Indeed not. I think it's fairly clear that a sorceror and a mystic would see a generic "magical effect" as part of the Material World, or some concept to that effect, whereas a theist and a shaman would regard them as being otherworldly, spiritual. And I'm sure one could make many valid distinctions within these two broad categorisations.
An interesting (I hope) flip side to this is of course that the Malkioni are not the only Materialists in Glorantha. Most obviously there are the Mostali, who are unquestionably the _most_ Materialist, in a sense that hopefully is pretty intuitive. Another case are the Dayzatari (or the Buseri, not clear which term is the More Correct in this context). They are less strictly Materialist, in the sense that their philosophy does not _exclude_ the Immaterial, but the term is still usefully applicable to them -- their motto might be, if you can touch it, or see it, then measure it. They retain Mystical beliefs (and practices) about that which cannot be measured, though.
Peter Postulates:
> Your 'same elements' argument can also be used to imply chalk and
> cheese are the same because they are both made of elements.
And mostly, in fact., the _same_ elements -- ah-hah! (C, Ca, O...) Conclusive, or _what_?
Trotsky Tablulates:
> Polytheism & Mysticism - dunno, Teshnans?
Many of the Eastern cultures, to a greater or lesser extent. If anything, the Teshnans seem about the most Theistic of this lot.
> Animism & Materialism - hmm... Syanorans?
I don't know if there are any instances of this in Glorantha -- sounds the least likely of the permutations.
> Materialism & Mysticism - Perfecti
The Perfecti aren't really Materialists, so far as I can see, though granted they come from a Materialist culture. Best example of Mystic Materialism is the Dayzatar cult, I think.
> MYSTICISM - Kralori, Dragonewts
The Kralori aren't really "pure" Mystics, and the Dragonewts... well, who knows? Certainly, though, those Kralori who are into Draconic stuff are getting towards the pretty hard core Mysticism end of the spectrum.
> Polytheism, Materialism & Mysticism - Lunars
Though not all at the same time! (Usually.)
> I don't see why it contradicts that, at least no more than it contradicts
> a mundanist view. And the Aldryami, IMO, combine mystical and shamanic
> beliefs into a coherent whole.
Hrm... I think I can see where you're coming from with this one; there are obviously "shamanic" elements to Aldryami practises, and yet they have a personal relationship with what is, from a human perspective, apparently a transcendent entity (Aldrya). I'm not sure it means much to call this mysticism, though, as I don't think that anything a human would recognise as a mystical technique to do this is involved; indeed, I think it's pretty much the "natural state" for aldryami.
BTW, I'm not sure the implicit equation of "animism" and "shamanism" is entirely sound. Though which is the appropriate term for assorted different Gloranthan groups of Naturalists is one I'll leave well alone, at least for this message...
> I think this is where I have a problem with the chart in its present
> form. Is theism really so incompatible with reductionism/mundanism/whatever-
> we're-going-to-call-it?
As the hapless fool that started off this business, however inadvertantly, I feel impelled to comment that my intent, for one, was not to set up a scheme of incompatibilies/oppositions. Rather, I was mulling over a snippet culled from HW, which _appeared_ to suggest some sort of linear progression from Materialism at one extreme, to Mysticism at the other. But I asked Robin about this at Convulsion, and he didn't appear to be saying anything like that at all. So my initial comments, trying to "fix" the linear progression seem a tad redundant ar this point.
Slainte,
Alex.
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