RE: The Glorantha Digest V8 #161 from Gareth Martin on 2000-12-11 (Glorantha Digest Vol 08)

From: Gareth Martin <gamartin_at_nortelnetworks.com>
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2000 12:59:28 -0000

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> that has only really happened in the last century. Prior to that
> repression involved forcing someone to stay in a place where they
> were outsiders, something that requires a state which the Ancient
> Celts almost certainly didn't have.

That is too bold a statement - repression is more than just confinement or the removal of travel rights (incidentally, the Celts kept slaves not all of whom need be Celtic, implying that they are restraining the flight of the slave). Why should a tiller of earth care which master takes the taxes? Surely, repression is the state of having your production claimed/requisitioned/owned by someone else, regardless of the culturally specific rationale? I'm afraid I think it is legitimate to look at such societes from the 20th C. perspective and observe that they are repressive (well, MORE repressive than our own, anyway).

Although the celts doe not strictly have a state, they do manage a remarkable unity of legal lore and cultural tradition. Such an organised body, whose origin will lie in the clan nobility, is, I would argue, the ideological equivalent of a state, albeit without the attendfant apparatus.

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> that has only really happened in the last =
century. Prior to that
 > repression involved forcing someone to stay in =
a place where they
 > were outsiders, something that requires a state =
which the Ancient
 > Celts almost certainly didn't have.


That is too bold a statement - repression is more =
than just confinement or the removal of travel rights (incidentally, = the Celts kept slaves not all of whom need be Celtic, implying that = they are restraining the flight of the slave).  Why should a = tiller of earth care which master takes the taxes?  Surely, = repression is the state of having your production = claimed/requisitioned/owned by someone else, regardless of the = culturally specific rationale?  I'm afraid I think it is = legitimate to look at such societes from the 20th C. perspective and = observe that they are repressive  (well, MORE repressive than our = own, anyway).

Although the celts doe not strictly have a state, =
they do manage a remarkable unity of legal lore and cultural = tradition.  Such an organised body, whose origin will lie in the = clan nobility, is, I would argue, the ideological equivalent of a = state, albeit without the attendfant apparatus.

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