Re: Gods, Objectivity, Yadda, Yadda

From: Graham Robinson <>
Date: Sat, 30 Sep 2000 21:49:57 +0100

Andrew Larsen says:

>I retain the sense that the Empire is based on
>corrupt principles.

In my opinion, the Empire is probably the worst of all governmental forms - one which is based on sound, moral, idealistic principles, but is actually run (largely) by corrupt people who only apply those principles when it suits them to.

Seems Chris Gidlow's Soviet analogy had more effect on me than I thought...

Peter Larsen, replying to me :

> However, I find it hard to believe that one worshipper can call
> Elmal and get "I am the One True Sun" while another worshipper gets "There
> are many suns." That's too subjective for me.

I certainly never meant to imply this could happen. Elmal will give pretty consistent answers on big questions - that's one way we recognise he is Elmal. Certainly the only answer he will ever give to "Who is the Sun?" is "Me."

Having said that, I think part of the problem is how people view divination. I personally really hate the model where the god appears, or whispers in your ears or whatever. I'm much happier with the model where you split the oxen's belly open, and the high priest pulls out the spleen and says "Nice and fat. Yep, Elmal's the Sun alright."

> >Glorantha is NOT a scientific world, and scientific ideals do not apply.
> >most certainly fails the reproducability axiom. Myths are not linear,
> >histories more than 1600 or so years old are not linear. Insisting on a
> >single creation myth or a single truth about anything is, in my opinion,
> >being too reductionist and literal.
> Some rules of logic have to apply, or we can't talk about it in any
> meaningful fashion.

But they don't have to be the logical rules of OUR world. Some sort of consistency is necessary, re-writing known facts is a pain - I don't think anyone's arguing with that. However, in Glorantha you can't perform experiments to determine who the Sun god is, which clan worships him the right way, etc. The very presence of so much magic precludes that sort of analysis.


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