Martin's D's questions

From: Carlson, Pam <carlsonp_at_wdni.com>
Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 11:07:00 -0700


Martin Dick raises some excellent points:

>Moonbroth is a classic case where superior Lunar manipulation of myths was
crucial when they "proved" that Oakfed was the son of Lodril and turned Oakfed's
powers on the Praxians. How did they do that?

The Lunars had likely had done their homework, and knew that Praxians shamans contacted giant fire spirite in time of war. So they brought in some Lodril Priest ringers. Now, bear in mind that Lodril is to earth & fire what Orlanth is to wind and storm. The Lodrilli do a ritual of "taming the rebellious son" as David Cake suggested, or, more probably for Lodril, "welcoming the lost son". Oakfed is thrilled at finding kin (in a spirit sort of way), and easily shifts sides. (Those Praxian shamans only pushed him around, you know.)

Had the Praxians not been so insular and xenopbohic, they might have discovered before the battle that the Lunar peoples' pantheon included the Grandaddy of all Fire Spirits. If they had been prepared, they might have countered with a Praxian ritual of sorts - perhaps "Waha douses the Fire", or not summoned Oakfed at all. But since they didn't anticipate the Lunar ritual, they were not prepared to counter it.

This shows the importance of knowing your enemy, which is something that the Lunars do *very* well.

>And on a lower level, how can we simulate such events in our campaigns?

That's the fun part, and why it helps to know all the stories of the sides involved. Even knowing the type of myths the gods engaged in helps. In ToDP, we needed to ride in a gnome to tunnel beneath the walls of the Orleving fort. So we combined an Orlanth ritual (Sneaking in to Rescue Ernalda) with an Ernalda one (Riding in the Mouth of the Earth Serpent to the Underworld.) Neither of these myths are recorded anywhere, but they sounded appropriate. They were dangerous - messing up could have landed someone in the underworld, frex. We also had to add things to our plan that had no real world purpose, but were necessary to power the myth-magic. For example, to simulate "rescuing Ernalda", the warriors who snuck in had to grab an Orleving woman on the way out. We're not sure what would have happened if they hadn't, but it probably wound not have been good.

The only game mechanic we used was a Ritual (ceremony) roll or three. We did have to keep our preparations secret from the Orlevings, so that they did not counter them.

Does that answer your question?


> Given that the clash of cultures which is dominant in Gloranthan roleplaying
is the Sartarite
Orlanthi vs The Lunars and that objectively, Sartar seems to have no real
chance when you look at economics, miltiary strength and magical sophistication
in the early 1600s, we can explain the victory of Argrath by saying that the myths of the orlanthi Sartarites in some way are "better" than the Lunar's
myths and this allows them to defeat the Lunars.

Not necessarily. The Sartarites could simply have been more active at heroquesting _at_that_ point_ than the Lunars, who were kinda busy on other fronts, too.

>One explanation of this is that Orlanthi myths are closer to the reality of
Glorantha than those of the Lunars.

Does your opinion change when you learn that Pelorian myths are full of self-sacrifice, death, and rebirth? Perhaps you are looking at the equally powerful myths of two great cultures - one which slays, and one which is slain but always returns....


I think the "objective" part of Glorantha can be found in great myth archetypes. Cultures place greater emphasis on different archetypes, but most deistic cultures recognize the same ones. Frex, the Pelorians had Lodril a prisoner of Monster Man in Hell, while the trolls have him a prisoner of Argan Argar(?) in the Castle of Black Glass (or lead?). Both cultures fond strength in that myth - even the apparent "looser" culture (the imprisoned one). Any ritual or heroquest that draws on some aspect of that mythic event will have power. Whether one group of questors will have the power to defeat the other depends more on their preparedness, POW, and experience than on the "truth" of the POV of the myth being reinacted.

Does that make sense?

Pam


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