Re: Glorantha Digest V4 #148

From: Chris Wehman <jcw_at_connecti.com>
Date: Sat, 1 Feb 1997 13:15:17 -0600


>>In fact, GRoy doesn't even list Saggitus and Hastatus as Yelm's
>>sons, does it? (I must admit, It's been a while since I last read
>GRoY).
>>
>Well, sort of. Hastatus is another name for Avivath the Avatar, who is an
>incarnation of Antirius, who is a Part of Yelm, which is sort of like a
>son.

You have your time line sort of messed up. Hastatus' former name is Avivorus, not
Avivath the one armed Avatar of Antirius. Avivorus was pissed at Orogoros' imperfection and (seemed like he DIed) prayed(badly) to Antirius and Antirius roasted the emperor. Then Avivorus ascended directly to Antirius(He rolled equal to his Pow?) where he got the new name.(Sorry abvout the RQisms)

Avivath is during the Dominions of Last evil,Avivath, and Antirius. He also roasts emperors. Similar, but I wonder how many Yelmites have Sunspear, I
would assume a lot. These two just used them to roast emperors.

Sagittus is another name for Urengerum, the god of the city of
>Elempur, who is saved from death at the hands of the Ram People by one of
>the emperors, Urvairinus I assume. As Urengerum is the Protector of the
>city, he is a son of Yelm, or a stand-in for him.

He is Urengerum, but he wasn't saved from death. He had to be called back through sacrifice. The city of Elempur was ruined so Urvairinus basically transferred him to Raibanth, and gave him a different name. I think of the transfer like how Pavis is transfered from the Old Pavis temple to the New Temple. Sagittus has to play second fiddle to Raibamus and Elempur was associated with archery(They brought the Bow of Dominace to Anaxial's enthronement), so he gets to be the god of archery. Also he isn't necessarily one of the sons of Yelm. If he is, then he is a renamed god after the return of Anaxial after the flood. He is not mentioned among the eight celestial sons(Though there are two sons that are unassociated with cities). Also, Elempur was not a city until Murharzam's time(The empire only went as far south as Nivorah) and Urengerum's name is similar to the area Urengeri. This suggests that settlers went to this area after the flood and prayed to the god of the area(not a son of Yelm) to become the god of their city. Note that Sagittus is a servant of Yelm yet in the God's Wall is in Row III(i.e. not to be generally worshipped during the first 50K years of the empire). This might be an error by Pletonius, though.

>A couple of points on Urengerum. I note that his symbol (I guess I'll
>have to look it up now, GRoY (Ivory) pg 27) is the same as Lokarnos'.
>Since Lokarnos is said somewhere to be Yelm's son, it is safe to assume
>Urengerum is too. Though I do wonder why to such dissimilar deities (one
>a Wagon god, a clever inventor; the other now an Archer) share this
>symbol

GRoY states that Lorkarnos was not his son but a servant and imperial officer.


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