>>Derensev >>School is probably in Karse as the Lylket knowledge temple of >>the Imperial Age (the source of much Uz Lore) used to be there.
> This proposition is certainly confused, but suggestive as a guide to
> research.
I agree. Lylket and Karse both existed during the Imperial Age. Karse was a EWF-friendly port of the Shadowlands.
> Lylket was not Karse, nor in Karse.
Correct. The Chaosium information I have been given said Lylket was to the west of Karse, a rival port city near the rivermouth. The question which I have is who allowed the city to be established, or at least did not prevent it?
> In the early Imperial age [KoS p.182],
> Karse and Jisteel stood across the mouth of the Creekstream River, as it
> then was.
As I read Hrestol Arganitis' report in KoS, Jisteel was further upriver, not across the mouth.
> They were controlled, around 700, by Ezkankekko.
> But "During the disintegration of the experimental empires {RQComp p.18]...
> The Only Old One turned to destroy those foes of his gods who lived nearest
> to him. These were the _cities_ of Jadnor and Lylket, both of which fell to
> local forces, and the Clanking City..."
> [emphasis mine]
> While the dating is indefinite, it is surely much later than the age of
> Tanian's Victory.
It can be safely assumed that the destruction occurred during the 10-year struggle against the Clanking City, i.e. between 907 and 917.
> Therefore, Jadnor and Lylket were Jrusteli colonies, not
> in the early Shadowlands, but closer than any other stronghold of the
> Jrusteli (or the EWF). The connection with the Clanking City suggests they
> were in Heortland.
Almost correct for Lylket - this city was below Shadow Plateau, to my knowledge west of Karse.
Jadnor lately appeared on the Slontos map (uploaded to glorantha.com on May 22nd). It lay at the mouth of the Volior River west of Caladraland.
> Can we be more precise? Yes. Jadnor is now represented by Ja(d)nsholm;
> archaeology will tell us if the river-island is its actual ruins.
I don't think so. At least nobody protested against the Jansholm Lanbril ring of the Shadow Cats in Tradetalk 6, which dates back to the Gbaji Wars and tells of Imperial Age activities in Jansholm, not Jadnor.
> There is more question about Lylket; but I believe its lay somewhere near or
> below Backford on the Syphon. The Jrusteli settled on the Syphon; its uphill
> flow was useful for commercial and military
> purposes, and uniquely valuable for an effort to restore the Golden Age to
> the Inner Plane. (I doubt they caused the reversal; calling everything odd
> God-Learner is too easy.) If this settlement wasn't
> Lylket, we have no notion of its name.
Any Backford location would be a long way from Shadow Plateau, and what tunnels I expect there would be krarshtkid-dug, not trollmade.
Your suggestion would make Jadnor closer to Shadow Plateau than Lylket, so there arises the questions why only few trolls participated in its destruction.
> Metcalfe's confusion is doubtless caused by the numerous books in Karse
> still bearing Lylket shelfmarks. There is a much simpler explanation: The
> Heortlings who actually took Lylket respected Lankhor Mhy and his temple; so
> the Lylket library was neither looted nor burned.
Trolls participated, and may well have eaten part of the documents...
But I agree that Karse is the logical place for the Lylket plunder to turn up.
> However, they had no use
> for a sea-port, and permitted the city to decay. Without the resources of a
> city to support them, many Sages emigrated; most to Karse, the closest
> Library, and more peaceful, then, than Esrolia. They brought their favorite
> books with them.
Karse suffered the fate of "no use for a sea port", and with the Dragonkill War even river transport along the Creekstream River became unimportant.
The real confusing thing about the Lylket documents is that at least one ("The Birth of Arkat Kingtroll", in Jonstown Compendium from Troll Gods) the Third Age date 1230 S.T., 300 years after the destruction of the Clanking City.
Karse was at that time a largely derelict place (the Closing ended its usefulness as an overseas port, the Dragonkill ended its trade through Dragon Pass) occupied mainly by a remnant of its original Pelaskite fisherfolk population. Modern Karse was rebuilt on the other bank of the rivermouth.
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