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Date: Tue, 22 Jun 93 17:15:24 +0200
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From: RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RQ Digest Maintainer)
To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Daily automated RQ-Digest)
Reply-To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RuneQuest Daily)
Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Tue, 22 Jun 1993, part 1
Precedence: junk
Status: OR
The RuneQuest Daily and RuneQuest Digest deal with the subjects of
Avalon Hill's RPG and Greg Stafford's world of Glorantha.
Send submissions and followup to "RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM",
they will automatically be included in a next issue. Try to change the
Subject: line from the default Re: RuneQuest Daily... on replying.
Selected articles may also appear in a regular Digest. If you
want to submit articles to the Digest only, contact the editor at
RuneQuest-Digest-Editor@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM.
Send enquiries and Subscription Requests to the editor:
RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Henk Langeveld)
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From: T.S.Baguley@open.ac.uk (Thom Baguley)
Subject: Sorcerers and Extension
Message-ID: <9306211716.AA20259@Sun.COM>
Date: 21 Jun 93 18:37:08 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1135
UNALIGNED SORCERERS
I agree with those who have argued that unaligned probably means agnostic (in
the sense of no specific sect/cult) rather than atheistic. Atheistic sorcerers
are going to have a very hard time of it in Glorantha ...
CHAOTIC SORCERERS
These are going to be very rare. Chaotic sorcerers are almost certainly of this
kind, they are probably sorcerers who have acquired a chaos taint or made a
pact with a (chaotic) demon (or more likely both) given the lawful nature of
sorcery and the difficulty of learning it. (But don't forget Bagog sorcerers
who get to learn it the easy way). I would argue that they would almost all be
insane too. But that only makes NPC chaos sorcerers more fun ...
ATHEISTIC SORCERERS
Also rare, for obvious reasons. Only one gloranthan culture would actually not
mind the presence of atheistic sorcerers ... the Lunar Empire. So why aren't
they common in the empire? The simple answer is that no Lunar official would
let a potential threat like an atheistic sorcerer grow powerful enough to
damage the empire or their own chances of promotion. Sorcerers will find it
hard to learn sorcery, even harder to progress in lunar cults (would you let
someone that powerful and intelligent into your cult, given that they will
probobably end up taking your job?). Sorcerers that do get powerful enough will
be receive a visit from lunar official, demon or hero(ine). They won't be
killed, but they may well find themselves drafted into the Lunar College of
Magic as a field magician (junior class). Spending a few minutes/days/weeks in
a personal and literal hell should ensure most people's loyalties.
I don't think there should be any specific rules to stop atheistic sorcerers. I
think even a smattering of Gloranthan lore should reveal that being an
atheistic sorcerer is difficult. If a pc wants to try it, good luck to them. If
they aren't powerful they should manage ok. If they are I don't think they'll
survive long (except possibly proving their loyalty to a very powerful
protector (i.e. the Empire) and even then it will be difficult).
EXTENSION
A change of subject. If any one is worried at extension 28's floating around a
couple of easy fixes are possible.
Firstly, I don't know the exact rules on this, but I would play that Shield 4
with extension 16 is dismissed or dispelled as 4 points of divine magic not
twenty points. This would make people think twice about using up large ammounts
of extension.
Secondly, divine magic should be subject to certain restrictions. I would argue
that all (not permanent) active divine magic is dispelled at the start of the
sacred time or on the morning of the high holy day or your cult (or the cult
that the spell was traded from). If you want to be really strict it would be
dispelled on the seasonal holy day of the cult. This shouldn't hurt players
unless they aren't at their worship service.
Both seem reasonable rules to me and within the spirit of the game.
Thom
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From: awr0@aberystwyth.ac.uk
Subject: Talking about stupid Copyrights
Message-ID: <9306211721.AA08206@deca>
Date: 21 Jun 93 19:21:36 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1136
To the person who brought up the fact that using Chaosium printed material
in a PD document I am about to distribute across the net.
The problem is, it may be copyright, but it isn't available and if
Chaosium or AH are quite prepared to re-print the material then I am quite
prepared not to include material which is copyrighted to Chaosium. Otherwise
they can sod off and attempt to sue me. I am doing what I am doing for the
good of glorantha and RQ so I don't feel I should be restricted by the
possibility of infringing out of date products or articles.
The actual amount of material I have together is around 644k so far.
There pobably is around 200k that I am still hoping for. I am desperately
looking for the Pamaltelan Elf comms system.
The bloke who mentioned I should get internet....already have, but you may
not have noticed, but not everything is available through ftp. People have
a lot of stuff that is not available through soda.berkerley.edu etc.
Anybody have any more stuff availble...hopefully the final file should not
be more than 2 meg of postscript. Henk can this fileserver handle such a size?
If not, I'll be placing it upon an ftp site and will also attempt to split
it into managable parts and send it out to individual people. Please don't
contact me yet....it ain't finished yet.
Adam
PS: Thank you for all your help in this mammoth task. There was one problem,
some material I have does not contain the author, so some of you may have
contributed, but won't be acknowledged. Sorry :-)
---------------------
From: stites@eece.ksu.edu (Ross Stites)
Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Sat, 19 Jun 1993, part 1
Message-ID:
Date: 21 Jun 93 09:18:34 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1137
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From: flammang@heart.med.uth.tmc.edu (James Flammang)
Subject: King of Sartar?
Message-ID: <9306212041.AA01717@heart.med.uth.tmc.edu>
Date: 21 Jun 93 20:41:11 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1138
Hi all,
I hate to bother everybody with a dumb question, but I hate not
knowing the answer even more, so here goes: What is King of Sartar and who
publishes it? I was disconnected from the Glorantha world for awhile, so when
I got on this digest I learned about a whole host of new products out there,
most of which I've since tracked down (By the way, Mike, I *loved* Sun
County), but K0S remains a mystery to me. Is this the novel that Greg Stafford
once told me he was writing? I haven't seen it at game stores or book stores,
but if I knew the publisher, I could probably get it ordered. So if some of
you Gloranthapedias could help me, I'd be much obliged.
Thanks,
Jim Flammang
flammang@heart.med.uth.tmc.edu
---------------------
From: RICK@qucdnee.ee.queensu.ca (Rick Pim)
Subject: game mechanics for summoning under rq3
Message-ID: <01GZN6S3QNFK95MLP6@qucdnee.ee.QueensU.CA>
Date: 21 Jun 93 19:45:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1139
i have a mechanics question that will, no doubt, demonstrate my lack
of understanding/incomplete reading of the rules. it concerns
summoning spirits under RQ3.
suppose you're a spirit magician and you want to summon a spirit; the
purpose for this might be to bind it into an enchantment. you cast
your Summon (species) spell and the spirit arrives. now: how do you
get it into the enchantment? well, you have to cast the appropriate
control spell. but the control spell needs to be cast after reducing
the spirit to zero magic points. this requires spirit combat.
there are three things i can see happening here:
- you hope the spirit, once it "recovers its senses" is mad enough
to attack you.
- a side effect of the Summon spell enables the caster to initiate
spirit combat
- you can't
- ??? something i'm missing
the first option isn't completely satisfying; it's kind of fuzzy and
also precludes binding those spirits that can't initiate spirit
combat. (this gets somewhat more confusing re spell spirits; see
below.) it also wastes that nice safe time that the spirit is stunned.
:-)
the third one is somehow unsatisfying too. a student of sorcery with
only Intensity can handle it; i would have hoped that a spirit
magician could do it as well. if the spirit magician needs to be a
shaman, then this is (a) asymmetrical, and (b) a bit odd - your
average shaman might well choose to discorporate and find the spirit
he wants directly, rather than mucking about with Summon.
the second alternative doesn't _seem_ to fit in completely with the RQ3
spirit combat rules, but there's always the odds that i'm missing
something obvious.
footnote from above re creatures that can't initiate spirit combat:
RQ3 suggests (i forget the wording) that to teach a spell, a shaman
sends a spell spirit to attack the student. fine. the RQ3 creatures
book, however, states (unless i misremember) that spell spirits can't
initiate spirit combat. this seems to be a contradiction. and, if
you're relying on the spirit starting the combat, then you can't learn
spirit spells with the Summon ritual. (admittedly this is kind of
unusual, but i can think of one situation where it might be attempted:
a spirit magician with a focus for, say, Heal and who knows Heal I may
want to learn Heal II.)
so: what am i missing?
rp
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
Rick Pim bitnet:rick@qucdnee
Department of Electrical Engineering rick@qucdnee.ee.queensu.ca
Queen's University, Kingston (613) 545-6772
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=
"Like all reputable surgeons, I charge by the pound..."
---------------------
From: nrobinso@sirius.UVic.CA (Neil Robinson)
Subject: Humakt Sense Assassin and Other Topics
Message-ID: <51079.nrobinso@sirius.uvic.ca>
Date: 21 Jun 93 22:11:16 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1140
Hi, here's some stuff my GM/referee wanted to post. He tends to get
the digest on a weekly basis when he comes down to Victoria. I'll
prefix put my comments about his stuff with two asterisks. (**)
** Beginning of Rich's Stuff
Hello to everyone on the net and kudos to those who take the time to make
this game better for those of us who need the help. Thanks to Neil
Robinson who provides me with access to all the articles and keeps my views
somewhere near reasonable (at many times).
I'm an old RQ2 player and a new RQ2.? ref, and many of the articles and
discussions on sorcery have been very enlightening (NEVER *illuminating*).
I want to state that I do use POW rolls occassionally, I never give give
lay members/acolytes re-useable rune magic (why become rune level and give
up all the time and money?), the old SR system isn't perfect but is the
best I've seen (I'm no expert), keep all this stuff coming, and a great
thanks to Henk for making this possible.
** We don't get reusable rune magic because HIS Humakt NPC is now a Rune
** Lord, while all we players with MERE initiates must suffer with one-use.
** Is TRANSLATE renewed on a yearly basis too much for my devoted
** L.M. Initiate, Erril the Pious? :-)
Random thoughts on various articles:
Nick Brooke - Birth of Aether / Stats
Basically this makes sense, but:
Moon=nothing (not int)
I don't totally agree. You suggest that when the White Moon is healed it
will have a stat. I think it does, but we don't usually use it. SANITY
should be the stat associated with this as the moon clearly is to blame
for *crazy behavior*. Also consider these Lunar Rune Spells: Mind Blast
and Madness. Insanity being the opposite behavior to reason... moon
versus sun.... I think it works.
The White Moon would then represent a state of regained mental
health/balance for those affected by the moon.
I would also associate this with chaos (as an explanation for its negative
affects on people). Unlike the other stats, this one has an inverse
relationship to its stat, the stronger the effect of the moon, the greater
the instability or insanity (like Dorastor?)
It don't know about equating obesity with health (CON), at least on a
gut level. (Troll joke?) I would hardly call trolls lazy... though
fat slobs may apply by human definitions....
I liked the rest (including INT).
Do you have Wyrm's Footnotes 1-4? If so, what's in them?
(if an index isn't too much trouble....)
(?)Greg Fried (?) - Uralog, the Mouth of the Deep. (Not sure of author).
On just a cursory glance this looks very good, however, I am not aware of
an undead rune. Maybe you meant HUNGER, like Vivamort and Krarsht
(it would definately fit). For whoever the author is, encore and more.
Paul Reilly - Adam Reynolds - Malcolm Cohen SORCERY
I hated the RQ3 sorcery so much that I refuse to play/use it. However,
upon reading your articles I am going to discuss sorcery with the players
and use your articles as the centerpieces. With so many cultures in
Glorantha multiple sorcery systems make sense to me.
I am interested in any further thoughts you have on the subject.
** We're going to try a version that doesn't use free INT, and
** restricts manipulation to a total of Skill/10. One of the biggest
** limitations should be a lack of spells, and research possibilities.
(?) - How Storm Bull Cultists have been deceived by Orlanth...
Bad Worship and How it corrupts the Gods...
I loved these, it is a perfect example of how someone can start on a
logical arguement and by subtle twists can make something say anything
hey want. I'm almost tempted to treat listening to this and following
it count towards illumination. Comments?
HUMAKT'S SENSE ASSASSIN
Someone once asked about the *manifestation* of this skill. Sense chaos
puts the user in pain in the area of an old wound inflicted by a creature
of chaos (or chaos tainted). One could do the same thing for Humakt but
this gets stale quickly.
The sense is twofold. Generally, this skill starts out as a creeping
feeling of paranoia, "someone is out to get me" would be the description.
If the PC fumbles he/she ends up sitting in some corner watching everyone,
ready to fight. The challenge is for the Humakti to remain true to their
faith (not afraid to die) while sensing the fear of the assassin. The
stronger the fear, the nearer the assassin, the greater the assassin's
fear (for whatever reason, death, capture, etc).
For those assassins who are death rune worshippers, their approach to
death is dishonourable. Knowing/sensing this is unnerving for a truly
devout follower of Humakt who see this as sullying death.
I play the results as making the nerves of steel Humakti becoming unnerved,
distracted, disturbed, or paranoid, depending on circumstance, the roll,
and their familiarity with the feeling. Obviously, a series of fumbles
will erode the Humakti's confidence, bravery, and actions (eventually).
Also, it could be possible to find a broken Humakti experiencing
paranoid episodes (which could make for an interesting encounter....)
I think someone mentioned that this skill was used to detect invisible
foes? (maybe I'm wrong). I don't like that, as the use doesn't reflect
the nature of the cult definition of assassin. Maybe if you *never* knew
about the assassin sure, but if someone announces their intentions and
then goes invisible/concealed, no way. Assassins have no respect for
life/death, and never want to be associated with their targets.
One final thought on Humakti's. They have been compared to Clint Eastwood
in their demeanour. I agree. I would also encourage people to draw on
apsects of Lt. Worf's personality from Star Trek:TNG as his philosophy on
death/battle/honour strikes me as being in a similar (though not duplicate)
vein.
Comments?
Rich Fenner
** And now a question from me....
OK, there is the 100% skill limit in RQ II. Currently, my initiate has
100% in a number of skills. He is skilled enough for Rune Status, but
still has 6 months before he will be eligable. This is fine. Once he
achieves Rune status (as a Sword Sage) he will be able to increase his
skills beyond 100% while slowly moving towards Rune Lord-Priest status
in another few years game time.
But what about those that are not associated with a cult that has the
Rune Status. Can't Brithini achieve over 100% in their skills without
reaching Rune Status (which they don't have).
We came up with a simple solution, based on the concept of worshippers
being able to affect their deity (like Zoran Zoran becoming more brutal
and less cunning). If a culture decides that Rune Lord status is
needed to raise their skills over 100%, then people will never get
over 100%. Consider it a matter of faith. Brithini don't believe
in these artificial limits and free advance beyond it.
Then again, we could all use RQ III that lets anyone go over 100%.
Neil Robinson | "Never underestimate the power of human
nrobinso@sirius.uvic.ca | stupidity." - L. Long
2996 Dysart Rd. Victoria B.C. V9A 2K2 (604) 383-5094
---------------------
From: mace@lum.asd.sgi.com (Rob Mace)
Subject: Gods
Message-ID: <9306220119.AA15560@lum.asd.sgi.com>
Date: 21 Jun 93 11:19:35 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1141
Greg Fried writes:
> Does Glorantha have room for more Sun gods other than Yelm?
Yes and no. You might say that Glorantha has enough room for as many
Sun gods as there are Sun god worshipers. All worshipers have a
slightly different view of their god. Each of these views effects
what the god is. When enough worshipers view a god a certain way
then that god will manifest in that way. There could be multiple
groups that view a god in very different ways. That god might have
a different name and a different set of restrictions on their worshipers
yet still be the same basic god.
A couple of months ago I posted an article on this to the daily on
this talking about how this is an effect of the compromise and what
effect it has on heros and hero questing. It also talks about how
Elmal/Yelmalio is an effect of this. If you can't find the article
I probably can and will send it to you.
Anyway, given the way I look at it, there is no reason your East Island's
Sun god can not fit into Glorantha. At some level they are both the
same Sun god and at some level they are two separate gods. As to which
is more the true Sun god, they both are just as real. The only difference
is one might be more powerful then the other based on the number and power
of their followers.
This brings to mind another thought. One could make a monothiest
argument that all the gods are just aspects of a the single god.
Therefore there is only one god.
Rob Mace
---------------------
From: tzunder@cix.compulink.co.uk (Tom Zunder)
Subject: Last Words
Message-ID:
Date: 22 Jun 93 01:42:18 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1142
***
@ Vivamort cultist Zunder replies from grave
Despite no longer getting the Daily I shall reply to Nick Brooke,
from beyond the grave! Da, daaah!
"I did mean that I think people shouldn't overquote from other
people's mail. I think people should extensively quote from KoS,
etc. I worry about their social life, tho.."
***
@ Yelm bonks Ernalda
Have you noticed in the Yemalio culture thingie "What the Priest says"
bit in Shadows in the Borderlands that the priest states that Ernalda
is Yelm's wife, is it me or is some family adultery going on here? I
thought Ernalda was Yelmalio's wife (amongst others). Surely Dendara,
Yelm's wife, and goddess of fidelity, would be a little pissed to
hear what Yelm is up to out in the Wastes?
***
@ UUE file.
MMM, this was 2k as a UUE-ed zip file, it was 5k as a collection of
stats. I thought it was worth sending out the small version, but
don't worry, I'll not bother again. I particularly enjoyed the
postscrpt file that was posted, and use the character sheet regularly.
I'm outta here!
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Orlanth Rex! tzunder@cix.compulink.co.uk
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