Me>>To many in Alkoth, Shargash is an Aspect or Mask of Yelm (like
>>Krishna is considered an avatar of Vishnu) and so there is no
>>conflict between worshipping Shargash and worshipping Yelm (like
>>there is no conflict between the Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ).
>I disagree, in Alkoth Shargash is _real_, he's really there and
>felt by all.
I'm not denying the _reality_ of Shargash. I'm just denying that they see Yelm and Shargash as being seperate. A 'Mask' is a Lunarism for this type of thing. Shargash is a manifestation of Yelm just as much as Alkor is a manifestation of Shargash is all that I meant to say.
>Also remember that to the Shargashi they obey Yelm but they also ruled
>themselves too. Many times Alkoth has been without an Emperor in Raibanth
>and they just keep going, making their own Kings or Emperors (Eusibus
>being the classic example).
Yelm does not equal Raibanth in the Alkothian or anybody's PoV. Yelm is just as much their God as he is the God of the Raibanthi. When Alkoth has ruled by itself or in an alliance with Terarir, the Alkothian Emperor/Tyrant/Green King will have ruled in the name of Yelm as well as Shargash IMO. The Emperor is in Raibanth for the same reason that the Pope is in Rome. The Alkothian will view the location of the Emperor in the same light as the Medieval French viewed the Papal seat: It is far better to have him in Avignon/Alkoth whenever possible.
>>Lastly I don't consider Yelm 'initiate' status to be solely noble
>>as it applies to citizens who join the Army.
>Uurk, but Yelm is a noble cult and a very small one at that (the last
>figures I saw were maybe 10-15,000 in the whole Empire - though these
>may be changed by Greg, they were fairly recent).
Yelm _Imperator_ is restricted to nobles and has always been. A large segment of Yelm the Elder are non-nobles and there is no prohibition for the lower ranks against accepting commoners. The commoners in the lower ranks are seen however as initiates of Hastatus, Sagittus or even Hyalor.
FWIW I don't feel the GOG/WW picture of the subcult of Yelm Imperator as a joint Runelord/Priest is correct anymore in that membership of the Imperator cult should be a mark of nobility. Methinks the Imperator is the Rune Level of the subcult but such is the scarcity of openings for Rune Level, most nobles pursue other paths (like joining the army, becoming a healer etc).
[On beserking]
>Well it is of course because the appearances are totally different.
>Shargashi don't foam, they are in control, actually they are also
>possessed by Shargash and their movements are fluid, powerful and
>look like a dance.
Interestingly they are described by outsiders as beserks. The Shargashi may see their trances as fluid, powerful dances but the outsider sees things differently. Furthermore Orlanth is thought by many to be a degenerate form of Shargash and the fighting styles of the Orlanthi have been described as beserking.
Powered by hypermail