>>> Magic is a noncountable thing. You cannot answer it with=20
>>> a value of "how many," just "how much." The numbers given
>>> are approximate, variable and indefinite. At least, in the
>>> Glorantha I know of. It is mythic, not mathmatical.=20
>>
>>
>
>In the late nineties, you were describing Sorcery as the type of magic
>specific to the mundane, *measurable* world, suggesting that sorcerous
>magic, at least, was "countable". Has this changed, or am I grasping the
>wrong end of the stick (that you are hitting me with :-)?
>
There is a difference between 'countable' and 'measurable', as Greg
indicates with "'how much' but not 'how many'". How many peas do I have?
Twenty: peas are countable. How hot is it? 30°c: temperature is
measurable but not countable, because 1°c isn't an actual, real *thing*.
Anyone can understand what 'twenty peas' means, but '30°c' isn't a lot
of help to, say, an ancient Roman. Greg seems to be saying that magic is
more like temperature - if you could come up with a unit of magical
energy (which would, inevitably, be arbitrary) you could answer the
question 'how much magic do I have?', at least in principle, and if
you're a Zzaburi sorcerer you might well try to do so (succeeding might
be trickier!) Or a piece of string; you don't count a piece of string,
you measure it. So something can be part of the measurable world while
still being a 'noncountable thing' as Greg puts it.
Plus, things can be measurable without having definite values. The value could be inherently variable, or it might be impossible to come up with linear units, while still being in some sense measurable and capable of providing at least an approximate answer to a 'how much' question? It's a bit like trying to pinpoint the location and momentum of a particle in quantum physics - there's no discrete answer, but you can still measure and apply maths to quantum mechanical concepts. (Note, of course, that I'm using quantum physics as an analogy; I'm not saying the two are directly comparable, even to a Zzaburi or astronaut).
And another thing: IMO mathematics in Glorantha is a form of magic. I mean, you scribble down arcane symbols on a bit of paper, and it tells you how to build a bridge without it collapsing! Nifty stuff! Just as Lhankor Mhy has Literacy magic, somebody will have Mathematical magic (St Deristopheles and St Urestes from the unpublished Sorcerer Knights, for instance). And maths, IMG at least, can be used as a tool for exploring and understanding sorcerous magic, just as divine revelation or knowledge of myths can. But it won't give you certain answers, because we're mere mortals. Greg's Glorantha may not go even that far, of course.
-- Trotsky Gamer and Skeptic ------------------------------------------------------ Trotsky's RPG website: http://www.ttrotsky.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/ --__--__--
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