Appologies to Chris Lemens. Sorry Chris, I didn't mean to get on your case so hard. We do seem to substantialy agree.
Many of us do seem to be coming to a consensus that while martial arts monk types get cool magic and combat powers, those powers aren't gained directly through mystical means. They aren't 'Mystical Powers' but Common Magic, Theist, etc.
On the other hand we know that many gods and spirits aren't anathema to mysticism per se, but engagement with entities such as the anti-gods will lead you away from the mystical path.
Therefore while learning cool martial arts powers doesn't necesserily cause you to stray away from the path, it's not realy leading you down it either. The way I see it is that most people are unable to even concieve of what the true mystical path is like. Such people are attracted into these 'pre-mystical' schools by the kewl powerz and while they're there they absorb little bits of mystical knowledge and perspective, preparing them to understand the true way.
The Lunars take a similar approach. Worshiping Etyries won't make you illuminated, but since Etyries herself was illuminated you'll pick up little bits of illuminated wisdom and lore. If those seeds take root in your conciousness, eventualy you might become ready to follow that path yourself.
Many poeple do fail, and focus solely on the kewl powerz stuff. They never realy advance on the mystical path, and just become martial arts warriors, but hopefuly at least they won't actively work against the enlightenment of others, and their activities help support the existence of the schools. Maybe they'll do better in the next life. Other more mysticaly 'gifted' students do start on their first steps towards enlightenment, and eventualy come to realise that the Kewl Powerz stuff is just a front.
In our world mystical teachings have often been 'hidden' behind theist and animist traditions. Tibetan Budhism has been used as an example here, with stories of how great Budhists enlightened various gods and spirits, which the common people continue to worship in the valleys below the Budhist monasteries on the mountaintops. I think this synergistic relationship is fascinating and I think we all agree it exists in various forms in Glorantha. I just think that the terminology of 'Failed Mysticism' is causing a lot of unnecessery problems. Strictly speaking it's accurate, but I don't think it's very useful.
Simon Hibbs
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