struck dumb.
The Giant is Gantakavarn, IMO. He is mentioned in the Elder Secrets as the Orlanthi explanation for origin the Wanderers or Giants feet or whatever. Quaffing from the Cauldron probably gives Argrath the ability to command giants (which he does in Dragon Pass the Game).
John Hughes:
>Martin, I'm not sure what your engineer friend was getting at, or
>how it relates to my general point that harder, stronger, magical
>iron ploughs are an extremely valuable (if somewhat rare) tool in
>farming heavy rich clay soils that bronze or flint ploughs can't
>deal with.
I think the point is (I can't find the orginal comment) is that implements made out of wrought iron are *brittle*. Thus if a farmer using such a plow hits a stone, it could snap. As you are having the plows enchanted, I really don't see this happening.
>Heavier iron ploughs mean more effective exploitation of land,
>and the ability to exploit clay soils that otherwise cannot be
>farmed. (There's a reference somewhere from Greg that talks
>about the 'Lodril' plough - this is essentially the same
>technology. Can anyone point out the reference?)
I have seen the reference to the Lod-plow which is what you're talking about but I can't find it. Try 'making gods' essay in KoS. Given that the Pelorians really didn't have too much in the way of metalworking before Syranthir went on his Anabasis in 722 ST, I think the Lod plow is the Heavy Loskalmi Plow (which the Janubians use p12 Genertela book) under another name.
However, I really think the heavy plow is different from the 'ordinary' scratch plow in common use in Glorantha in that they require more bronze to be used in their construction. The scratch plow requires only a metal blade whereas for the heavy plow, the entire plowshare is made from metal. This still would drive up the price of the plow. An iron plow would be lighter thus increasing efficiency. The downside would be that it would be even more expensive. I think that only the wealthiest farms in Loskalm would have these.
>Human urine was a common export in ancient times, and for the
>same reasons. The Romans particularly valued Spanish urine,
>though this was probably due to the effects of evaporation during
>the long journey rather than any peculiarity of Spanish biology or
>diet.
Then how did they discover that Spanish Urine was good? Did roman merchants randomnly carry bags of urine into rome from far-off places to unload them on a guillible public? Evaporation would only increase the concentraion of the urine in which case egyptian piss would be just as valued. Rather I think that physiological effects, climate and/or diet are the probable cause. (for instance, whisky varies in quality depending on the place that it's made in).
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