YGWV. Here is mine.
>From: Trotsky <TTrotsky_at_blueyonder.co.uk>
>Subject: Re: Swindlers and Sorcerers
>>And swindlers can be heroquesters.........
>>
>It would probably be a Lanbril heroquest - or
>whatever the Western
>equivalent might be. But, in general, yes.
I´d suggest that anyone setting off on a HQ with swinder's data is doomed. Imean, you must have the correct data to succeed, or else be incredibly lucky.
>>>>> > But perhaps Zzaburi don't believe existence
>of Saints.....
Of course the Zzaburites recognize the existance of Saints, just as theywould never deny the existance of gods and spirits. They just deny the value of such beings to the ultimate success of zzaburite spirituality.
>Subject: Re: Re: Grace and Heaven
>The question was the measurability (in mathematical
>therms) of the Otherworld.
>
>Ttrotsky:
>> At any rate, the question is, are there
>> people on Glorantha who
>> would give a detailed answer to such a question,
>and
>> are any of them
>> sincere? I think the answer is clearly 'yes' to
>both
>> questions. But they
>> do not IMO form a mainstream group, even in the
>> West.
Iwould go farther and say that there are people hwo would give an answer and that they are sincere. but they are wrong.
>> a great many>> theists, animists and
>> mystics are quite capable of talking in
>gobbledigook>> and are frequently
>> happy to do so! And I'd argue that the sort of
>> answers given by our >> mathematical sorcerer only look 'simple' to us>> because we're used to
>> mathematics in the modern world.
>
>Yes, but in my campaign I *have* a terrestrial
>astronaut fallen on Glorantha
OK, YGWV.
>and his main source of
>information about Glorantha is a *Zzaburite
>sorcerer*.
>So he (the astronaut) *is* asking mathematical
>questions and he *is* looking for
>mathematical/geometrical rules in his attempt to
>comprehend the Otherworld of his mentor and his own
>hopes to reverse the phenomenon which brought him to
>Glorantha in order to return to Earth.
>Has he any possibility to discern a mathematical order
>(in terrestrial modern terms) in Gloranthan Logic
>Otherworld or not?
No.
>> I mean 'tenth
>> exponent of the Universal
>> Constant of Myth'; well, it all may look very neat
>> and defined from
>> where we're standing, but does it really have any
>> more inherent meaning
>> in it than something a mystic might say?
>
>Precisely. Does it has a respondance in Gloranthan
>reality or not? A respondance which can be
>"scientifically proved and used" by a modern
>Avionic Engineer specialized in Astronomy (the Astronaut).
No. Magic is a noncountable thing. You can ot anweer it with a value of "how many," just "how much." The numbers given are approximate, variable and indefinite. At least, in the Glorantha I know of. It is mythic, not mathmatical.
>> It's not as if you're likely to go there to find out
>> in most games. Its
>> advanced stuff. Indeed, it's Great Secret stuff,
>> most likely.
>
>Is that the only answer?
>When he (the astronaut) delves in Gloranthan reality
>and otherworlds so that he comprehends how to return
>to earth,
Here you are asking for the impossible. This really is something that only your campaign can answer. Elric has no place in Middle Earth, Hulk cannot be measured against Thrudgelmir, and an M16 can´t be used in Glorantha. At least, not in the orignal stories, but of course. we encourage you to make your own fantasies.
>he is not an astronaut anymore (maybe he is
>a zzaburite like his mentor) and he has lost any
>terrestrial memory too!
>Frightening but coherent, imo.
He would know, as an advanced zzaburite, that the numbers are only approximate. The resistance may vary.
>Julian:
>> We have to remember that Sorcery is based on Logic,
>> so that it would IMO actually _require_ that some
>> sort
>> of comprehensible analytical statement of the kind
>> be made for it to descend into / be manifest in the
>> Inner
>> World of the mortals.
Note inner worlds, where we can count grains of sand, pebbles or stars in the sky. The Ortherworlds are different.
Sincerely,
Greg Stafford
--__--__--
Powered by hypermail