Me:
> >Secret, I forgot it.....in a sense, I began to think secret is something
> >alien to Brithini View to the Logic and Metaphysic to Objective
Worldview.
> >And secret is connected to something transcendental mystical existence.
You
> >might think about Malkioni Mysticism both in Perfecti and some Brithini
> >sorcerers.....
> >
Trotsky:
> The Malkioni have Secrets for the same reason the Heortlings do - its
> just that they use different means to contact the transcendant, rather
> than theist gods.
> >
> >Wizards and Knights. Joy of the Heart and Solace of the Body?
> >
> Those are both Secrets, IMO, yes. Indeed, Solace of the Body is likely a
> Great Secret, IMO, in that attaining it would tend to remove you from
> play...
1st Edition HW certainly said so.
>If the God of Carpentry gives you access to a Secret,
> there's no reason why the Patron Saint of Lost Causes (for instance)
> shouldn't, so far as I can see. Indeed, the Perfecti Secret is likely to
> be something largely useless on the mundane plane,
As Dayzatar secret?
>whereas St Talor's is > probably a lot more practical.
If I can put on more of my agenda, More mystical magic is induced, more it will go illogical.
Below is maybe the example how Malkioni (TI) misunderstood and warped the original text of Brithini (Peter), as how RW christians and buddhists warped the original teaching of their religin founders.....
Peter:
>
> >And secret is connected to something transcendental mystical existence.
>
> (Orlanthi) all religions have that connection and I don't think the
Brithini
> are any exception.
I know Brithini use magic, but how about "religion"? They are atheists. Maybe for them, "Religion is the opium of the people." as Marx said.
From Trotsky's Page (there are two categories of modern Brithini and sorcerer types:
<<The Brithini
The ancient sect that most closely resembles the religion from which the Mal kioni originally sprang, the Brithini have not changed in millenia. They are immortal so long as they keep their strict laws, but have no belief in concepts such as morality or an afterlife. >>
<<The Independent Zzaburi
Descended from the Brithini, but no longer following their laws, the independent Zzaburi orders practice all manner of magics, without the restrictions that would be imposed by a moral and God-fearing church. Some Zzaburi, such as the fire warlocks of Loskalm, have a mystical and almost religious belief system, but most are rigidly secular in their outlook. >>
Though I don't know anything about fire warlocks of Loskalm (maybe they are "excommunicated" warlocks of Sog City?), from my warped eyes, certainly some sorcerers fell to the error of mystical concepts like God Learners. Sorry, maybe he just simply mentioned about Brithini and non-Brithini.....
>
> > From your posting file of First Age Tradetalk mailing list:
(Snip)
>
> I might have to revise that once I see the Common Magic rules in HeroQuest
> (which I didn't know about when I wrote the above).
>
> >Though I don't know enough about the difference between reason and logic.
>
> Reason and Logic are different levels of thinking in Glorantha and I
> was basing the above on Revealed Mythologies p18.
Surely, but it talked about....."Malkioni Sorcerers"?
>
> >Wizards and Knights. Joy of the Heart and Solace of the Body?
> >http://www.btinternet.com/~Nick_Brooke/malkioni/knights.htm
> >http://www.btinternet.com/~Nick_Brooke/malkioni/wizards.htm
>
> Solace is an aloof and perfect heaven that exists far away from mortal
> affairs. Joy is a descending attribute of the Invisible God that can
> be summoned to bring comfort to his worshippers. All Monotheists
> believe in Solace while Sorcerers do not. Many Monotheists also
> believe in Joy (the Hrestoli) while others do not (the Rokari).
>
>From Brithini POV, I simply thinks Solace was that Zzabur's secret weaponry
he could access. And we know living Malkioni cannot access to Solace or Joy
except of their obscure images in some of their religious practice. (If the
setting of old RQ still works.) Solace is a sort of Heaven that RW
monotheism teaches I suppose. But if someone can go there, he also can
destroy or abuse there, I think. And Joy.....I guess some sort of mystical
liberation of Mind only knights can be attainable as Hrestol or Talor.
> >It seems that I don't completely understand the sentence of Zzabur's
words
> >at the top of Revealed Mythologies.
>
> That's good because Zzabur didn't teach Solace (despite what that article
> says).
Or he used the term "Solace" with another meaning. As Plentonius used "Illumination" in his GROY.
I tried to understand the sentences of Zzabur and I analyze that he deleted the "personality" of Malkion that was the OS of the big computer of Zzabur's power data base, when Malkion the Sacrifice died, Zzabur deleted the error and began to clean up? his hard disk.
"Solace doesn't exist except my computer, so help me (let me tap your magic) blasting Devil-Worm."
Graham:
> Reason and logic are related concepts. The major difference is that logic
> has some form of formal structure, whereas reason has only the structure
of
> normal language. Anywhere where you start by formally defining your axioms
> and proving your lemmas is logic, not reason.
>
In Older Setting of RQ 3rd, certainly Waertagi tried to bring back Brithos
in the Future Schedule of Hero Wars. So perhaps it didn't go a untouchable
place after closing.
> My personal belief is that the reliance on Logic is the great failing of
> the Brithini. Logic, in my Glorantha, can only be used within its own
> framework. Any attempt to relate it to the real world is doomed to
failure,
> since I do not believe that Glorantha has an inherently logical basis.
This
> leaves the Brithini as a group of aging philosophers, endlessly proving
> that the arrow cannot hit the tortoise, without ever once being able to
> test their argument and realise their basic axioms are not true.
>
Maybe. YGMV. But if Brithini is right and others are wrong...?
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