Re: Earth stuff

From: Mr. Tines <>
Date: 16 Nov 1997 19:05 +0000


David Dunham
> This sounds more like they're Babeester Gor lay members. I think being
> initiated to any of the odd and unusual deities (e.g. anyone besides
> Orlanth or Ernalda, and possibly Barntar) is a serious commitment.

Multiple levels of initiation may not be part of the RQ3 rules as written, but would seem to be most appropriate for the specialised functions, where few people would "make a career" for them, but where these functions need to be filled at least for some part of the time, even if only for rituals.

Pam Carlson

> Does every clan Ernalda shrine need a guard? Just who is going to defile
> - - certainly not the clan members!

Mundane raiders, be they from feuding clan, or something in a different ecological niche like trolls; plus the ritual enemies at the various ceremonies throughout the year.

> Are we talking about an agrarian society here? Do Orlanthi really have
> luxury to allow their teenagers to lounge about aimlessly with weapons?

One (1) person per shrine, stuck with what is in effect punishment detail, multiplied by however-many clans. Not whole gangs of disaffected inner city youths per steading.

Am I honestly that unclear in my writing?

> would think the teenage girls (and boys) would be quite busy plowing,
> hoeing, planting, weeding, harvesting, tending livestock, cooking, caring
> for siblings, caring for aged adults, and making clothes, tools, and
> shelter. And they would be quite good at it, considering they'd been at
> since the age of eight or so.

They would have been capable making a positive economic contribution far earlier than that (if only by running about scaring off birds and other pests in the fields); and 8 is rather a high age to put as a lower bound for the care of siblings.

> And, surely, you don't mean to imply that old or widowed women are
> otherwise useless?

When you are no longer able to hack it in the heavy physical labour you cite above, and if you don't have immediate familty for support, you need to find some economic niche (if your clan can't support one person off the fields for ritual purposes, as you suggested above, they aren't going to be able to support granny).

> Are old men useless, too? They must be more so,
> because there is no male TKT equivalent.

Lhankor Mhy, the wise old man; or at the least, the equivalent Orlanth aspect.

Follows all the stereotypes : the old woman is the scary witch, on the edge of society, disdained, and usually on the way to being outcast and neglected. Meanwhile the old greybeard is laying down the law.

> > The Voria devotee will serve as a "professional aunt" within
> > her tribe, providing the sort of assistance with child
> > rearing expected from the extended family.
> I think that the Voria role would be filled by a promising child, and no
> more. It is not a role for an adult. No one stays in Voria or Voriof;

> In short, Barbeester Gori are VERY rare, and all the more scary because
> they are. They are more common in Tarsh and Esrolia than in Sartar.

One's Glorantha may vary. This take, predating as I noted in an adjacent post, as it did, _King of Sartar_ was working with very much less widely published data than that provided. In about 1982, I was able to postulate that the canonical Sartar was something like Iron Age Britain (I have notes from 1983 saying such, and can't think of any new data that might have come out, since WF had ceased by 82); and for the next decade, nothing was published that would shed any more light on the subject.

> Sorry, but I just don't see the RQ3 cult descriptions of earth deities
> giving rise to any culture that would have existed on earth - or in
> Glorantha, given all the other info we have about it. RQ3 was written for
> "adventurers" in an "adventure campaign" setting, so it does not lend
> itself to extrapolating about the cultures. RQ's great weakness was that
> it did a poor job describing how Gloranthan religions fit in with their
> cultures. Greg has mentioned this at several cons.

Part of the crossword-puzzle-style fun of Glorantha theorising for me has been in the seeking of solutions constrained by such evidence as we already have : there's much more satisfaction in coming to something that pulls the disparate threads together in a manner that seems coherent than simply ignoring bits that might be "inconvenient".

There are enough large blank areas (conceptually as well as geographically) being only sporadically filled in, that if you throw away significant chunks of apparently relevant material one might as well start from scratch, and label the result "inspired by Greg Stafford's Glorantha". At least that way you know you're safe from Gregging.

Should I just shut up and go away now?

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End of The Glorantha Digest V5 #226

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