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From: RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RQ Digest Maintainer)
To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Daily automated RQ-Digest)
Reply-To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RuneQuest Daily)
Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Sat, 22 May 1993, part 3
Precedence: junk
Status: OR

The RuneQuest Daily and RuneQuest Digest deal with the subjects of
Avalon Hill's RPG and Greg Stafford's world of Glorantha.

Send submissions and followup to "RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM",
they will automatically be included in a next issue.  Try to change the
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Selected articles may also appear in a regular Digest.  If you 
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Send enquiries and Subscription Requests to the editor:

RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Henk Langeveld)


From: (Graeme Lindsell)
Subject: The west, Humakt plus Jar-Eel
Message-ID: <>
Date: 22 May 93 10:21:27 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 848

>From: 100270.337@CompuServe.COM (Nick Brooke)
>Graeme said:
>> Actually the Westerners see an impersonal, "scientific" universe,
>> don't they? I'd say they'd prefer Death seen as an object rather
>broader view would expand to "Man is the measure of all things" vel sim.  
>The Western cultures are all human-supremacist; the Brithini Pentagram is 
>the "pure" form of the Man rune; etc.  So I'm not sure that Westerners do 
>see the universe as quite so "impersonal."  And as noted before, we *know* 
>that the Orlanthi (used to?) think Humakt is a Sword.

 I agree they are human-supremacists, but there are several quotes 
about impersonal forces: in the Genertela Pack's Players Book for
one "The world is an array of impersonal forces of which sorcery is
the best form of contact with the Invisible God" (P19). From memory
the "What the Wizard Says" section from GoG says something similar.
(I didn't bring that into work with me. I hope my boss doesn't come

 Actually, I find much of what is written about Western culture
is contradictory. For example, in page 20 of the Players book it

 "Malkion's big revelation what that of Solace which...provided
the message that followers of the Invisible God could attain a 
perfect life after physical death"

 in the Genertela Book, P82 it says:

 "Brithini religion denies life after death." and "The Invisible God
is universally acknowledged as Creator" The ruling Talar of Arolanit
is a relative of "Malkion the Prophet" which implies that they do
acknowledge Malkion's teachings.

>This looks plausible.  I think Arkat was weaker than you imagine when 
>Harmast rescued him from Hell; accusing him of stealing a sword he already 
>possessed is also a bit off.  But the idea that Arkat fostered a barbarian 

 Yes, the bit about him already having "God-Cleaver" is a bit of a 
bummer, but my arguement was that Arkat had stolen the Sword sometime
earlier, and only after he had been rescued did he want to return the death

>single Orlanthi subcult of the "Fifth Magic Weapon" is neat.  He certainly 
>was a clever bugger (not like that incompetent Argrath...).  Agreed, using 

 He really is my favourite Staffordian hero: much more human than Harrek
the Thug and Jar-Eel "Let's kill the Pharoah in His Bath" the Murderess
(more about her below!)

>> ...I don't really like limiting initiates to once a year...
>Y'know, I was worried people would think I was giving out *too much* Rune 
>magic!  By the way, your proposed (tried and tested?) system for regaining

 -untried and untested, I'm afraid: I'm playing right now, not GMing. This
is the  problem with most of my bright ideas

>Rune magic involves rolling lots of dice.  No good rules system should 
>involve rolling lots of dice (though fear of rolling *any* is also a Bad 
>Thing: "+3.5%" skill gain merchants please note). This is tacit agreement 
>with your criticism of post-adventure experience rolls, I suppose.  Look at 
>Pendragon, again, for good ideas on how to streamline these things...

 Pendragon uses experience rolls as well, doesn't it? The reason I had rolls
in my system was to use character's skills, rather than having it automatic,
which I rather dislike. An interesting side note: there is a skill called
Cult Lore, buts it's only mentioned on the last page of GoG's Cults Book
as a new skill (universal). I can't find a description anywhere.

 But to return to Rune Spells for initiates, I agree that my system would
take a lot of rolling. I will probably just let initiates get a single 
1 point cult spell reusuably: probably the one taught in shrines. The 
problem is that some cult's teach much better spells there than others
ie Humakt teaches Truesword, Orlanth Cloud call.

>Graeme, I've got some bad news: there are nasty people out there in the 
>real world who have been extremely rude about:
>        i)      The Chivalric Ideal;
>        ii)     The Islamic Jihad;
>        iii)    The Communist Internationale.

 And I'm one of those nasty people!

>These are the three examples you propose for a Loskalmi society that is 
>above reproach?  I'm just stirring some nasty stuff into the "pure and 
>clean" Loskalm we're all taught about from the rules-books; seeing what 

 I'm not proposing that these are ideal cultures, just that they are
cultures that, while internally nice and clean, tend to be fairly
messy when they run into people that disagree with them.

 When I first read the write-up of Loskalm, I thought "This lot are
going to do a lot of damage" and I still do. I think they are a 
frightening bunch of fanatics. What makes them more frightening is
that their idealistic system is working! Imagine how the US would
feel if the USSR hadn't failed so miserably, if their system had
been more efficient, more productive, had had more opportunities. I 
think that is how the Rokari are thinking right now. Have you
evr read the Culture series by Ian M Banks (SF not Fantasy)? The
Culture is internally a paradise but really does cause a lot of 
trouble in other societies, "for their own good".

 In the "What My Father Told Me" for the Seshnelan culture, the 
father says that the Hrestoli are new enemies. Is this just
religious/political, or was there an actual war? If there
was it must have been a naval battle, since there are a lot of
elves and Brithini between Loskalm and Seshnela

 About Jar-Eel: it says in the Genertela book that she was the product
of planned breeding. When I was reading the write-up of Hon-Eel's
wane in Heroes No6 last night, I realised what this meant. Hon-Eel is
a daughter of the Red Emperor, and most of the Lunar heroes are also
directly related to the Red Goddess (the exceptions are the Seven 
Mothers and Etyries). The Eel-Arish planners must have reasoned as
follows: "Heroic stature in the Lunar Emprie derives from blood 
relationship to the Red Goddess. We have people in our clan, and
those which we often marry, that are descendents of the Goddess,
mainly through the Red Emperor, but also through Hon-Eel, the Great
Sister, Hwarin Dalthippa, and others. We should interbreed these
clan members until we have an individual who is basically the
Red Goddess. We may have a lot of culls." 

 Points to note: i) Jar-Eel is quite inbred.
                 ii) The culls must be really pissed-off!

 What do you think?

Graeme Lindsell                      Email:
Research School of Chemistry         Phone: (06) 249 3575
Australian National University       Fax:   (06) 249 0750


From: (johnjmedway)
Subject: magic & other stough
Message-ID: <>
Date: 22 May 93 11:23:01 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 849

>>  From: dustin@ocf.Berkeley.EDU (Dustin Tranberg)
>>  Subject: POW checks
>>  Date: 19 May 93 08:02:21 GMT
>>  Since you can't exercise to increase POW like you can STR or CON, this
>>  can be presented as a metaphor for POW gains.  "Just as striving with
>>  a foe in combat makes you a stronger fighter, striving with a foe in
>>  magical combat makes you a stronger magician."

I disagee with this description of POW. I've always played/seen/heard of
POW as a beings tie with the world, with his or her or it's importance
as a living part of glorantha. I've not thought of it as a mental arm-
wrestling strength rating, except as an aside.

The idea of gaining POW for actions furthering your cult, your people, etc.,
makes much more sense to me then the POW gain rules as they presently stand.

>>  Subject: Some responses
>>  Date: 19 May 93 19:20:25 GMT

>>  Power gain rolls: I'm not at all fond of them either. What would you 
>>  think of a modification of the Pendragon system - handing out a 
>>  certain amount of POW gain on a periodic basis based on the characters
>>  level of magical activity? Something along the lines of a moderately

I'd rather it be based on _spiritual_ activity , see comments above re: POW.

Same for regaining Rune spells.

>>  From: 100270.337@CompuServe.COM (Nick Brooke)
>>  Subject: Lunar Cults & Founders
>>  Date: 19 May 93 18:43:44 GMT
>>  Och, this looks like the right place for a *really nasty* theory that was 
>>  doing the rounds here a year or two ago:
>>  The Seven Mothers are often compared to the Lightbringers: they undertake a 
>>  quest to rescue a dead deity languishing in Hell, who when returned to the 
>>  ...
>>  that brought back the Red Goddess  intending *cynically* to fail in the 
>>  exercise of their cultic virtues?  They deliberately betrayed their ideals 
>>  in order to pass through the various challenges of the test.  That would 

Is is cynicism or is it illumination that is the motive?

>>  From:
>>  Date: 19 May 93 16:49:44 GMT

>>  Lunar Cults:
>>  ------------
>>  I completely agree with the idea that *anything* on the 7 Mothers cults
>>  and other Lunar cults would be the single most useful thing I could have

When's LunarPak? Is there a LunarPak?

Actually, that brings up a question, if Ken or others can or will answer:
What is in the pipeline currently? What is not, and what would you like?

Ken? anybody?

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----     -     -     ---512/292-2325------------     -     -     -     ----


From: (Tom Zunder)
Subject: Pun
Date: 22 May 93 12:50:58 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 850

Have you heard of the broo who achieved purging his chaos taint and
achieving the Harmony Rune?

He's called the Wild Rocker of the Eelwoods...

{Thanks to Rich Crawley}

                                                   How Illuminating!


From: 100116.2616@CompuServe.COM (David Hall)
Subject: Tales #10 is going to be late.
Message-ID: <930522141738_100116.2616_BHB37-1@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 22 May 93 14:17:39 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 851

Steve Thomas' hard disc failed this morning which means we have probably 
lost both issue #10 and The Collected Griselda. It's possible he may be 
able to retrieve some data, but the zine will be delayed for three to six 
weeks, or more. 

This shouldn't delay issue #11 as it is being worked on by Michael O'Brien 
in Australia. However, it is likely to delay us starting work on Wyrms 

In the meantime I have available copies of a reprinted issue #5. These cost 
L2.25 in the UK, and L2.50 in Europe. Both prices include postage. Contact 
David Gadbois about copies in the USA & Canada.

I left Steve sobbing uncontrollably on the telephone. I can only apologise 
profusely for the further delay. Please pass on the news to other 
subscribers, and shops that stock  the zine.