Re: A Gloranthan feminine plot

From: David Weihe <weihe_at_eagle.danetinc.com>
Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 17:10:21 EDT


> From: "Sergio_Mascarenhas" <sermasalmeida_at_mail.telepac.pt>
> One of the things that I think Glorantha lacks is a woman touch. I mean,
> most of that universe is male oriented.
Huh??? I wouldn't tell that to the Lunars, the trolls, the Esrolians, the Pamaltelans, the Hsunchen societies, or the Orlanthi women -- let alone Barbeester/Maran Gor, Yelorna, etc. The old Yelmic societies and the Malkioni are, and probably the Yggs Islanders (Umathi, but not Orlanthi) to a lesser extent, but I think that you are definitely misreading  things. A bit *combat* oriented, yes. But what do you expect during the leadup to an event like the Hero Wars?

> What about all the millions of women there, what do they think, what do
> they do, and, more important, how do they contribute to the mighty times
> of the Hero Wars? Do they simply stick to the traditional supportive role
> for males? Or is there some distinctive intervention reserved to female?
Go tell Gunda the Guilty (a major Orlanthi Hero in White Bear/Red Moon) that she should stick to "traditional" roles, then watch as she "traditionally"  kills you for the insult.

> 1. In barbarian culture man and woman have different and distinctive places
> in society, and that translates into distinctive behavior, and customs.
Different default behaviors, but a man can behave in womanlike roles (Geo and Barntar come to mind) and woman in male roles (Vinga, Orlanth Adventurous, and Humakt all have women in major roles -- Humakt and OA just don't bother with special roles) without causing much comment. Perhaps you are thinking of the Prax nomads, who do have such a separation.

> 2. The ascent of the moon represents in itself the twisted womanhood
> of the Red Goddess. etc

Paraphrasing, she loses fertility powers. So? So does BBG, and there are lots of land goddesses beneath the Red Goddess. Not that I agree with your thesis, either.

> 3. Paraphasing: Exposes a secret, ie, menstrual cycles
First, everybody knows about them (men aren't stupid, after all). Second, the Gloranthan menstrual cycles are synced with the *Blue* Moon (Annila, aka the Blue Streak), not the weekly Red Lunar cycle. This is recognized in the Theyalan calendar, if nowhere else.

> 4. Even worst, barbarian women think that the extension of the glow line,
> and the fixing of the moon in the full part of the cycle means an awful
> menace to women: if that happens their menstrual cycle will stop in
> the bleeding ("red") phase. Maybe women will bleed to death; or they will
> become barren, like the Red Goddess that only gave birth to one son.
Refuted above. Also, the various Inspirations of the Goddess are usually viewed as daughters. Or don't daughters count?

> 5. Paraphrasing: Ernalda no longer queen, just wife of Red Emperor.
She would not marry the Emperor, who is a manifest individual, but become a lady-in-waiting to the Red Goddess. So? She wasn't originally the chief or only wife of Yelm, now was she? Coming down a bit, but not death or slavery like is intended for Orlanth.

> 6. Orlanthy women are horrified by things like the Seven "Mothers" cult.
> Mothers? What Mothers? That cult's name is an insult to the most sacred
> duty of women: giving birth.

Since the duty of the Seven Mother cult is to act as missionaries, you must almost certainly be wrong. Either the idea of using "Mothers" as a metaphor is understood (most probably -- any Orlanthi woman has heard bards/skalds since childhood, and is used to kennings and such), or the term is acceptable for creators/discoverers of a goddess.

In summation, Orlanthi women are going to dislike the prospect of a Lunar rule about as much as, and for most of the same reasons as, their husbands. If they have the sophistication to see the Yelmic underpinnings of the Lunar *Empire* the will really hate that, of course. But that sort of sophistication is like dismissing 70 years of Russian Communism and declaring it as just another House of particularly nasty Czars, who inherited through adoption (being named as successor, like the "Good" Emperors of Rome) rather than blood.

Damn, I have been writing a lot! PS: Thanks for the Duck Pack. I agree that they have been ignored or worse for too long.


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