There is certainly a good point to check the difference of HW (HQ?) rule and
that of old RQ.
In a sense, after Eurmal split your tongue and brain into two, you began to
think differently. HW characters doesn't have basic RPGish stats and ability
skill scores. And
There is no INT, SIZ, POW, DEX nor STR.
Only Old One (Sandy) knows how to make up fascinating stuffs from the mixture of fantasy, imagination like monstrosity of Cthulhu. HW and HQ abandoned the detail of reality (or at least unified order / form of entities?) for making-up another reality.
But Greg can state that, "no, it is not Gloranthan reality."
I think it is a spot that realism made another appeal of Rune Quest. (As some old RQers pointed out.) Though realism is not always good thing, And game rules limits its reality itself under the complexity of Real World.
http://glorantha.kondalski.org/g9index/1025.html
>From: "TERRA INCOGNITA" <inarsus-ferilt-z_at_mrg.biglobe.ne.jp>
>>and some of Japanese RQ players have said that the most fascinating aspect
>>of Glorantha derived from its reality....
Greg Stafford:
>I'd be interested to hear more bout this perspective
TI
>That is from our recent discussion about the difference between Esrolians
>(Heortlings) and Lunars for the lawsuit in HW-jp mailing list, if I have a
>chance, I want to talk some about it.
The discussion is mainly derived from Greg's Q&A. http://www.glorantha.com/new/q-and-a/esrolia.html
HEORTLING It is from the discussion about the lawsuit, differences of three cultures, Lunars, Esrolians and Sartarites.
As you know, Esrolians were Vingkotlings in Darkness but later abandoned its way after the disastrous events of Sword and Helm, but I think they still have some similarity to their former cousins in custom and culture, as official Issaries site document stated.
And after King of Sartar and the Report of Orlanthi Society, many good essays are written down for both Orlanthi and Lunars, like Jeff Richard (Tales #18, Enclosure), Martin Laurie (Economy of Empire: Four Scrolls of Revelation), Mark Galeotti (Crime of Empire: Moon Rites), and great Thunder Rebels etc...but how about do you think if I dare to say that increase of information and variety of paradigm can diminish the effect of diversity of each cultures? Maybe you can say we simply banish the stereotypes and replace more reality suited for more complicated fantasy world....But what is "reality" in fantasy world? Why you need reality for your maximum fun?
ESROLIANS
*Discussion of rapists and broos. (I don't understand what bothered you:
(Martin Laurie). and I (TI) didn't want to repeat the old discussion between
Morgan Conrad and he. "LUNARS are not heortlings!" "They are far more
varietied and colorful than you expext!")
Thugh certainly lunars are replaced in the DH position in the modern glorantha, originally dara happans are opposite in the concept of culture and their society. (If you suspect on me about such "one-sided" point of view, see Wyrm's Footprint p. 76 Gods and Goddesses of Glorantha, Cosmic Kingship))
For example, Esrolians are far more organized for their land is densely populated than heortland and sartar, and urbanized in the women land, do you see the irony of the Storm Tribe myth? Orlanth is a sort of embodiment of decentralization against Fire tribe (Dara Happa.) . But he must take responsibility and risk to drop his "freedom". And in the overly-simplification even without mention of Julian's writing about Harandings. (Tradetalk #10) Heortlings have only very simplified form of punishment like weregeld, outlawry, and execution on the contrary of complicated matter in urbanized society clinging to crimes that Mark Galeotti wrote in Moon Rites.
And there is no real world Woman centered culture except in some legends like amazons in Greek Mythology....Woman blame manhood in Entekosiad for their three great error. But I don't know this kind of "woman blames manhood." style point of mythology attached to the writings of more RW reality related answers. And Ernaldan way of "There is always another way" can alter Heortling custom.
LUNAR and DARA HAPPA
I can overstate "all urbanized life" is a sort of lunarization. From very
one sided point of view, Yelm is in a sense, "Oppression and Choking of
Freedom" at least from the point of view of their enemies (like heortling,
you know.) And you cannot know enough about the difference of Lunars and
Esrolians without understanding both of their life-styles and idea
polluted....even if you safely aren't illuminated. Life in Kethaela is not
Lunar.
And in RW, we aren't sure how the different culture judge criminals and crime, even if the faces of judges and jurors are different, it might be simply because the place is also different. Efendi told me that law and cycles of history was, is, and should be understood from the experiences of watchers, not from third party.
I heard the logic of true and real world jurist of the analysis for the difference between dara happans (a japanese bachelor of laws, I think.) and orlanthi according to writings of Jeff and Greg, though I can't find any sore spot of his opinion, and explanation from the point of view of Green Age Myth (like Entekosiad and Sword and Helm, mythology of trinity goddesses etc..appropriate for esrolvuli) is not appealed for the weakness of my eloquency and / or weakness of logic, I feel I missed something important for understanding the situation.
And I see similar phenomena in recent discussion of mine and Martin's about
Glorantha warfare....commonality and diversity....He tries to grasp the
concept of warfare with far more multiple perspectives, and try to turn each
advantage into weaknesses, for "Warfare is the Way of deception." And
Inflexibility of idea itself is weakness.
http://www.sonshi.com/sun1.html
I cannot deny his logic and this kind of thinking is similar to the change
of paradigm, as I once heard about the change of HW schedule about waertagi
and seshnela-tanisor.
In game affairs, we cannot know how the knowledge of adventures and enlarged perceptions change our own characters. It might be, or can be the weakness of tabletop RPG...
So it is another trigger for the classical question about the matter of fantasy and reality? or subjectism and objectism? You know I am confused. It is possibly because I have too poor intelligence to grasp the situation.....or I expect too much......in the matter of differences of personal preferences.
But we might feel futility to some kind of level in questions of this digest, (as I expect now you feel to me...) and some times feel irritation while your friends don't have interest in some kind of matter which you think important. Maybe there is some guideline and hint before you (even if you are not narrators) are bored.
Maybe Martin Laurie have an interest to this east asian "machiavellian".....though he was far more older than Han Fei-tzu (Han Feizi)
http://www.uoregon.edu/~jrondeau/world_history/legalism_questions.htm http://www.personal.psu.edu/faculty/g/j/gjs4/PM-China/ch5_main.htm http://www.cic.sfu.ca/nacrp/articles/legalmohist/hanfeizi/hlhanfei.html http://www.essential-china.net/04_beliefs/contents/3_legalism.htm http://www.personal.psu.edu/faculty/g/j/gjs4/p-ex-ctr/174-1.htm http://academic.brooklyn.cuny.edu/core9/phalsall/texts/hanfei.html
It is a reason why I mention here Chinese Legalism, though it can be a target of criticism for I'm not expert to law affairs and international frictions. But even I can realize there is a gap between concept of "Law" in japan (and I dare to say in China, as another old Confucianism state. And don't use same word "Law" to "law"of nature and that of which human made) and westerners. Eastern Asians lack the point of view of emphasis of city life in Greek and roman age, rule of churches in medieval age. Or 10c Vikings who emigrated Iceland escaping Harald Fairhair oppressive rule. (Though they geographically live in a volcanic island as we in some level, certainly, very culturally different.)
And we might know that the Heaven might collapse if Emperor sit upon over his throne of Kyoto. (Today, Tokyo.) and (perhaps historians deny my vague idea as spiritual obliteration and influenced from the "Revival of Emperor Rule" in Meiji Era.) I think perhaps there is some similarity to the mind set of Dara Happans. (Even if it is no europeanized idea of divine right to rule.) And I think if you need another opinion of ancient mind of RW east asia, Fei-tzu might be good for the object of speculation.
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