>
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 30 Mar 2005 21:53:05 +1200
> From: Peter Metcalfe <metcalph_at_quicksilver.net.nz>
> Subject: Gods of the West
> To: glorantha_at_rpglist.org
> Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20050330211935.02d22440_at_pop.qsi.net.nz>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
>
> Terra Incognita:
>
>>*Idovanus [From POV of Loskalmi, Contact Place: Mystical Plane somehow
>>related to Fire Essence?]
>
> Idovanus and most other (sorcerous) Gods would be found on the Venerable
> Plane.
If I remember correctly, Martin Laurie had different idea and Idovanus was
rather Mystical than Sorcerous.....more Lunarized Concept than that of
Western....
(And anyway I have waited long Imperial Lunar Handbook 2 Under the Red
Moon.....)
>
>>*Irensavel [From POV of Rokari, Contact Place: Beyond Immeasurable Plane
>>or
>>Joy?]
>
> Joy is a new and improved version of Solace which is found on the
> Venerable
> Plane. Irensavel lies beyond.
HeroQuest rulebook is different from older setting in HeroWars 1st Edition:
Narrators Book p.28.
HQ rulebook mentioned only as Venerable Plane beyond Saint Plane. (It had
stratum of IG, Joy (Immeasurable) and Law (Solace) in NB.)
Certainly most Malkioni heroes can't pass through 10w9 barrier and I think
NB is mainly described from POV of Hrestoli. (though Trotsky denied it.)
Please see my chart and the first chapter of auld 3rd RQ Gods of Glorantha
about Malkioni Creation Story:
(I don't have English GoG so below is translated poorly from my Japanese
Edition GoG.)
<<Nature is measurable and expectable function, so Creation began with the first arithmetical series, from Unknowable Zero to Creator One. And he created Two as Cosmic Duality, Two created Three as our Known World....>>
http://www2u.biglobe.ne.jp/~BLUEMAGI/MalkioniCastes.htm#KingdomOfLogic
First Action <-> Immeasurable Plane
Second Action <-> Law Plane
And if Makan and Irensavel should be included here, Makan was before Solace,
Irensavel was before Joy.
> Although the Carmanians rejected Makan, the modern Loskalmi do not.
> Instead they believe that Makan is a manifestation of Irensavel. Denial
> of Irensavel leads to error and damnation (such as the fate of the
> God Learners) but Makan is not intrinsically false.
This contradicts Glorantha: Introduction to HW p.78 "The Doctrine of Hidden Mover", though it precedes Revealed Mythologies. And I think some of Loskalmi (Isolationists) justify Syndics Ban as the blessing by Holy Family of Snodal and Syglat, Inside (Irensavel) and Outside (Makan), and KoW is from Makan....though I am not sure the opinion of Watchdog Council.....
>>[Rokari rejects Hrestol's Prophet status and thinks its "Freedom and
>>Equality Spirit" led the Downfall of God Learners
>
> I don't think this is correct. The error of the God Learners was more
> subtle than belief that Hrestol was a Prophet (The Abiding Book is
> silent on the matter).
I think I can read HQ p. 157 lines in a sense between Isaiah and Christ. IMO some of Rokari think Hrestol was bad and so he was condemned (Worship only IG, not Saints.), but I didn't want to say all of them think so.
>
>>Their caste concept is from Brithini,
>
> The Rokari caste concept is from the Republic of Zerendel. Brithos
> was a minor land then and I think the Malkioni would say their
> traditions come from the Old Republic rather than Brithos. A bit
> like the attitudes of Western Europe to Constantinople.
Mmm, did we talk about it before this? I simply can't recall, Peter? Your idea is from Revealed Mythologies and I don't want to deny it.
>
>>*Ganesatarus [From POV of Carmanians, Perhaps Underworld as
>>followed in Drastic Resolution: Darkness]
>
> I suspect the Venerable Plane again. But to even suggest this gets
> you into Big Trouble in Carmania.
>
Enclosure 1 suggests more complicated relation about Fronalakino (Fronalako)
and Malakinus.....
Oh yes, Under the Red Moon might suggest some answer about it......
TI
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