Peter and Julian discuss Sartarite Mayors:
>>No, it's the other way round : she is the intermediary between the
important
>>citizens/families/clans and the other Magistrates of the City, Kingdom,
and
>>Tribes.
>No she isn't. KoS p134 specifically states that Sartar instituted
>the Mayor to represent the city residents on the city's Rings. The
>power circles of Sartar are the King, the Tribal Confederations and
>independant tribes such as the Colymar. There's no conception of
>mayors having the major importance in the Kingdom that you describe.
I agree with Peter here. The Mayor represents the city residents on the city ring. Granted, a strong-willed and charismatic Mayor with the full support of the urban population can have a lot of importance - I can almost imagine them being similar to a powerful trade union boss - threatening riots, lack of cooperation, etc. instead of strikes. Nonetheless, when push comes to shove, the real power is always ultimately with tribes. The cities rely upon the tribes for food, livestock, and protection.
>And there are zilch other Magistrates in Sartar.
Formal magistrates, that is.
>>From my own experience of RW City politics, such violent means of
>>controlling dignitaries is very unusual (but not unheard of).
>We are not talking about the French, we are talking about the Orlanthi
>who have their own culture and their own methods of social control.
>Secondly these 'dignitaries' would do the same to their own enemies,
>so they can't complain.
I definitely agree with Peter here as well. I'm going to make a bold assertion here, but I suspect that I have the most experience with urban politics of anyone on the list (three congressional campaigns, staffer for the budget committee of a major regional government, and attorney for said regional government). Believe me, Orlanthi politics can get very violent. (For an illustration, play in Fall of the House of Malan - coming to a Convulsion near you).
>>I don't believe that the violent methods of political control that you
>>suggest for the Sartarite Orlanthi are at all realistic, frankly.
>Really? It worked for Republican Rome which is an excellent
>example a city governed by clan politics.
Or Florentine politics (actually pretty much any of the late medieval/Renaissance Italian city-states - with the notable exception of Venice), the city of Constantinople/Istanbul, Moscow pre-Peter the Great, - heck, even my own Seattle in the late 19th century.
>>Probably, there are independant City militias which are independant
>>of the Tribes. Basically, police forces.
>Again this is too modern. The city militias would be furnished
>by the tribal kings and be factionalized.
I suspect that many artisans are well-armed and form yet another potential war-band that can either support the tribal kings or oppose them. The key to understanding Orlanthi politics and government is that most arrangements are ad hoc mixtures of tradition and convenience - with political arrangements tending to accurately reflect the relative power of various kinship groups and interests. When the balance of power changes (say the Ernulfing bloodline pisses off several traditional allies), so do the "institutions". As a result, they can be great coalition builders but are terrible institutional administrators.
Jeff
End of The Glorantha Digest V6 #657
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