Rathori

From: Joerg Baumgartner <joe_at_toppoint.de>
Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2000 21:11:45 +0000


>>I concur that they would prefer hit and run to a degree but would
>>contend that the Longbow is NOT the weapon to dothis with.

Why not? It is no more or less bulky than a stout spear (lighter, but then you carry along a quiver, too). Especially if you hit first, run then (the other way around is less effective, since it is harder to find the necessary calm after running, think biathlon).

>>The tactical use of the longbow by the Rathori would seen to be a
>>reaction to the heavy armour of their oft mounted foes in the
>>Janube valley.

I doubt it. Any decent self bow has the draw weight and approximate length of a shorter hunting longbow. A stick with draw weight of 50 to 80 lbs is sufficient to hit any prey in forested territory, and to shoot clout-style (i.e. at 165 meters, with about 30 to 40 degrees release elevation) at clusters of enemies. A good hit with one of these will be able to give a bear serious chest trouble at 20 to 40 meters (though not immediately lethal unless you "impale" or "critical", and even then immediately lethal with a bear can mean within a couple of minutes). I think these uses sum up Rathori bow application.

In reply to Peter:
> The Rathori have had elves in that area for a long time AND given
> that form most of the period in between the early wanes and
> the present, they would have been asleep due to the Ban, how
> would they have become a Longbow culture so quickly?

You seem to believe in the Longbow myth.

The English longbow culture was possible mainly because the nobility allowed a second, lesser level of the feudal warrior nobility, the yeomanry. People well enough off to find time to specialize on a weapon which ordinary farmers usually wouldn't master.

To shoot a longbow of military draw weight somewhat accurately, you either need the strength of a bear, or lots of training. With the Rathori, pick your choice.

> It take many generations of gradual growth to do that. The French
> tried to create a longbow force in the Hundred years war period and
> failed miserably.

Because they wouldn't accept the formation of an uppity lesser warrior class besides their chivalry. Without granting them the right (and duty) to take time off at the practice bout, little wonder their archers sucked.

More importantly, their military doctrine was blind towards missile combat. Before Agincourt, a Parisian citizen crossbow contingent twice the size of the English archer contingent there was sent home because those noble knights didn't want their fun spoiled...

That said: if the Rathori use bows for hunting now, they have done so significantly before the Ban.

It is possible that the elves of Erigia have improved their bows after the Sunburn - real world subarctic taiga provides scarce lumber suitable for high quality archery material. Elf-grown "natural laminate" like yew, preferably grown straight and without too much knobs from branches, would make superior limbs, and a similar case can be made for custom-grown arrow shafts.

As for their armour-breaking qualities: unless they use iron, forget it. Third Eye Blue smiths do trade iron (I seem to recall Uncoling middlemen), and arrow tips would be comparably cheap and effective. Still, I can imagine that a Rathori hunter would prefer a razor-sharp broadhead arrow tip which will slice nicely through bear, moose/elk or boar hide and fat over armour-piercing bodkin or flight tips - those keep him satiated.

> Yes, the Rathori would use the bow for hunting, but why
> would they ignore its potential in combat?

They wouldn't, but if they use their hunting gear, it would be of less use against chivalry than anything the French (!) fielded in the 100 Years War. Unless they went at the horses rather than the riders, combining battle and meat-making.

(Personally, I own more than one bow, and I know when the heavy-weight longbow is the less optimal choice when hits rather than fun or feeling count. Switching to less familiar equipment doesn't exactly improve accuracy, even if a bodkin flies better than a broadhead.)

Martin:
>Firstly we know the Rathori raid into the civilised lands.

Peter:
> Erigia is not a civilized land and Janubia/Arrolia is so sparsely
> populated that it lacks the population to prevent the Rathori from
> making a career as raiders.

That's post-Ban Janubia. Pre-Ban Janubia did welcome settlers, but hardly was uninhabited - I find the situation very similar to the German Holy Roman Empire's east colonisation into Slavic territory, with the Rathori quite similar to Slavic or Baltic tribes made landless by German settlers.

> The only other power around is the
> Kingdom of War and even the Rathori don't raid there.

To many Rathori, they raided into densely populated Junora or Janubia just two or twelve long sleeps ago. Much of their culture predates the Ban and continues where Snodal left Loskalm just barely saved from their invasions. Even the First Awakeners have had just one post-Ban generation.

As to Rathori in Jonatela: they're still there, only their old ways aren't. Now, we call them Hill Barbarians, or even Orlanthi, since they have taken up farming.

> Then what military innovations have the Lapps, the Siberians and the
> Ainu made?

I don't know about Ainu or Siberians, but the Lapps have improved Viking ship building greatly. There is a good reason coastal northern Norway, where Lapp and Viking fishermen formed a bi-cultural society, was the source for a couple of naval improvements. The Lapp ancestors might even have provided the basic shipbuilding techniques for the Hjortspring boat, if you judge from rock carvings.

They were dominated by the Vikings because they lacked the metal (technology) for powerful infantry. Since Third Eye Blue smiths do deal with Uncolings and via them with the Rathori, this handicap is less acute since the source of metal is not simultaneously the source for oppression.


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