>Different Aspects of Orlanth:
>Joerg seems to have come up with a brand new name:
>> Orlanth the Youth - to avoid Warrior/Adventurous discussion
>Not bad at all.
I meant Orlanth and all he did in his youth, up to his marriage with Ernalda (which made him Thunderous, aka "all puffed out", and suddenly very conservative). Cherchez la femme.
I meant that O.A. and O.W. are the aspect of Orlanth the Youth. Orlanth the Rebel. Orlanth the Thief. Orlanth Who Flew With The Vadrudi (and possibly did what all of them did, i.e. force themselves on unwilling or at least unasked females). Orlanth who tricked his brothers. Orlanth the Horn Player.
I do agree with the five years or so old proposal that Orlanth Thunderous types are very pro-hierarchy, order, etc, and quite opposed to changes. These are the guys who talk about the weather, not about war.
And I don't quite agree that all of the priesthood of Orlanth necessarily belongs to the Thunderous aspect.
Jane constructs a hierarchy I didn't mean, though:
>You know, I'm beginning to recognise a pattern here. Put OW and OR in the Sky
>Palace and they'd be right at home. No wonder I don't like them.
I don't doubt that there are Orlanthi who would like it that way. They make nice allied antagonists for the free-thinkers...
>And that's what I'm really objecting to, for those of you who don't seem to
>have realised. The New Way Ahead, as described, seems to be wrecking not only
>Vinga but also Orlanth. The God of Freedom has become anything but.
Orlanth the cultural deity can't be Orlanth of Absolute Individual Freedom. The contradiction of being both rebel and king is bound to produce some branches which are mostly rebel and some which are mostly king.
Re: Heler the Homo
Think Onan...
Tom Merchant
>is this the future of Glorantha? The free thinking and humourous
>Orlanthi are now no more. They have been replaced by Nietzchean
>Anglo-Saxon Ubermensch.
I don't know what Nietzsche has to do with male puberty initiation rites barred to female attenders. This is like demanding that males get an initiation into the menses cycles, and their meaning.
What do you mean "The free thinking and humourous Orlanthi are now no more."? What's the point in being rebellious if there aren't people to rebel against? Otherwise you might say "It's a good thing the Lunars conquered Sartar, they gave us someone to rebel against." If there aren't stuck-up conservatives within your own community, what's the point in struggling for change. You propose it, they say "great idea, we'll do that", they do so - great achievement. You propose it, they say "that can't be done cause we never did it that way", you do it anyway, they grudgingly agree it can be done, or sabotage you - great fun to be had.
Or are your free-thinking, humourous Orlanthi the same bunch who slay Lunars and Sorcerers on sight, but ally with trolls if a PC happens to be one?
>Reattach that chain, girls, cause the lads say
>that you cant have storm powers.
There's a couple of female storm deities. They are difficult, because they didn't harm any victims of rape, they didn't slay rival deities, etc.
Do you want "chicks" raging mindlessly, tearing down things for the fun of it, proving theirs is longer, etc., as a social norm?
>All those proto-fascist hero-wars philosophers can get stuffed if they
>think any thinking gloranthophile is going to play in a game where men
>are real men and the girls have creation in their bellies and nowhere
>else.
Please read the Orlanthi descriptions. The Orlanthi male is the "weak gender" prone to emotional outbreaks etc. The Orlanthi women are the brains of the operation, are the ones to plan things.
"Don't cry, girl. Crying is for boys." (paraphrased from one of Pam Carlsson's hearth tales as Freya Two-mother)
Proto-fascist might be a way to describe any clan-based culture, anyway - close-knit, ready to stand together against whoever trespasses. You don't need a Fuehrer, however. It is enough to get your head bashed in for some oligarchs who do have the decency to fight with you - you can only hope.
I don't see any tendency to get the blind, mindless allegiance to a Fuehrer which makes the core of fascism.
>Women can be unitied with orlanth because sometimes they have fire as
>well as babies in their bellies- as much as or as little as any man.
Women can join those aspects of Orlanth which don't have to do with "stout spears" or inseminating the earth. Some of these have aquired other names, it seems.
>I say again that the mythology being created here smells of the
>mythology of fascism, even down to the 'politics of extremity' whereby
>you are either a traditionalist or a traitor- where has the fierce
>liberty, jovial good humour and above all diversity and tolerance
>gone?
Where has it gone. Hmm. Orlanthi willingly embracing the Lunar Way, Orlanthi openminded enough to mingle with sorcerous cultures... Traitors, all of them, to your classical Orlanthi Adventurous type. Who is Lokamayadon - the man who sold us all, or the free-thinking spirit who tried to lead the Orlanthi community to new heights? What is so great about Alakoring that he didn't even try to understand the Diamond Storm Dragon, or that he replaced the modern, open-minded civilisation of the EWF with his provincial, xenophobic Orlanth Rex cult? How great a hero is Ingkot Axe-and-a-half, who subverted the Lunars to accept him as one of their equals by marrying Hwarin Dalthippa and conquering the neighbouring conservative dickheads?
There is a small bunch of progressive etc. types in the Principality of Sartar. They all seem to be Sartarites rather than tribesmen, probably with more urban than clan allegiance. Imitators of Sartar. Likeable people, really. But not really your typical clanpeople.
>Lastly you are welcome to join oa if you breath air- if oa is to
>become ow then please make it in name only.
Orlanth the Breather - not much of a cult. There must be something else I join - a warband (and most adventuring groups are such), some sort of conspiration or community. If I do it for the magic, a sort of magical circle.
IMO anyone can join any cult, providing that he can prove that he or she is worthy to do so, and fulfills the requirements. The latter may be proven in more or less arduous quests, or achievements. A broo will have to prove quite a bit before being accepted into Storm Bull, e.g. his identity as a minotaur. And going out of his own nature to prove this, he may cease being a broo... Or if he doesn't conquer his nature, he fails to enter the cult (alive).
If an Ernalda priestess needs to have given birth to, and nursed, a child, and an Orlanthi housecarl manages to prove he has, I see nothing to bar him from attaining the position if he meets the other demands for proof as well.
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