Joerg made some good criticisms of one of my previous posts. Briefly on the prospect of other consort cults: As Peter mentioned, there is in fact a reference to Zorak Zoran as a consort cult, though like Peter I suspect that may have been an error. I will admit that the more I think about it, the less likely I find ZZ an option, though OTOH ZZ already functions perfectly well within a matriarchal culture, albeit a darkness one and in a marginalized role (though Earth and Darkness walk hand in hand, and technically ZZ ain't a troll). On Yelm/Elmal, that may be the result of my own ignorance; not having the Source on that one, I was under the impression that Elmal was more of a _Yelmalio_ mask (or, more accurately, source god/cult), not a Yelm one (whom I thought associated in his masks as Kargazant, Shargash, Buserian, and Morzharzarm). If I have erred on that point, thanks for setting me straight.
As I think of the Esrolians as practicing polyandry, I assumed that there was plenty of room for minor, quasi-historical (post-Compromise) consort cults aside from the Only Old One, though these may be little more than superlocal spirit or ancestor cults. Your Glorantha May Vary, of course.
Joerg also noted:
>The Holy Country navy was sponsored and crewed mainly by the (Rightarm)
>Isles, who received great revenues out of their trade fleet built since
1581.
As I mentioned somewhere within my last post, I assumed the Islands were heavily involved in the HC fleet; however, I would only want to point out that throughout RW history, being an island people has had little impact on whether or not someone can produce a standing fleet, as standing navies are more the product of centralized governments and organizational ability (think of some of the great naval powers of the ancient and medieval RW -- Greece, Spain, the Dutch, etc. Venice as a quasi-island comes to mind as a counterexample, but they possessed considerable mainland territory. Island peoples such as the English and Japanese were often much more succesful in producing heavy cavalry for long periods of time than they were in producing standing navies). I would tend to think of both Esrolia and the Islands as contributing to the HC fleet.
>IMO they inserted the troops into the wall, letting their spirits man the
>battlements forever. I posted this theory about two years ago...
Personally, I really like this idea, and in fits in with a kind of Flower Wars/Sacrificial King mentality; I don't find it incompatible with a standing, still-living garrison, though.
And on a potential hoplite parallel, Joerg wrote:
>Rather Swiss-guard or Macedon style, IMO - rather lightly armoured, but with
>long pikes, and long axes in the third and fourth rank.
I guess I have no problem with that, since both the Swiss and Macedonian foot were both well trained and highly disciplined, which is the main point of my argument; I will agree to disagree about whether or not Esrolia's wealth would provide its foot soldiers with armor. As a minor point about militias in general, the term has no definitional meaning in terms of training per se, though I will grant you that there is a connotation of poor quality (frex, out of the million names on the 16th century English militia rolls, only about 100,000 were trained). The characteristics of militias were that they were traditional and territorial by nature, and supplemented "regular" forces (which in Esrolia I continue to think of as the Orlanth, Yelm, et al. consort cultists and the Babeester/Maran Gors); if you prefer, I am more than happy to refer to them simply as "territorial foot contingents".
Peter Metcalfe noted the general absence of references to Esrolian military activity in most of the official sources, most notably KoS, but I think I would be willing to once again suggest that this may have more to do with a general void in writings on Esrolia than anything else, and that individual personages such as the Pharaoh and the OOO often seem to obscure what's going on in the individual territories/societies they come to symbolize. I would be willing to argue that the lack of such references could support the theory of a strong Esrolian defensive tradition, along the lines of David Cake's argument, that Esrolia is "quite vulnerable to raiders, but very difficult to invade", but at this point I think it better to simply agree to disagree.
Peter also noted:
>The Queen says something like 'I am the Land Goddess of them hills' or
>'I am the incarnation of Esrolia'. The rest follows naturally IMO.
Maybe I'm just being dense, but I'm not sure what "the rest" is. I agree that this is probably the language of the Queens and Ernalda/Esrola priestesses, but I was wondering more about the language and laws at the level of the actual farmer, whether Barntar or Ernalda follower. Do farmers speak of themselves as "in service to the matriarch", or as "leasing the Queen's land"? If the Queen is the Land and vice-versa, do farmers speak of "ploughing and sowing the Queen's Body"? Do they refer to themselves as "caretakers of the fields" and "consorts of the Earth", or self-consciously as serfs and thralls?
Just wondering aloud,
Mark
Powered by hypermail