From runequest Sat May 15 10:28:06 1993
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To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Daily automated RQ-Digest)
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Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Thu, 13 May 1993, part 1
Precedence: junk
Status: OR
This is the automated Daily RuneQuest Digest.
Send submissions only to "RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM", they
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Selected articles may also appear in a regular Digest. If you
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The RuneQuest Daily is a spin-off of the RuneQuest Digest and deals
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---------------------
~From: seh0@aberystwyth.ac.uk
~Subject: Kargan Tor is reborn!!!!
Message-ID: <9305121305.AA20185@deca.aber.ac.uk>
~Date: 12 May 93 15:05:10 GMT
"Better White Than Red"?????? Harumph!
Thanks to David Hall for the Kargan Tor info. I was wanting to know because my
players have recently re-founded the cult, and it's shaping up to be a powerful
battlefield cult, if only it can expand to more than 100 men (which is what it's
at now).
Anyone have any idea of what battle formations would be used in Glorantha? I'm
toying with the idea of RQ Battle for my own use - I noted the comment earlier
on about someone needing playtesters for a system....I'd like to offer my (self as
a tester.\
A couple of people have asked me for stuff I've been working on, like the taking
of Corflu. If people want to send me their land-mail addresses, I'll send them
copies of stuff for the cost it would take for me to produce the material, apart
from those who have already contacted me, who I've said already, I'll send some
spare copies that I have lying around to.
Anyway, I can't talk long. Things to do. Exams to pass. S'long folks.
Stephen M Hunt
BETTER RED THAN DEAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
---------------------
~From: T.S.Baguley@open.ac.uk (Thom Baguley)
~Subject: Lhankor Mhy
Message-ID: <9305121516.AB00435@Sun.COM>
~Date: 12 May 93 08:05:00 GMT
>From: paul@phyast.pitt.edu (Paul Reilly)
> It looks like I have made a mistake here. Since I don't own Cults of Prax
>(when it came out we were all struggling students and each of us bought
> just one or two of the RQ II supplements) my memory of it is sometimes
>fuzzy and I stand corrected. I naively thought all those indexing notations
>on various documents (like Report on Skyfall Lake) actually MEACNT something!
If you don't have CoP it wasn't a mistake. I'm sure the filing systems are
wonderful. Unfortunately LM temples are very factionalized. Individual scholars
or groups rarely tell anyone where they filed anything important. LM scholars
tend to hoard knowledge (Issaries cultists are the communicators ... for a
price).
CoP does hint that they are waiting for a cult hero to sort this out ...
Thom
_/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ Human Cognition Research Lab
_/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ The Open University
_/_/_/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ Milton Keynes MK7 6AA, U.K.
_/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ Tel: +44 908 65-4518 Fax: -3169
_/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ Internet:T.S.Baguley@open.ac.uk
---------------------
~From: T.S.Baguley@open.ac.uk (Thom Baguley)
~Subject: Lodril
Message-ID: <9305121519.AB00435@Sun.COM>
~Date: 12 May 93 08:12:13 GMT
>From: f6ri@midway.uchicago.edu (charles gregory fried)
>So, if anyone has any brilliant ideas on the spiritual and earthly
>economy of volcanos and Lodril in Glorantha, I'd love your input! By Friday
>- I have to GM this weekend! -- Greg
There is an official RQIII writeup of Lodril (but RQ II type format) in an old
issue of White Wolf (sorry I forget which).
Thom
_/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ Human Cognition Research Lab
_/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ The Open University
_/_/_/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ Milton Keynes MK7 6AA, U.K.
_/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ Tel: +44 908 65-4518 Fax: -3169
_/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ Internet:T.S.Baguley@open.ac.uk
---------------------
~From: tsl@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU (Tim Leask)
~Subject: Re: Orlanth Gifts and Geases
Message-ID: <9305120727.19384@mulga.cs.mu.OZ.AU>
~Date: 12 May 93 22:27:51 GMT
dickmj@postman.essex.ac.uk
> Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Sat, 08 May 1993, part 1
> Message-ID: <9305101504.AA01869@serdlc13>
> Date: 10 May 93 15:04:39 GMT
Arganth (dickmj@postman.essex.ac.uk) writes:
> One of my 'on-goings' at the moment is an Orlanthi gift and geas table
> (for the really devout worshipper). When it's finished I'll probably
> post it if it's any good. Has any body got any ideas? I've started with
> geases and so far have thought of (among others) 'Never allow a dog
> into your presence', 'Never let a Trickster remain unbound until he has
> sworn the bondsman pledge' as well as the more obvious 'never seek
> shelter from the sun' and 'challenge all lunars to a first blood duel
> on sight'. Gifts so far include the ability to talk to the wind sylphs
> (i.e to hear of events which occurred where the wind is blowing from)
> and the ability to fly once a day, as well as skill increases (like
> Yelmalioan and Humakti gifts)
Obviously what you do in your campaign is entirely upto to you, but IMHO
the idea of geases would be anathema to Orlanthi, for various reasons.
Here are some.
i) Orlanthi believe strongly in the idea of personal freedom (in stark contrast
to the autocratic ways of the Solar Pantheon). Geases are a direct attack
on this freedom.
ii) It would make them seem to have something in common with the Yelmalions
iii) Orlanthi aren't into rules and regulations this is related to i)
If you were to implement such a scheme the recipient of the gift and geas
should be able to chose like the humakti do. At least this way the
recipient gets to choose the restriction they want rather than randomly
having there freedom curtailed in some way.
On another slightly related point are geases magical in nature ?
In my opinion they should be since the gifts are obviously magical and
it thus seems reasonable that geases would likewise be magical.
Geas,to me at least, implies more than just a vow (which is how most
people seem to play them). It should be impossible to forget a geas.
As to what the actual effects of a geas should be I'm not sure.
Whether Yelmalio whispers a gentle reminder in your ear as you are about
to take shelter from a Storm or perhaps you have an acute attack of claustro-
phobia as you enter the Inn.
The effects could be many and varied depending on the deity, the geas and the
worshipper.
For instance someone with the gease "never drink alcohol" - would become
violently ill if they did so. Someone with "always challenge ZZ worshippers"
would blurt out a challenge almost without realising it
What do others think about this ?
Cheers,
Tim
================================================================================
Department of Computer Science /*\__/\ "Money is something you have in
University of Melbourne < \ case you don't die tomorrow."
Parkville, Vic., 3052, AUSTRALIA \ _ _/ Gordon Gecko.
Phone: +61 3 282 2439 \| --
e-mail: tsl@cs.mu.oz.au
================================================================================
---------------------
~From: mabeyke@batman.b11.ingr.com (boris)
~Subject: Re: RQ Daily 5/11/93, Random thoughts on geasa, etc.
Message-ID: <199305121556.AA09732@batman.b11.ingr.com>
~Date: 12 May 93 15:56:09 GMT
dickmj@postman.essex.ac.uk (-Argranth) wrote:
< A really cool Eurmal spell and cooler trick.>
Good stuff; I probably use the trick in the next round of my Pavis Eurmal
Shrine Wars. Ought to be some way of working it in.
---------------------
dickmj@postman.essex.ac.uk (-Arganth) wrote later:
>
> One of my 'on-goings' at the moment is an Orlanthi gift and geas table
> (for the really devout worshipper). When it's finished I'll probably
> post it if it's any good. Has any body got any ideas? I've started with
> geases and so far have thought of (among others) 'Never allow a dog
> into your presence', 'Never let a Trickster remain unbound until he has
> sworn the bondsman pledge' as well as the more obvious 'never seek
> shelter from the sun' and 'challenge all lunars to a first blood duel
> on sight'. Gifts so far include the ability to talk to the wind sylphs
> (i.e to hear of events which occurred where the wind is blowing from)
> and the ability to fly once a day, as well as skill increases (like
> Yelmalioan and Humakti gifts)
Maybe it's just me, but a Gift and Geas list seems kind of counter to
basic Orlanthi philosophy. I mean, Orlanth was always doing weird stuff,
and when it blew up on him, going back and putting things right. His
followers, I think, would be encouraged to try lots of things (but never
chaos); if they worked, fine, but if they didn't, go back and fix things.
But there's no indication they believe there is a single standard of
behavior, other than having the six virtues. (Lesse, they are [furrow brow
in thought] Piety, Bravery, Honor, Generosity, Wisdom, Justice.)
Actually, if you look at which published cults have gifts and geasa, it's
only the ones with the Truth rune. This makes sense; they believe there
is one true way, and if you follow it you get benefits. So having gifts &
geasa for Lhankor Mhy or Dayzatar would make much more sense than Orlanth,
or that Babeester Gor writeup that someone posted long ago.
Oh, well, not a flame or anything. Just my thoughts.
-------------------
On the Humakt as a Western import; this works just fine except for one
thing. The Orlanthi Mythology in KOS: finally explained something that's
bothered me for a while, namely, why Orlanth has no ties to the Death rune.
I mean, he was the second person to use the bloody (literally) thing, he
probably used on the most powerful being anybody ever has, and the person
he used it on has the stinking rune! And there, in KOS it says that he
gives up all his ties to it to Humakt so he will have control of it once
more (or something like this). If Humakt wasn't well known by him, Orlanth
would hardly have done that. So, now I need some *other* reason why the
second most likely god to have the Death rune gave it up.
--
Boris Mikey, aka |"Here the ways of men part: if you wish to strive
Maurice Beyke | for peace of soul and pleasure, then believe; if
mabeyke@ingr.com | you wish to be a devotee of truth, then inquire."
Intergraph doesn't want Nietzsche
my opinions.
---------------------
~From: brandon@ncbi.nlm.nih.gov (Brandon Brylawski)
~Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Tue, 11 May 1993, part 1
Message-ID: <9305121454.AA22156@caldonia.nlm.nih.gov>
~Date: 12 May 93 14:54:06 GMT
With regard to Orlanth gifts and geases:
I love tables of special abilities and what have you, but I have a problem with
doing this for Orlanth, as I alluded to once before. Unlike Humakt and
Yelmalio, both of which have relatively regimented social structures, assume
highly militaristic duties, and prize devotion and obedience more than
independent action, Orlanth prizes flexibility and independence among a loose
group of friends, rather than commander and soldier. This flexibility goes
counter to binding oneself with oaths and geases. Just as winds must be free
to roam whither they will, the follower of Orlanth should not fetter himself
with restrictions on his behavior. Orlanth made mistakes and later had to quest
to redress them; thus, Orlanthi must have the freedom to make mistakes, and
not be coerced by a priori restrictions on their activity. Friends may wear many
guises, and friends/companions are very important to Orlanth, so he should
not bar himself from meeting potential friends by restricting his behavior (what
if a potential ally has a dog?). Words like 'always' and 'never' themselves
are not Orlanthi - he is the god of Change, after all, and nothing is forever.
I would propose that instead of geases for Orlanth there be a table of minor
gifts that a GM can grant to a devout Orlanthi when he does something truly
impressive that exemplifies one of Orlanth's cardinal virtues - Courage, Honor,
Piety, Generosity, Wisdom . Ideally, these should be actions that
place the character at risk, for example:
Courage - risking one's life to do the right thing, especially to help a friend.
Honor - doing one's duty, especially if it involved redressing a mistake one has
made, to one's own detriment.
Piety - Upholding Orlanth in his traditional endeavors, such as helping
Ernalda, Challenging Yelm, or Destroying Chaos, when such actions are
potentially lethal to the character.
Generosity - begarring yourself to assist another in need.
Wisdom - making a difficult and dangerous decision in a sensible manner,
especially finding a solution for a crisis that seems to have no way of
resolving itself well.
Brandon
From runequest Sat May 15 10:28:06 1993
From news@glorantha Thu May 13 17:17:36 1993
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From: RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RQ Digest Maintainer)
To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Daily automated RQ-Digest)
Reply-To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RuneQuest Daily)
Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Thu, 13 May 1993, part 4
Precedence: junk
Status: OR
This is the automated Daily RuneQuest Digest.
Send submissions only to "RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM", they
will automatically be included in a next issue. Try to change the
~Subject: line from the default Re: RuneQuest Daily... on replying.
Selected articles may also appear in a regular Digest. If you
want to submit articles to the Digest only, contact the editor at
RuneQuest-Digest-Editor@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM.
-Henk Langeveld
--
Send Submissions to:
Enquiries to:
The RuneQuest Daily is a spin-off of the RuneQuest Digest and deals
with the subjects of Avalon Hill's RPG and Greg Stafford's world of
Glorantha. Maintainer: Henk.Langeveld@Sun.COM
---------------------
~From: henkl@holland.sun.com (Henk Langeveld - Sun Nederland)
~Subject: Re: Yaks and Books and Things That Go Bump
Message-ID: <1993May13.102747.3676@holland.sun.com>
~Date: Thu, 13 May 1993 10:27:47 GMT
100270.337@CompuServe.COM (Nick Brooke) writes:
[In your reply to Adam from Aberystwyth]
>This is neat. You suggest say that pre-God Learner sorcery was nothing
>like the RQ3 stuff; that the GL's come up with all this manipulation
>business, which then creeps back into the Malkioni Churches as an
>alternative to the mainstream tradition. Note, though, that belief in the
>Invisible God predates the God Learners.
You write about three different forms of sorcery here, "pure"
God-Learner, Western Wizardry, and "Scientific" Sorcery as described in
RQ3...
The keyword to Sorcery *and* the God Learners seems to be
*manipulation*. Part of the bad reputation of sorcerors may be
due to this fact. But don't forget Tap...
I think that the difference between GL practices and Western sorcery
lies in the limited scope of the latter. "Sorcery" is limited to
manipulating natural phenomena (where "natural" in Glorantha includes
the spirit world), while the God Learners practiced manipulation on a
higher level, i.e. the hero Plane...
Of course, Lunars also _manipulate_ magic, but restrict it to spirit
and divine magic... Which made me think: Do we really need an entirely
different magic system for sorcery?
The differences can be summarized in three categories:
- method of acquiring spells (spirit combat,sacrifice,study)
- available methods of manipulation, implying different
methods of determining success
- list of available spells...
Can we design a single magic system that would allow us to handle
all known (and possibly unknown) approaches to magic in Glorantha?
--
Henk.Langeveld@Sun.COM
>"Violent disagreement is the last refuge of the incompetent."
Would a Humakti agree with that?
--
Henk.Langeveld@Sun.COM/_________________/System and Network Administrator
Sun NL - Information Resources____________disclaimer: My words, not Sun's
[For info about the RuneQuest mailing list: |TM: RuneQuest is a role-]
[RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM|playing game of Chaosium/AH]
---------------------
~From: T.S.Baguley@open.ac.uk (Thom Baguley)
~Subject: Humakti
Message-ID: <9305131127.AA06202@Sun.COM>
~Date: 13 May 93 04:19:20 GMT
>From: etlanmy@aachen.ericsson.se (Allan Murphy)
>Example: On the Zorak Zoran High Holy day, gangs of trolls go out looking
>for lone Humakti. One troll challenges the unfortunate to one-to-one combat.
>Afterwards, the gang of trolls kill the Humakti ( assuming he is alive ).
>How does this work if the Humakti is allowed to run for it and hide and sneak
?
>Surely then some Humakti would get away..etc etc.
No pious Humakti would refuse a one to one challenge. As for running away or
hiding I think it is a matter of degree. The precise circumstances are very
important. Even the most honourable Humakti seek shelter from lightning storms.
e.g. A Humakti Sword is separated from her companions whilst travelling from
Pavis to Alone. Due to her high perception skills she spots a large warband of
trolls (lets say about 40). Her knowledge of local troll customs and politics
leads her to deduce that they are the vanguard of a much larger force probably
on their way to to sack Alone. What is the most honourable thing to do? She
could probably take out quite a few of them (maybe ten probably more with
divine intervention) before dying. Alternatively she could ride for Alone in
order to warn the city (she may have to hide until they pass her).
On the other hand, if the trolls were attacking a farmstead the Sword wouldn't
hesitate to raise her battlecry.
I believe that Humakti stress controlled force - parrying just as much as
attacking. She is not afraid of death but I think the most honourable thing to
do is quite clear ... Humakti are not IMHO suicidal. They do not fear death.
Nor do they wish to join their god before their appointed time.
As I said it is a matter of degree. It is up to the individual to decide the
most honourable course of action. Even Storm Bulls are allowed to run from
chaos if they subsequently return with greater force to face it (from CoP).
Thom
_/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ Human Cognition Research Lab
_/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ The Open University
_/_/_/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ Milton Keynes MK7 6AA, U.K.
_/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ Tel: +44 908 65-4518 Fax: -3169
_/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ Internet:T.S.Baguley@open.ac.uk
---------------------
~From: T.S.Baguley@open.ac.uk (Thom Baguley)
~Subject: Poets and Swords
Message-ID: <9305131137.AA06885@Sun.COM>
~Date: 13 May 93 04:31:20 GMT
>I know this is not a modern culture,
>but do we imagine Socrates, Homer, Thomas Aquinas, Shakespear and others
>out practicing their primary weapon skills as a "basic skill"? The martial
>skills should be optional for these professions. Otherwise,
>*ALL* NPC Master musicians will have a primary attack skill of 75% (after
>all, we all have heard of the prowess with pistol or epee of the likes of
>Bach, Beethoven, and Handel).
OK it may be a little extreme, but actually many artists and poets were good
swordsmen. I don't know about Shakespeare, but the theatre was a rough place
... I'm sure he would have know how to crack a few skulls. John Donne, Ben
Jonson (who killed at least two men in fights), Christopher Marlowe (possible
spy), Andrew Marvell (politician, possible spy and skilled fencer) and most of
the other Cavalier and Roundhead poets would have been handy with a sword.
Michealangelo was once in a knife fight. Sir Richard Burton (explorer, writer,
diplomat) was a superb sabreur.
These are just off the top of my head. In a dangerous world like Glorantha
almost everone will pick up a few combat skills.
Thom
_/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/_/_/_/ _/ Human Cognition Research Lab
_/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ The Open University
_/_/_/_/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ Milton Keynes MK7 6AA, U.K.
_/ _/ _/ _/ _/ _/ Tel: +44 908 65-4518 Fax: -3169
_/ _/ _/_/_/_/ _/ _/ _/_/_/_/ Internet:T.S.Baguley@open.ac.uk
---------------------
~From: dickmj@postman.essex.ac.uk
~Subject: Re: HELP!!!!!
Message-ID: <9305131153.AA06449@serdlc10>
~Date: 13 May 93 11:53:30 GMT
Sometimes I just HATE these bloody machines!!!! Over the last week I
reckon that I've lost (missed) about 5 parts of the digest. Doesn't the
machine realise how serious this is? I only come into Uni to check my
e-mail (and to attend the coincidental lecture).
Has anyone else had problems recently with receiving stuff - I know
there are people who aren't because they're replying to submissions
I've made but haven't seen included e.g the 'eggs' spell.
If someone has got the 'full set' from the last week or so, could they
possibly send me them (I don't mind duplicates).
Having said all that, this message probably won't get through either (sigh).
Headbutting the VDU
-Arganth
---------------------
~From: dickmj@postman.essex.ac.uk
~Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Wed, 12 May 1993, part 1
Message-ID: <9305131218.AA07279@serpit1>
~Date: 13 May 93 12:18:20 GMT
> Egghead (Humpty Aspect)
> 3pt. Divine magic
> Touch, Temporal,
>
> This is a resisted spell which when succesfully cast on a person transforms
>their head into an egg. The egg has facial features and hair painted on it
>and the victim can still hear, see etc. Hit points in the head are
>reduced to one for the duration of the spell. One point of damage will
>crack the eggshell, two will break the skin of the white, three will break
>the yolk (=brain) thus killing the person.
A particularly useful spell if used in conjunction with 'sword to
spoon' and 'rock to bread'!! I see a Trickster casting this on a friend
if they were short of food. Has anyone seen 'Alive' yet.....
-Arganth
From runequest Sat May 15 10:28:07 1993
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To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Daily automated RQ-Digest)
Reply-To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RuneQuest Daily)
Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Thu, 13 May 1993, part 3
Precedence: junk
Status: O
This is the automated Daily RuneQuest Digest.
Send submissions only to "RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM", they
will automatically be included in a next issue. Try to change the
~Subject: line from the default Re: RuneQuest Daily... on replying.
Selected articles may also appear in a regular Digest. If you
want to submit articles to the Digest only, contact the editor at
RuneQuest-Digest-Editor@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM.
-Henk Langeveld
--
Send Submissions to:
Enquiries to:
The RuneQuest Daily is a spin-off of the RuneQuest Digest and deals
with the subjects of Avalon Hill's RPG and Greg Stafford's world of
Glorantha. Maintainer: Henk.Langeveld@Sun.COM
---------------------
~From: marks@slough.mit.edu (Mark S. c/o Tom Yates)
~Subject: epistemology
Message-ID: <9305130553.AA07745@Sun.COM>
~Date: 13 May 93 05:57:00 GMT
Non-Linear Scenarios - Mike Dawson
I share your love of non-linear adventures, that's why I
thought Gaumata's vision was the best scenario in Shadows. I run
my campaign in as non-linear a manner as possible, one of my most
important tools is a deck of about 200 random encounters. This
style of play is certainly less focused than that of the
storytellers. My players are currently traveling from Salona to
Oral-Ta, after four sessions they're almost there!
By the by, what did you think of the stuff I sent you?
Loskalm - Nick Brooke
>Yeah, but if it's *Loskalmi* authors who write that Loskalm "has
>produced a fair and integrated society," I assume that they are
I think the heart of our disagreement lies in precisely this
imputation of unreliability to the Gernertela Book. If I was
merely interested in defending Loskalm I'd simply claim that the
author of the Gernertela book had an anti-Loskalmi bias, and that
in truth, Loskalm is an even better place than portrayed. If
one disregards whatever one finds inconvenient in the basic
source material one can argue that Kralorians despise dragons or
that Pavis is located on the Oslir river. This does not seem to
me to be a useful way to speculate about Glorantha.
>The Genertela Book is not self-contradictory, hey? Well, why
>does the Fronela chapter treat it as "obvious" that Junora is a
>part of Loskalm (though separated from it during the Ban), and
>similarly as "obvious" that Karstall and Timms should be free
>from Jonatela (*because* separated from it during the Ban)?
I just don't see the contradictions you find in the
Gernetela Book. At one point the chapter says that the Junora is
the third part of Loskalm, but then it immediately mentions that
the Kingdom of Loskalm does not have political control over the
whole area. The article goes on to specifically state that most
of Junora is NOT subject to the Kingdom of Loskalm. Notably the
places of interest section lumps Loskalm with Jonatela and the
Kingdom of War as those putting pressure on Junora. The section
on page 13 dealing with the Kingdom of the Jonatings includes
both the Counts of Karstal and Timms, yet it doesn't even
directly address their claims to independence. The places of
interest write-up for Timms mentions that Fraltigern CLAIMS that
the isolation of the Ban is proof, put does not comment on the
merit of this argument. I can find no statmentment in the entire
description of Fronela that indicates that ANY of the claims
presented are valid or invalid. You seem to have misread the
book in the FAVOR of Loskalm! :-)
What biases do you attribute to the authors of the other
chapters?
I think that your arguments about the military drawback of
the Hrestoli system are sensible. As I indicated just recently,
I certainly do not believe that Loskalm is invincible. On the
other hand, making judgments about military effectiveness in the
real world is almost impossible, and we obviously have a lot more
data about the real world than we do about Glorantha.
>"Acknowledging shades of grey does not mean that all the world
>is uniformly grey." Hmmm... Do you really believe this?
Ummmm, yes. Must be my New World naivete.
> Just don't bomb anyone I know for a good cause, OK? (This is
>sarcasm, and not a personal attack. Please don't take it as
>one!).
Ok, I'll try. Can I bomb people you don't know?
Argrath's Actions
Nick's accidental explanation was amusing, simple, erudite,
and pretty persuasive. Bill's explanation had never occurred to
me, it was a very clever to see the aftermath as an inversion of
the great compromise.
---------------------
~From: mace@lum.asd.sgi.com (Rob Mace)
~Subject: Humakti and Ducks
Message-ID: <9305130736.AA29608@lum.asd.sgi.com>
~Date: 12 May 93 17:36:59 GMT
Allan Murphy writes:
> I have to disagree with sneaking and hiding to escape overwhelming odds.
> To me, this just isn't a Humakti. IMHO a real Humakti would go with the
> overwhelming odds and try to die in a way that pleased his God, assuming
> he was caught in a bad combat situation.
>
> (stuff deleted)
>
> I don't think Humakti are berserks either; but they are supposed to be
> the very incarnation of death, honour and courage. Running from opponents
> is not on the agenda, IMHO.
I have to disagree with this. When Gorbic(my Humakti hero) was in hell on
his first Hero Quest and saw the Black Bat(It was black before it became
red) he ran and hid in some tunnels. Later after he had left Vivamort's
Castle and slayed the Cacodemon that blocked the path he came across an
following. When Krarsht or at least a large part of her started up that
tunnel while he was skirting its edge he ran. And he feels no shame in
admitting these facts.
You are right when you said that:
> Humakti are not afraid of death ( they are death ! )
But they do understand the concept of retreating. They generally know that
there is nothing to be gained by dying in a hopeless situation(Unless they
are serving some sort of purpose, such as in a delaying tactic). If you
think that what is gained is the death of the Humakti you are wrong. The
death of the Humakti is already guaranteed. Someday he will die. Humakt
is the god of death, not the god of death now. He cares not when someone
dies, just that eventually they will die. Of couse he also care that once
dead they stay that way and do not cheat death.
Also I don't think that Humakt would be a major war god if you saddled his
worshipers with an inability to retreat. Given this I think that the cult
would have been wiped out as a significant military power. They are
already restricted enough by the facts that they can not be resurrected and
that they can not ambush.
Brian Hebert writes:
> Hello. I would like to offer the following cult write-up. It is obviously
> unofficial and slightly satirical. It is a Duck cult and reflects my
> views of ducks in Glorantha; as comic/tragic figures. Weak and maligned,
> they generally do their best to stay out of everyone's way. But
> occasionally a core of dignity and greatness gleams through.
> Make of it what you will.
We have always treated ducks in a serious manner in the group I play in.
To those of us living on Earth the appearance of ducks would be comical
but to Gloranthan's it should not. Ducks are a part of their world and
should not appear any funnier then a troll. However they will still be
looked down on and be persecuted because as a general rule they are weak
and ill equipped to defend them selves.
We have generally avoided the easy humor that can be had with ducks such
as the name of Brian's cult "Dha-Naald and Dha-Fhee". However this does
not mean that you can't have some good situational humor with ducks. I
recently ran an all duck adventure in which the goal of the ducks was to
retrieve a war trained triceritops from the Upland Marsh. Normally a
triceritops is ridden by a human sitting behind the fringe and the human
kicks the fringe to steer the triceritops. Well you can probably see the
problem that the ducks had. I even got Ray Turney to roll up and play a
duck in this game and he told me that he had once sworn never to run a
duck.
By the way, Gorbic the Humakti hero I mentioned earlier is a duck.
> The Cult of Dha-Naald and Dha-Fhee
Except for the name I liked this cult writeup a lot. However I don't see
these heros as achieving full cult status. I think that I might use it
as a sort of hero sub-cult of both Humakt and Eurmal open only to ducks.
Kirsten K. Niemann writes:
> Paul Reilly
>
> I wonder if we are the only two RQ fanatic SCA polearmsmen on the
> Digest. We should get together at the War. I'll be in the Atlantian
> Royal Encampment.
Nope, I also am an SCA polearmsmen. Although I have been inactive for
a couple of years. A long time ago I ran a game where the party came
across dwarves using shield wall and pike tactics in tunnels. It was
quite effective.
Rob Mace
---------------------
~From: 100270.337@CompuServe.COM (Nick Brooke)
~Subject: Yaks and Books and Things That Go Bump
Message-ID: <930513082318_100270.337_BHB73-1@CompuServe.COM>
~Date: 13 May 93 08:23:18 GMT
____________________
Dave Pearson / Yaks:
No Yaks in Prax . You need to cross the Great Wastes of Genert to find
the Yak-Men of the Shan Shan Mountains. They're a Hsunchen people. Now,
will someone tell me where I can find a musk-ox in Glorantha? Just
mundane, nothing mystic... I'd go looking for them up towards Tastolar
myself, but have any been sighted in North Pent?
____________________
Mike Dawson / Books:
You mention some "systems that existed before the Dewey Decimal." Well, I
heard from a librarian there that the Bodleian Library at Oxford *still*
sorts its books by size. The only sensible way to do it, when you have a
copy of almost everything in the English Language. Even with computer
assistance, conveyor belts and the like, it still took an unreasonable
amount of time to call up anything. Oh, but the *joy* of being the first
person ever to cut the pages of a book that reached the library seventy-odd
years ago!
Yeah, I guess the real answer to Paul's plea -- "I thought those notes
meant something" -- is that they did: but only to the sage who wrote them!
(That said, the Jonstown and Nochet systems are remarkably coherent -- if
it wasn't for the lovely write-up of "what went wrong" on Tales 4 p.7f, you
might almost assume they worked!).
Expanding from double entry bookkeeping, I have two further points. One is
that it's damned difficult to get the hang of DEB -- I speak from
experience. Making this method a cult secret for a magic-poor cult makes
all kinds of sense. Anyone else trying to learn it will necessarily see
and accept the virtues of Lunar Balance: does this give them a Nysalor
Illumination % willy-nilly?
The other is that, if Etyries has DEB, might not Irrippi Ontor have a
coherent system for Library classification / referencing? Maybe a
Gloranthan version of Dewey? Don't waste my time saying it's
anachronistic: with my understanding of the Lunar Way and the things that
become possible with state-run cults and loads of mobility through the
Empire, this seems plausible to me. Again, Lankhor Mhy sages aren't going
to chuck aside their tradition of independent research to jump on a Lunar
bandwagon.
Both DEB and DD would be innovative secrets that, in Mike's phrase, "don't
run the whole world -- YET!" Like the Lunar Empire itself, really.
_________________
Greg Fried / Lodril:
I can't resist giving you the full Freudian works, so:
The fiery male Sky Spear is flying above the fertile female Earth, when he
looks down and sees a squidgy, hairy thing known as the Mother Mouth. So
he plunges to earth to battle with her, but finds he is only able to defeat
her when thrusts deep into a tunnel and explodes, mingling his essence with
hers. After that he feels very lazy, and lies around in the Earth Womb for
a while -- this is when his children Caladra and Aurelion are born. But
whenever he gets excited, a huge bulge appears in the earth, then explodes,
foaming with hot lava.
And they call me sick! Yup, Stafford has confessed to this. If you get
the White Wolf cult writeup, pay special attention to the Pelorian "Cult of
the Invisible Underpants" (as we call it round here), a sad bunch of Iron
John types, and the devastatingly macho spell of Lava Spear, which allows
you to brandish your mighty weapon against your foes and rain hot gobbets
of molten stuff upon them. Understandably, it's usually banned by the
nobles -- and a good thing too!
____________________
Paul Reilly / Magic:
I am loving your "Laws of Magic" examples. As I understand it, you are
proposing that this kind of thing happens every time a spell is cast, not
that there should be an extra set of game rules giving bonuses or penalties
for clever ideas. Your Sorcerer-Artist was a particularly interesting
concept.
__________________________
Graeme Lindsell / Loskalm:
Please recognise that I am playing Devil's Advocate here to some extent
(well, someone has to, now the Pope's abolished it: seems he might have had
interesting things to say about that fascist who ran Opus Dei and is now in
line for beatification). That said, I *loved* your comments on Tuesday's
Daily. Made me want to start singing patriotic songs: "Loskalm, Loskalm
Uber Alles!" The point about the Hrestoli system requiring militarism for
social advance had previously passed me by; I shall certainly be using it
in invective, even if I'm not quite sure that it's the whole story (David
Hall says he'd be happy as a peasant and not want to rise above his roots).
Thanks too for your positive feedback on Humakt-as-Westerner. I try only
to say things that are partially plausible. It's good to know other people
think about them, and are sometimes convinced. Balm to the soul of the
struggling author / Gloranthologist.
_________________________
Bill Robertson / Argrath:
What an excellent point -- the re-enactment of the Ritual of the Net
leading to even less involvement by gods in the world of men (or vice
versa). This looks like a True, Big Secret you've come up with here. A
question it raises is, did this happen last time? Were the gods
effectively "trapped in Arachne Solara's Web" at the end of Godtime? Seems
plausible to me... And, once again, did Argrath know it would happen that
way? He's probably met Cragspider at some point in his career, so he could
well be better informed about these matters than the rest of us.
______________________
Adam from Aberystwyth:
This is neat. You suggest say that pre-God Learner sorcery was nothing
like the RQ3 stuff; that the GL's come up with all this manipulation
business, which then creeps back into the Malkioni Churches as an
alternative to the mainstream tradition. Note, though, that belief in the
Invisible God predates the God Learners.
While this is nifty, I'm not altogether sure about it. I'd thought that
the only "pure sorcery" in Glorantha was that of the God Learners, that the
divinely-inspired Wizardry of Seshnela and Loskalm was very different to
the "Scientific Sorcery" of RQ3. Driven by piety, not knowledge.
The original Cult of Arkat (state cult of the Stygian Empire) was shattered
and wiped out by the God Learners. Some members of that cult apparently
still survive on the Hero Plane as "shadow warriors" -- but I've not met
one myself. There are any number of Arkati eschatological traditions in
Safelster; the Troll sorcerers worship Black Arkat (in TG); etc. Part of
the problem in identifying "THE Cult" derives from the "Five Arkats" thing:
which of them was the Real Arkat? (i.e: the write-up at the back of CoT
doesn't look much like a Troll's version).
So: you asked "the Cult of Arkat: is there one?"
My answer would be, "No. Far more than that."
====
NICK
====
"Violent disagreement is the last refuge of the incompetent."
---------------------
~From: joe@tpki.toppoint.de (Joerg Baumgartner)
~Subject: RE's Monay to Wednesday
Message-ID:
~Date: 13 May 93 10:17:18 GMT
Some ideas/reactions
Andrew Bell proposed in the Monday issue that Paul Reilly had his rejected
ideas published by the Tales megacorp as PD RQ-pool.
Nice idea in itself, but I don't know about David Hall's or MOB's time
schedule or financial backup. Anyway, in my opinion: If we want RQ/Glorantha
to be published, we have to write it, and if AH won't publish it, we have
to.
This refers especiallyy to the lamentably disregarded Alternate Earth line.
Vikings was great, but lacked follow-ups (as did Glorantha...). Other
interesting ideas (like Paul Reilly's suggestions about Hanse or Patrick
Waterson's and MOB's Byz Ideas in digest 6.8) never saw the light of print,
either.
What's the copyright situation? Is it possible to publish "generic RQ"-stuff
without brushing AH's lawyers (Do you hear me, Ken?)?
I don't know about the english speaking countries, but here in Germany we
have a RQ-society (plug: holding their convention at pentecost) which tries
to further RQ and plans to publish (German language) homemade RQ-scenarios as
fan-products. If there is no such initiative in the UK or US (or elsewhere),
not meaning the Tales, get going! Layout etc. can be done with standard text
progammes like Word... giving if not ppro-like than at least not ugly
results.
Non-Glorantha
As much as I like to read about Glorantha, I still play my Non-G campaign
and use G-stuff mainly as input for may own world. If there's more of non-G
campaigns out there, could we have a chat here?
Rules
Yeah, get back to hardware. Let's discuss incosistencies to get them out.
Another thing about rules: there's quite a lot of people playing RQ in
translations which differ in some points from AH/GW 3rd edition. Are you
anglosaxons interested in foreign language RQ-players' problems?
Cults
I disliked the Orlanth writeup in RoC. Is this just Praxian? Where has
Orlanth Rex gone? What about priests/acolytes of O adv., or Lords of O. thund.?
I also dislike the great step between initiates and acolytes in general.
Reusable divine magic oughn't be givn freely, but do you really have to
fulfil full priestly requirements to get some? (I noticed that in RQ3 even
most Runelords have little or no access to reusable spells.)
Back to Glorantha:
Humakti
I just read through Janet Morris' Beyond Sanctuary thieves World novel,
featuring storm worshipping mercenaries and warrior-priests folowing some
code of honour similar to that Paul Reilly suggested for Humakti in Ralios.
Some details differ, but the general idea of the honorable merc is shown.
What non-G tsuff do other folk read as inspiration?
Gloranthan Culture levels:
In some ways, I picture G as early bronze age Europe (about 1300 BC, before
the general climate deterioration), other aspects are medieval. MOB's
Esrolian Queen scenario in the Tales was 20th century in technology, and
noone complained. So why not introduce innocent advantages like double entry
book-keeping or differential equations into some societies? Those practical
minden Lunars would try anything, only reason they don't already rule the world
is that they're decadent.
Fronela=US
Why not? For one thing, as far as I'm informed Fronela was the setting for
Greg's first novel (about some Jonat, as told iin 3rd ed Troll Pak). If you
view the US as positive or negative force in politics, depends on your point
of view - same as the Lunar empire is viewed in this forum.
In the upcoming conflict against the kingdom of war I propose a "No winner-
all losers" result - the Fronelans stumbling over their sophistication and
being overrun by bloddy-minded slayers, who in turn won't manage to keep a
hold on the land.
BTW, why give the KoW a theistic background? As far as I remember, GoG tells
us that they tap their peasantry freely. Doesnt sound like divine magic to
me, rather Britini-influenced (maybe some plot to counter non-Brithini
Malkionists?).
'Nuff said.
Joerg
--
Joerg Baumgartner joe@tpki.toppoint.de
2300 Kiel
Free INT - Das RuneQuest-Magazin
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---------------------
~From: burt@ptltd.com (Burton Choinski)
~Subject: RQIV draft notes
Message-ID: <9305122044.AA06427@vino>
~Date: 12 May 93 20:44:56 GMT
My notes on the entire RQ-IV draft. If I could get a more recent version,
if one has been made, that would be great. Might as well grouse now. :)
===============================================================================
>>RQIV PLAYERS BOOK
>>DAMAGE MODIFIER
What is the purpose of the "Average STR + SIZ" column? For creatures?
and shouldn't that be "Average STR and SIZ"?
I'm of the mind that required dice should be reduced. Why 1d4 rather
then 1d3 (i.e. 1d6, 1-2=1, 3-4=2, 5-6=3, or half a d6 roll, round up)?
d2 is equally easy (1-3=1, 4-6=2).
>>FIGURING SKILLS CATEGORY MODIFIER
I think Formulae are easier to work with for new people, but thats a
personal preferance. In case it was missed or lost:
Agility = DEX + STR - SIZ - 10
Knowledge = INT + POW/2 - 15
Stealth = DEX + INT/2 - SIZ/2 - POW/2 - 5
Communication = INT + POW/2 + APP/2 - 20
Magic = INT + POW + DEX/2 - 25
Manipulation = INT + DEX + STR/2 - 25
Perception = INT + POW/2 + CON/2 - 20
>>PREVIOUS EXPERIENCE
I agree with someone who resently posted that we chuck the 1/4 and 1/2
points. I think we can all handle numbers 4x as large, and fractions
just make it look messier. Besides, this could provide some sort of spell
mechanic hook (i.e. 1 point of "Train " spell transfers 1 background
point of skill from the teacher to the student.) All costs described
henceforth are 4x those given in the original draft.
So, 1 Background Point (henceforth 'BP') is worth 25 hours (half a week)
of training.
>>BACKGROUND POINTS AND OVERALL LEVEL OF EXPERIENCE
Overall, pretty good. I think that "Experienced" is a better term to use
then "Average", but I will use "Average" in all my following notes.
Also, I feel that the maximum limit on training be dropped. After all,
you could have a game of players starting at "Average" level, but if they
want to purchase up to Expert level (and they can afford it), let them do
it. So you could have "prodigies" whose training is better then their age
implies.
>>BECOMING AN INITIATE
Altering BP costs by x4...
It costs 4 BP's plus 1 POW to join, or POW BP's. So, Arlia (noted in the
draft as having POW 11) could chuck 4 BP and 1 POW, or 11 BP to become an
initiate.
>>BASIC SKILLS
Looks good, although as someone noted, not all musicians need be master at
arms. I suggest that the basic skills be looked over. Details to follow.
>>BUYING OPTIONAL SKILLS WITHIN ONE'S PROFESSION
I disagree with the limit to training. If you want to pump the points into
it on your own time, why can't you be average overall, but with expert
training in a few skills. This applies to the Basic skills as well.
Perhaps this should cost double to go "above your rating" in those skills,
or limit you to one level higher but at the listed cost. This second way
seems to work good with my group, where if you take two professions, you
can combine the points in skills common to thw two. For example, one
character had a Foot Soldier and Thief. The Foot Soldier gave him "Scan"
to Average. When he got thief at Average, the two average levels combined
to give him "Expert" in scan, even though he was rated as average in
both professions. The ability to specifically purchase up to one level above
is just an extension of this. If Two careers are taken, and skills overlap,
the added points must be enough to reach the next level or they are lost
(optionally, these points may be suplimented from your BP reserve to make
the level).
>>BUYING SKILLS OUTSIDE ONE'S PROFESSION
No prblems here, other then tweaking it to be consistent with my above notes
(limited to one level above overall experience rating)
>>CHARACTERISTIC INCREASES
Keep it simple. The BP's are already an abstraction, why limit increases
to certain professions when one can justify it anyways with creative
description fo your background. Perhaps Joe Farmer was constantly fighting
off evil spirits that drifted in from a nearby swamp while he plowed his
field. Maybe Fred Priest lifted weights.
Increasing STR, CON, DEX or APP costs 16 per point to 1/3 max increase,
32 per point to 2/3 max increase, and 64 per point up to max. POW costs
its current value in BP's for each increase. Thus going from 10 to 12 would
cost 10 (taking to to 11) plus 11 (taking you to 12) or 21 BPs.
>>OPTIONS
The combat options you can buy should be here, or at least, their costs
and basic description should be here...it's quite a pain to have to keep
flipping back and forth.
BP's into mony or goods at 100L each or 1/2 week of training (more detail
on this later).
>>EASY, MEDIUM AND HARD SKILLS
The need to tweak the cost of the background points, and thus the basic
career cost, etc, is for the birds. Easier to just to add 15% to the
skill if easy, and subtract 15% if hard (and subtract 30% if very hard).
If a skill, plus mods, is less then 15%m you can't take it at that level
or training. So, a Footman learning Primary Attack at 75% could choose
Dagger as that primary skill, and get a 90% skill, or some hard weapon and
have a 60%.
>>PROFESSIONS
Overall, very good. Once those tweaky fractions are gone I'll like 'em
even better. :) Some careers do need to be looked at to see what REALLY
is basic and what is optional (i.e. the previously mentioned ninja
pianists. :)
>>Crafters...
I take it in more recent drafts this info is present? Like I said, I would
like a more up to date draft, pretty please? :)
>>BASIC CULTURAL SKILLS
This info should be was up with the other cultural tables, rather then
hanging at the bottom, IMHO.
>>DESIGNING YOUR OWN PROFESSION TEMPLATES:
Nice addition. How many of the exotic careers will be pre-figured for
us (i.e. Elf Plant Tender, Troll Insectherd) or those odd careers given
in the Genertala Player's book?
>>SKILL VERSUS SKILL, replace with:
This is tricky. I'm not sure I like the "resolve with tie" system given
in the draft. Why not simply use the greater distance of success when
both have rolled? Using the example provided:
Example: Arlia tries to sneak past a sentry. She has a 65% Sneak
skill, and the sentry has a 44% Listen skill. Both roll. If Arlia
can achieve a greater level of success than the sentry (i.e., special
where the sentry only succeeds), she can successfully sneak past
him. If the sentry achieves a greater level of success, he spots
her. If both fail, Arlia makes a noise, and freezes, but the sentry
does not notice her. If Arlia fumbled, she would make so much noise
that the sentry would not fail to notice her unless he fumbled as well.
Both roll. Arlia's player rolls a 58, the GM rolls a 37 for the
sentry. Both have achieved a normal level of success.
In this case, the sentry succeeded by 7%, Arlia by 8%. Arlia has
the advantage. Degrees of difference (within 5% -- minimal, within 25%
-- partial, over 25% -- full) should affect how good the success really
is.
>>SKILL EXPERIENCE ROLLS, replace with
I think, to borrow a Torg-ism, that checks should take place at the
end of an 'act', where an adventure may take several 'acts' to complete.
An act can be defined as a single, identifiable adventure sesson.
I also feel the following "freebies" should be given to players:
Language: 2 checks per week if immersed in a language, 1 if it is
very complex. For example, our heros must travel through Ralios
and know nothing of the language. They might be able to hire
scribes and Issiaries to translate for them, but that does get
expensive. As they travel, they will slowly pick up the language.
Long-term travel: Riding, marching, boating, etc. 1 check per week.
Survival: If you need to live off the land, 1 check per week.
>>INCREASING SKILLS BY EXPERIENCE, replace with:
I think very hard skills should increase by 1d3-1%, or 1%.
>>SKILL TRAINING AND RESEARCH, replace most of with:
Keep track of hours used during the week for skill training? aaiieeeee!
(Visions of "You used 18 of your 50 hours, 32 left")
Simpler to just say that every "degree" of skill (every 25% or fraction)
requires half a week. So, Joe Adventurer plops his butt down in a town to
do a bit of training. He would like to work on his Sword skill (62%) and his
Sneak skill (20%). He will need 4 half weeks (62% = 3 degrees, 20% = 1
degree) or two weeks of training.
If this is too gross a number system, use tenth-skills and 5 "training
points" per week. (i.e. skill/10, hours/10, round up). So the above
training would take 6.2 (7) and 2.0 (2) training points, just under two
weeks.
>>HUMANOID HIT POINTS PER LOCATION TABLE, replace with:
Personally, I think this table should be up at the front with the others
(Dex SR, Damage bonus, etc).
>>RESULTS OF DAMAGE, replace with:
And this section should be within the combat section. IMHO, of course.
At this point I would lke to suggest that all this info, such as damage
results, and the like, be avaiable as a seperate pack of charts that
can be removed and layed out seperately, rather then needing to constantly
flip through the rules book.
>>FATIGUE, replace with:
I find fatigue to be such a pain to use, that I don't. I think this
entire section should be grey-shaded as optional. This system is better
then the old one, however.
>>Exposure, Hunger, Sleeplessness, Thirst, and Other Slow Deaths
This stuff is good, but I think it belongs in the "world" section along
with fire damage, cold damage, exposier, asphixiation (sp?)
>>CONSEQUENCES OF ENCUMBRANCE FOR DODGING, replace with:
>>Consequences of Encumbrance
I think this needs to be reworked. At present, Joe Strong (SIZ 13,
STR 18) is equally affected by full plate as Fred Weak (SIZ 13, STR 3)
with regards to skill loss.
>>COMBAT, replace most of with:
>>THE MELEE ROUND
Looking over old books, I liked the strike rank system used in
_RingWorld_, where there was a table of 100 phases and there were no
real set rounds, just SR times setting your next action farther up the list
then wrapping back to 0. I have not used this in RQ...I may try it with
my next game and see how it feels.
>>Special Hits
>>Critical Hits
The damages done seem so odd, since they are all so different. This
should be on the pullout tables as well.
>>SPECIAL OPTIONS
Like I said, the basic description and costs should be up with background
generation, with the detailed effects here.
>>Acquiring Special Options
This info should be in the training/experience section, not in the middle
of the combat rules.
>>SKILLS, replace and add to as appropriate:
Some note of how bases will vary by race (i.e. Ducks and Swimming)
should be made.
One comment, can we dispense with the seperate skills for Fist, Kick,
Head butt, etc? Perhaps wrap it into Brawling Attack and Brawling Defense
with a higher overall skill difficulty? I somehow cannot concieve of a
person with 105% Head Butt, but only 25% fist and 15% kick.
Likewise, Wrestling attack (allows grapple, hold, throw) and Wrestling
defense (escapes, breakfall against throws, etc).
MARTIAL ARTS suggestion:
How about this simple change: Martial arts skill adds to basic attack
skill. So a guy with Fist 57% and Martial Arts skill of 34% attacks as
if he had a Fist skill of 91%. Nice and simple, but beware those
Runelord Ninja Masters with MA 500% and Kick 500% :) You're gonna die. :)
I think this provides for the "danger" that the original rules intended
and is simple enough for use. It's difficulty should be bumped to "Very
Hard".
>>SKILL SUCCESS AND FAILURE
"Missing a skill roll by 10% or less is not a serious failure,
missing a skill roll by more than 10% is a more serious failure,"
10% real? or 10% of the actual skill? If I have a skill of 56%, is a
serious failure rolling in the 57-66 range, or 57-62 (10% of 56, rounded
to 6%)
>>COMPLEMENTARY SKILLS
I like this. Makes Bargain and Evaluate less generic.
>>SKILL DECAY
This is such a bother, I don't even use it. Anyone else?
===============================================================================
RQIV MAGIC BOOK
>>PERCEPTION SKILLS
"A shamans mundane perception skills (Scan, Search, Track, Taste, and so
on) are halved when not dealing with spirits."
Why? They don't become shamans until they are in their teens...what,
their eyes glaze over or something? :)
>>DIVINE MAGIC
>>SPELL LIMITS, add to first paragraph:
I like the idea that High Initiates can reuse reusable spells of 1pt,
Acolytes can reuse reusble spells of 2pts or less. (This was suggested on
the list some time ago)
===============================================================================
GAMEMASTER BOOK
>>PRICES, replace most of with the following:
I like, but want more. :) Look at Harn. Granted, that goes a little too
far, but on the line of Powers & Perils, with the costs for glass or skin
containers, other materials, etc.
-- Burton
---------------------
~From: henkl@glorantha (Henk Langeveld - Sun Nederland)
~Subject: Message from Joe Dugan: Looking for RQ in the Phil. area
Message-ID: <9305122211.AA27650@glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM>
~Date: 13 May 93 02:11:34 GMT
Forwarded message:
> From duganw@alleg.edu Wed May 12 19:44:50 1993
> Message-Id: <9305121741.AA02037@alleg.edu>
> Date: Wed, 12 May 93 13:41:16 EDT
> From: duganw@alleg.edu
> To: Henk.Langeveld@Sun.COM
>
>
> Hello there!
>
> My name is Joe Dugan and I'm one of the RQ digest
> subscribers.... On Monday, May 17, I shall be moving to
> Philadelphia,Pa. So, don't bother seeding me the digest until I have
> a new address : ).
>
> Also, if you have any info on a RQ group in the Phila. area,
> Or could point me in the right direction PLEASE respond. I'm kinda
> new at the system... and I'd like to play : ).
>
> Thank you for spending your time : )
> - Joe
>
---------------------
~From: dgempey@cats.UCSC.EDU (David Empey)
~Subject: Gifts & Geases/Geasa
Message-ID: <9305130114.AA13742@si.ucsc.edu>
~Date: 12 May 93 11:14:49 GMT
Somebody (Paul Reilley?) was complaining that the 'correct' plural
of geas is geasa, pronounced 'gaysha'. Maybe in Irish (do I mean Gaelic?)
this is true but we speak English. The English plural of geas is
geases. (Pronounced 'geesuz' on MY block!)
Also, I seem to have missed the RQ Daily/Digest with the criticism of
Loskalm. (By Nick Brooke?) Was this the one for May 8? I didn't get
one for that date. Could Henk or somebody send me the May 8 RQ Daily,
please?
-Dave
---------------------
~From: timp@extro.ucc.su.OZ.AU (Tim Posney)
~Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Wed, 12 May 1993, part 1
Message-ID: <199305130242.AA05648@extra.ucc.su.OZ.AU>
~Date: 13 May 93 22:42:54 GMT
Could some kind soul please let me know what the correct mechanism for
making comments on the RQIV rules is. Should I just post to the digest
or does oliver want them direct. Has he got far to many comments to be
interested in many more?
regards tim
---------------------
~From: carlf@Panix.Com (Carl Fink)
~Subject: RQ IV comments
Message-ID: <199305130331.AA09876@sun.Panix.Com>
~Date: 12 May 93 19:31:32 GMT
resmith@ccwf.cc.utexas.edu (Robert Smith) writes:
.
.
.
J>I've been reading through RQIV in preparation for our next campaign (I
>run Tekumel with RQ rules). We want to use RQIV modifications where they
>make sense. So I have taken a pretty close look at some of the stuff.
J>Previous Experience
>Well, this is better than RQIII, but not by much.
>1) Why are we messing around with 1/4 and 1/2 points here. Just multiply
>everything by 4 so that 1 is the minimum cost for anything.
Thank you. I said exactly this when the rule was first proposed, and
never got a good answer. Are you listening, fellow Gangsters?
.
.
.
>New fatigue rules look pretty good.
>1) Finally, fatigue affects movement! But why only when exhausted? This
>means that if I run 3 or 4 times around the block and get tired (or
>weary if I'm out of shape), then a fresh runner joins me and we run at
>the same rate, even though he is not even tired. True, we may jog at
>the same rate, but I bet he could now out sprint me. This is not
>relfected in the rules. I think a bit more incrementalism would be in
>order. I would suggest that instead of dropping to 1/2 move at
>Exhaustion, one should drop to 2/3 rate when Weary and then to 1/3 rate
>when Exhausted. This would also be easier to calculate, since most
>creatures have a movement rate of 3m.
Because it's simpler. The rules are already way too complex for
some tastes. If you want more complexity, add it in your game.
Some of this would be handled by GM judgement.
.
.
.
J>2) Melee
>Over all OK, but not a spectaular breakthrough. I do like the special
>options (what are the difficulty levels of these skills? It is implied
>in their costs and training time but not stated explicitly.).
They aren't skills. Okay, they're "skills" in English, but they
aren't treated as RQ "skills". You can either Glancing Parry or
not - there's no percentage associated with it.
J>However, like all systems that I'm familiar with, there is too much
>attack, parry, attack, parry, attack, parry, etc. This may simulate a
>practice session, fencing, or a SCA battle (all of which are highly
>formalized simulations of combat), but I doubt that life and death
>stuggles look like this. Where is the kicking, scratching, hitting
>with shields and weapon butts, etc.? The combat system lacks feeling and
>excitement. I guess I want my combats to look like the Michael York
>"Three Musketeers" rather than the Gene Kelly version.
Talk to the GM. This stuff is not in the rules - it's the responsibility
of the person playing the character, and of the GM.
.
.
.
J>4)Armor and Use of Missile Weapons
>OK, back on my hobby horse.
>If one looks at the historical use of armor by archers and other missile
>users, I believe that one will find their arms rather lightly armored.
>Thrown weapons and bows require a lot of fine arm movements with rotation
>in many directions for loading and firing and throwing. Such soldiers
>tended not to use extensive arm protection. I would, therefore, suggest
>a simple rule: characters that have soft armor on their preferred arm
>suffer a -10% off the attack skill of bows and throwing. Those wearing
>hard armor would suffer a -20%. This would not affect the use of guns
>or crossbows.
This and your leg armor comments make perfect sense...but again, we
have to weigh that against complexity. The system is, I say again,
already too complex.
BTW, role playing is another thing to think about - my characters
rarely wear their armor unless expecting a fight, simply because it's
*very unpleasant* to wear heavy armor all the time. No rule is needed
for that.
--
Carl Fink carlf@panix.com C.FINK4 (GEnie)
"If you can't laugh at yourself, then you can bet that everyone else is doing
so." - Ed Johnston