Lunar Titles

From: Mark Galeotti <Mark_at_galeotti.fsbusiness.co.uk>
Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2003 16:17:17 +0100


Newt asks:

> Simple question; What is the noble title of a Dara Happan noble who =
> powerfull enough to be head of an Association?

There is no formal title, for the simple reason that each association is different, so choose your own -- you can go for generics like Patriarch, Primus, etc, or create suitably highfaluting DH titles of your own, like Grand Enactor, Gold Sunburst, Eminent Ipsissimus of the Highest Tablet or whatever...

TI asserts:

> But in ILH, the meaning of Ordanestyum made some of Japanese
gloranthaphiles
> puzzle about the system and its members, in p.9, it seems it is equal to
> "First Circle" in "Glorantha", p.97 (Former Imperial Presidium in Tales
#16
> and Satraps.) But in page 58 of ILH-1 & Martin Laurie's Imperial Economy,
> same Ordanestyum seems hold vast members and factions like Senatus in Star
> Wars Universe....

> In Fortunate Succession, Emperor Erzanestyu first founded it and gathered
> the toga-men from local Provinces as representatives. I think some
confusion
> lies over between LE democracy and oligarchy.......inside of ILH designers
> brain.....

It's always nice to be accused of confusion on the basis of a rather arbitrary mis-reading of the sources.

  1. Tales 16 is a lovely issue, full of fun and great ideas. It is not a canonical source, though, and assuming that it is and trying to connect the official and Tales Empires is fruitless. Take either on their own merits, don't try to conflate them.
  2. The Empire is not a democracy. It's not even an oligarchy, except insofar as *any* large and complex political structure, even Stalin's Russia or Saddam's Iraq, is to an extent an oligarchy in practical terms. All political, legal and moral authority comes from the Emperor, full stop. Somehow I don't think any of us are confused on this point.
  3. The Ordanestyum does not contain huge numbers of people -- ILH-1 p9 gives an idea of the select movers and shakers within its number. All its members have numerous different interests and often roles, so they tend to be members of several different blocs and factions, depending in part on the issues concerned. Thus, for example, the Grand Convocationalist of the Imperial Church Synod, will generally support Pan-Imperial Lunar interests over regional ones, but is also supporting of the expansionists when it comes to campaigns in the South (which extend the authority of the Provincial Church), while Great Sister, who shares his views about the need to Lunarise the Empire, is opposed to militarism as a diversion of energies and resources. Thus, many factions. The 'First Circle' is an even more select core of favourites within this number.
  4. From a quick glance through, there are two mentions of the Ordanestyum in Martin's Imperial Economy essay in 4SoR: one says that it fixes Provincial tribute, the other that Great Sister is a member. Just how does this translate into a contradictory statement about huge numbers of members?

It's one of those days. I could have just ignored the post, but I wasn't in the mood. I still think it's nicer to say that there seems to be a contradiction and look for explanation rather than assert confusion on the authors' part.

Now let normal service be resumed...

Mark

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