Kevin Rose:-
<<summation: my comments that I wasn't sure who Kevin was adderessing with
his seemingly-directed criticism>>
>I, unlike some others (to judge by the number of messages generated)
>actually find that I don't have time to read all of these messages as they
>come out. Matter of fact, I sometimes read a couple of days worth in a
>single sitting. But the message that I was sort of responding to was:
>
> "What a neat idea, actually. Picture a special, incredibly rare weapons
>plant whose fruit is a self-guiding arrow. Maybe they'd only be useful
>against a specific type of enemy. Figure that it would always hit its
>target, maybe even if it is out of sight." And other assorted responses
>to this, some of which seemed at least semi-serious.
>
>Judging from some of the semingly self evident foolishness that has been
>published (Like the Basmoli stuff), it seems useful to not let really bad
>ideas (IMO) walk through unchallenged.
>
Translation: "I couldn't be bothered to read the ideas presented properly
because I had a lot to read at once. Therefore I decided to skim several
postings about a similar subject, guess on what I thought they were saying
and then criticise an imaginary viewpoint I myself made up from a collage
of opposing viewpoints. Some other stuff that has been published was
silly, and the idea I made up was silly too, so I posted to the digest
slating it, but did so misleadingly, so that it looked like a comment on
something somebody had actually written."
Kevin continues along these lines:-
<<summation: why I thought it was bad to have biological agents do powerful
arrow stuff>>
>I quite possibly missed the posting, or it may have been mixed in with the
>kitori stuff (which is almost as much fun as the doctoral disertation
>level analysis of pelorian culture based on King of Sartar) which I tend
>to mostly ignore. But anyway. . .
>
OK, Kevin, I don't read the Kitori stuff anymore, just in the same way as a
lot of people will page down past this argument. But I wouldn't say that
made it boring, rather that my own grasp of the Kitori is not great enough
to fully understand the discussion. And I don't remember much Pelorian
stuff in KoS, BTW (maybe I'm wrong here...). Whilst we are arguing fairly
heatedly over something, I'd advise you that it is unwise to randomly
insult people who have nothing to do with this.
And, Kevin, you _did not_ miss the posting for 2 reasons:-
There's more:-
>Why do naturally poisonous Aldryami arrows make it "too easy for
>Game/World balance"? In what fashion? As I do not ever expect to allow
>anyone to play an Elf in a functioning Aldryami society I don't see any
>reason why this matters. Alydryami are plants, hence they can handle
>toxins that are really lethal to animals (Like nerve agents) and ignore
>them.
>
I mean "Effects of this kind would be too easy and 'cheap' for the elves to
produce if they were simple biology, and thus too unbalancing. Why
wouldn't the elves have taken the world over if this were the case?"
I don't expect to allow anyone to play a Walktapus, that doesn't stop me being concerned as to why they can't just split themselves into a million pieces and take over the planet (this was just an example, which has recently been answered). Glorantha is a very well-defined world, glaring inconsistencies spoil it for us (well, most of us, at least).
>You may have to posit a reason why the Alyryami don't rule the world with
>these weapons, but Mostali pike and musket regiments have not exactly
>destroyed the world. And they have a very real and physical basis for why
>they work.
>
Yes, I would have to posit a reason, my idea in developing the Arrows (BTW,
I personally dislike the term "Smart Arrows") was to give elven archery a
bit of a kick, not create a world-beater that then has to be
explained-away. All cultures in Glorantha have "secret weapons" of one
kind or another that are not covered in the material so far devised, but it
is left to those who are dreaming up what these could be to make them
reasonable. I thought elves needed a bit of combat enhancement and the
Arrows were the result of my momentary inspiration. But as I described
them ,they do not need explaining away as to why the elves don't rule the
world with them - they're just to scarce to be a major factor in real terms.
You are overrating the the Mostali pike and musket regiments, they are not a world-beater, a seven-and-a-half foot Uz with lots of Battle magic will still tear a Mostali (read "Dwarven", obviously I'm not talking about _real_ Mostali here!) in half with one blow and muskets are slow to reload. Magic is too powerful in Glorantha to let low-level black powder technology rule. Yes, it is good, no, it is not everything. Dwarves are very strong defensively, but their offense sucks compared to some of the other Gloranthan factions. IMO Mostali technology does not need explaining away, and nor does anything else in Glorantha at the moment.
The last bit, about myth:-
>Insisting that everything be reduced to some sort of hand waving
>explanation of "mythical reasons" seems to be too often used as a cop-out
>for incomplete or poorly though out ideas. Sure, it is appropriate
>sometimes, but hardly as often as people seem to use it.
>
Here I partially agree with you, although I wonder where you are seeing all
these bad ideas since most of the material I see is good, even the stuff
the digest as a whole rejects. As a think-tank goes, the digest produces
amazing material. What I meant by my comment was that myth was more
appropriate a vessel in this case, since biology _AS YOU DESCRIBED_ would
produce an OTT effect, and myth doesn't. Please don't hand-wave myth away,
a dismissive attitude towards the power of myth is dangerous. Even our
modern world (the RW) is utterly rooted in myth, it's the fact that most
people that deny it that weakens it. To do the same with Glorantha invites
the advent of the Fifth Age and all that means!
Enough, I've said my piece. My apologies to anyone who is offended by the level of sarcasm in my above comments; I'll try to stop now.
- ---------------------------------- - ----------------------------------
The relevant bit of my posting that's worth reading:-
Sandy Petersen
2 questions arising from your last posting:-
Thanks for the info about water fertility deities, I re-read some stuff based on what you said and feel much better now. Please could you go into a bit more depth on Tholaina... Triolina is mentioned in some depth in the RQ books, but Tholaina isn't AFAICS?
Sandy, how do slave collars work? This is partly "what do they do?" (which I believe is in RQ2 pavis, which I don't have) although I already have some idea, and partly "what forces permit them to do what they do?". How common are they? Is it only the Lunar Empire that has them in the West (er... "non-East", not the "real" West!)? How likely is a Lunar Force to have them? Which city in Kralorela makes them, and why only there? Is it draconic power? (Etc. Etc.)
TTFN,
Paul.
End of Glorantha Digest V4 #473
Powered by hypermail