Sorry about that last message. David Dunham finally showed me how to fix my e-mail system so that it doesn't give those annoying "=20" symbols (hopefully).
I'm resending that message so that it is (hopefully) readable: Nick Brooke wrote regarding the Red Goddess' philosophical acceptance of the existence of chaos:
>It's hard
>to see why Orlanthi don't react better to this: after all, their god
>is famous for making Horrible Mistakes and trying to clear them up
>afterwards, while his own brother's experiments with Chaos brought
>Wakboth the Devil (Orlanth's nephew, let's remember) into the world.
[fancy chart deleted]
>Quite a pedigree, eh? The gods of violence, madness, rape, evil, and
>barbarism all closely inter-related: somehow, I'm not surprised.
Obviously Nick is still wearing his Lunar professor of comparative religions hat. For the Orlanthi, kinstrife is perhaps the core of all tragedy and disaster. The Sword and Helmet Saga, the Lismelder/Malan Saga, Orlanth/Ragnaglar myths, and the Orlanth/Daga myths all contain kinstrife as the motive force for the ensuing tragedies.
In traditional Heortling saga cycles, I suspect that the killing of the Sun is NOT considered to be the cause of the Greater Darkness and the age of misery. Rather, I suspect that the Killing of the Sun heralds a the Storm Age cycle when Orlanth and his household establish themselves as the rightful rulers of Glorantha. Only once Orlanth is established as King of the Gods does the Ragnaglar Cycle begin.
The Orlanthi, IMO, tend to believe that the greatest threats do not come from the outside, but from within the greater community. This contrasts rather nicely with the Dara Happan cultural conceit that it is outsiders that ultimately threaten the "good community".
Thus, the Ragnaglar Cycle achieves its cultural power amongst the
Heortlings by combining kinstrife and the "threat from within" themes into
one really great tragic mythic - similar to Modred and Arthur. If chaos
was introduced by foreigners, the myth goes, Orlanth would have no
difficulty defeating it - as he had defeated so many others. But since
chaos and the Doom of the World
was introduced by his "Mad God" kinsman, chaos could not be defeated like
any old foreigner or stranger - hence the Lightbringers' Quest to ally with
those Orlanth had defeated/destroyed in order to save the world.
Along with kinstrife as the greatest source of evil, IMO the Heortlings also have a cultural conceit that "since things change", all solutions to dilemnas are only ad hoc. In their myths and sagas, survival often consists of chosing the lesser of two evils. Given their view of the world, chaos is always (in that Orlanthi sense of the word "all) the greater of the two evils.
So why don't the Orlanthi react better to the Goddess' philosophical
claims?
Well, IMO it depends on which Orlanth-worshippers you are talking to. Many
of the Northern Heortling tribes seem to have had very little difficulty
incorporating Rufelza worship into their pantheon - I'd be wouldn't be
suprised to see myths in Sylilia of the friendship between the Red Goddess
and [Orlanth]. Of course the Northern Heortlings were befriended before
Sheng
Seleris imprinted his legacy into the Lunar conciousness.
With the Sartarites and the other Southern Heortlings, the Lunar experience
was pretty much straight military occupation. Worse yet, it was directed
not by a great spiritual hero, but by traditional tribal foes - the "Lunar"
dynasty of Tarsh. The conquest of Sartar was achieved by using the Red Bat
and an alliance with Delecti's undead - hardly the sort of conquest that is
likely to
be accepted by the defeated tribes.
On the topic of Barntar, in my Taming of Dragon Pass Campaign, Barntar the Ploughsman is the most popular male diety in the pantheon. Barntar's rites allow a man to plow the field, to master his cattle (since Barntar did domesticate the bull), and to live the life of a proud carl. Essentially, Barntar is yet another mask of Orlanth, like Rex or Thunderer or Warrior, in this case, the male cultural hero cult. Whenever a man works the field or drives the plough, he follows the rites of Barntar.
In Taming of Dragon Pass, I've divided Orlanth worship into three loose categories:
Basic Cult of Orlanth (established by Heort): contains adult initiation rites, Common Divine Magic, basic Orlanth spells and spirits;
The "Easy Sub-Cults":
Barntar: agricultural magic and spirits; Thunderous: specialized storm magic and spirits - Storm Voice; Minor Council: an array of social magic (Lawspeaker, Goodvoice, Healer, Thief, etc.,) Lightning Spear: provides Lightning The "Hard Sub-Cults": Warrior: Four weapons subcult, flight - Wind Lords; Rex: Leadership magic - thanes; Lightbringer: Heroquest magic; Dragon: provides access to draconic magic [currently extinct]; Illuminate/Emperor: [currently extinct]
Every adult male in an Orlanthi clan belongs to the Basic Cult of Orlanth - this is the "pantheon" cult. Most men belong to one or more of the "Easy Sub-Cults", usually Barntar. The "Hard Sub-Cults" are the province of Rune Lords, Thanes, Kings and Heroes. Tightly linked to the Basic Cult of Orlanth is the Women's Cult of Ernalda, such that the cults for all practical purposes form one cult, that of Orlanth and Ernalda.
Of course, every clan and tribe has its own variations of this system. Some will have different "Easy" cults, different cults altogether, new cults, etc.,etc.,. All IMO of course.
Yours truly,
Jeff Richard
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