From: RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RQ Digest Maintainer)
To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Daily automated RQ-Digest)
Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Fri, 27 Aug 1993, part 1
Reply-To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RuneQuest Daily)
Sender: RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM
Precedence: junk
The RuneQuest Daily and RuneQuest Digest deal with the subjects of
Avalon Hill's RPG and Greg Stafford's world of Glorantha.
Send submissions and followup to "RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM",
they will automatically be included in a next issue. Try to change the
Subject: line from the default Re: RuneQuest Daily... on replying.
Selected articles may also appear in a regular Digest. If you
want to submit articles to the Digest only, contact the editor at
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Send enquiries and Subscription Requests to the editor:
RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Henk Langeveld)
---------------------
From: JARDINE@RMCS.CRANFIELD.AC.UK
Subject: (2d10)**2 and Bucky Players
Message-ID: <9308261134.AA09727@Sun.COM>
Date: 26 Aug 93 11:41:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1466
Ref: X-RQ-ID: 1460 (Donald Wilson)
Sorry Donald, while I agree with the need for speed (and simplicity) I
hate your idea.
1) Your final points total (2d10 squared) ranges from 4 to 400! Thus
one in a hundred characters are automatically dead before play (stats of 0).
The average of 121 (She roll absolutely average not above) is O.K. but
I am dubious about the cost of peripheral skills (too high) so characters
will be too specialized.
2) No disincentive for really high stats and skills.
For example for a long term character (with the potential for real grossness
try the following for 121 points):
STR 9, CON 18, SIZ 10, INT 18, POW 9, DEX 13, APP 3.
Axe 200, Shield 100, Ride 100, Lance 100, Bow 200, Sense Chaos 100, First Aid 753 Wheels to buy a weapon!
A scarred Storm Bull Berserk.
O.K. so he will find things a little tough at first (he should have an axe and a shield but not much else. But his combat skill should see him through a
beginning adventure, at least until another party member falls over dead and
he can borrow his armour!
3) If someone (1 in 100) get 400 points to spend the can create a ready made hero questor.
Oh, well I'll shut up now, but I hope you get the point. Remember if there are loop holes in the system then the players will find them and use them.
Ref: X-RQ-ID: 1461 (Simon Hibbs)
So your players don't want to play a simplified system.
Tell them that you will be running it your way from now on and if they want
to play *normal* RQ3 then one of them can GM it.
This should give you a well earned break and also a chance to play).
-----
Lewis
-----
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From: timbee@timbee.rnd.symix.com (Tim Beecher)
Subject: Digest: Submission
Message-ID: <9308261450.AA03084@timbee.rnd.symix.com.symix>
Date: 26 Aug 93 14:50:41 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1467
Someone asked for some humor so :
River of Cradles Song
[Take me to the River by the Talking Heads , obvious Thanatar sympathizers]
==================================================
Don't know why I adventure like I do
All the fighting that I go through
Used up my Crystals and all of my Clacks
When this is done I may never come back
I want to know
Can you tell me
What's that heading our way ?
Refrain:
Take me to the River
Cradle's in the Water
Take me to the River
Lead me to the Slaughter
Washing it down
Washing it
I don't know why it hurt's so bad
This has been the most wounds I've had
Fought some spirits , fought some broos
Is there treasure or is it a ruse ?
I want to know
Can you tell me
What's that oozing our way ?
Tim Beecher
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From: eco0kkn@cabell.vcu.edu (Kirsten K. Niemann)
Subject: That girl on the cover
Message-ID: <9308261429.AA02743@cabell.vcu.edu>
Date: 26 Aug 93 14:29:49 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1468
Greg Fried asked about the woman on the cover of
Shadows on the Borderlands and River of Cradles
Yes, it is intentionally the same person. No one seems to have
noticed that the semi-nordic looking guy is also the same person.
(Raupp had to point this out to me.)
This continues Chaosium's fine old tradition of having non-cheesecake
women on the covers. Think of the old RQ I & II cover!
The character is not from one of Raupp's campaigns. As far as I know,
he doesn't play.
I believe that Ken did the original conception of the characters.
There is no history or name for any of them.
In my original art order for the upcoming Strangers in Prax, I also
included these two characters, with a few more improvements to their
gear, and other changes to their appearance. However, A different
cover is being done that may or may not inclde them. If I get my way,
it will, though they will not have the same starring roles in the
compositon, that being reserved for the Lunar Coders debarking from a
Moon Boat.
Of course, they may not be recognizable when rendered by other
artists.
M >|<
MIke Dawson
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From: nrobinso@sirius.UVic.CA (Neil Robinson)
Subject: RQLite
Message-ID: <32248.nrobinso@sirius.uvic.ca>
Date: 26 Aug 93 16:57:25 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1469
I tend to agree on the RQLite topic, despite my history as a rules
lawyer and 'character optimizer'. Where did I come to this conclusion?
As soon as I started GMing with new players.
RQ is a very powerful and flexible system. We have found it very easy
to tailor the rules, adding new skills and combat options, changing
the spell system, and including more detailed circle and summoning
magic (ala Stormbringer). When a new person enters our regular game, he
(or she) has a lot of learning to do, especially if he is new to
role-playing.
Then a friend approached me to GM him, his girlfriend, and another
girl. I leapt at the chance. Of them, only one was familiar with
any game system (AD&D), so I decided to use my version of RQ. When
rolling up the characters, I quickly discovered two things: neither
girl was interested in the 'rules', and all three were having
trouble picking it up. OK, I thought, how do I get around this
problem. Coming from a wargamer background, I've never had a problem
picking up and remembering rules.
What I did was simple, and seems to have been emulated by others as
well. I removed the hit location concept and went into a combat
system like Stormbringer or BRP (remember that Chaosium product?).
That helped, but two of them still got hung up on the rules.
At that point I started managing all the rules for all the characters
myself, including hit point monitoring and other skills. Heck,
I've run AD&D combats with zoodles of characters, so this wasn't
too hard for me. We don't have many combats anyway.
As time goes on, I keep increasing the amount of responsiblity of
the players and their knowledge of the gaming system. However, I
try to make sure that it does not interfere with the story/adventure/
atmosphere. The game is also improving as my GMing skills do.
My system works well providing the DM is familiar with RQ. However,
the real goal is to convert the DMs, as they are the ones who drive
the game, and the people who are getting into RPGs without any
previous knowledge.
I see no problem with scenario packs that support both RQ, and
a yet-to-be-determined RQlite as well. Heck, I haven't had much
trouble modifying Stormbringer modules since those rules are quite
similar. Unlike some modules from a company in Lake Geneva, the RQ
and Stormbringer modules usually deal more with plot, descriptions
and characterization than stats and game rules.
Whew...
Neil Robinson | "Never underestimate the power of human
nrobinso@sirius.uvic.ca | stupidity." - L. Long
2996 Dysart Rd. Victoria B.C. V9A 2K2 (604) 385-1642
---------------------
From: f6ri@midway.uchicago.edu (charles gregory fried)
Subject: more RQLite
Message-ID:
Date: 26 Aug 93 18:12:54 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1470
Greg Fried here.
Thanks for the thoughts on RQLite (who thought that name up, anyhoo?) people.
Donald and David: As far as I can tell from your descriptions, Pendragon
rules fail the convertability test. Convertability is a Sine Qua Non of
RQLite!!!! No one is going to go ahead with a project that renders obsolete
all previously published and still in print game materials! If there is
going to be a RQLite, it MUST dovetail with the publications now coming out.
ANything else is a pipe dream. (By 'no one' I mean any game publisher with
an interest in financial responsibility. Which leads me to:...)
Simon: yes, there is a danger that if good RQLite rules are developed and
published by folks like us (ie, across the net, not for profit), we might
undermine the game. For this reason, we should strive for convertability, not
for a system that would replace published RQ.
I have been thinking hard about rules for RQLite. If anyone wants Roderick's
RQWargame rules, email me privately, and I'll send them to you. When and if
I think my RQLite rules are provisionally viable, I will post them here. FOr
the moment, let me say a few things as to what I am considering.
RQLite rules will impact almost entirely on combat, making it quicker and
easier to learn, since I think this is where the game stumbles for new
players. There should be as few roles as possible, with as little
calculating and recalculating of variable values as possible too. D&D is the
most successful (ducking eggs!) here: only To Hit, AC, HP and damage are
needed, and these rarely vary much once calculated. I wouldn't go this far,
though, especially given my conversion constraint. Here's what I'm thinking
about:
An Attack vs. a Defend roll, followed by a Damage vs. a Resiliance roll, if
the attack is in some way successful. These rolls would amalgamate a number
of RQ combat factors (cf Rod's rules, though I would do it different). Thr
problem is: how to figure the amalgamation! More when I think it thru.
It is indeed distressing that Sun County has been selling as badly as
Daughters of Darkness, since SC is a very good product. SO what is wrong?
It might simply be a question of price: the recent scenario packs are
expensive. Though worth the price to die-hards like me, it is perhaps
prohibative to prospective converts. Also, many gamers expect modules packed
with maps of castles and dungeons and descriptions of rooms filled with
monsters and treasure. Though this is not what we should aim for, we should
also realize that the recent RQ modules LOOK more like book-length
encyclopaedia articles than game aids. I can well imagine a prospective RQer
looking thru one and thinking, "Sheesh! I can't handle this! What's going
on here?" Perhpas the problem is that product like Dorastor try to combine
broad historical and other background with specific campaign scenarios. The
two should be separated. I think new RQers are much more likely to buy Apple
Land and Snakepipe Hollow than Dorastor (and if they get Dorastor, they will
be overwhelmed). So again, more INEXPENSIVE modules so that a GM can play a
fun adventure right away, but backed up with rich Gloranthan background
supplements. Understand this is purely a marketing strategy, and constitutes
no criticism of the HIGH quality of products such as Dorastor.
GF out.
---------------------
From: ddunham@radiomail.net (David Dunham , via RadioMail)
Subject: RQ Lite Meta-thoughts
Message-ID: <9308270002.AA14419@radiomail.net>
Date: 27 Aug 93 00:01:57 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1471
Here's my current thoughts on RQ-Lite:
We need a new version of RuneQuest because the current one is too complex
for beginners. Therefore, the new version should be as small as possible.
The new version should concentrate on what makes RuneQuest cool. To a large
extent, that's the world of Glorantha. Specifically, it's Dragon Pass, as
the crossroads of Glorantha (hey, that could even be the title!). And as I
remember first seeing RQ, it's also a skill system, universal low-power
magic, and realistic results (e.g. crippled limbs).
There should be almost no optional rules in RQ-Lite. Even if they're
clearly marked as optional, if you're trying to read and learn the game,
you have to read them.
All the cool combat tactics of RQ4 should be in a separate rules
supplement. I believe most of shamanism and all of sorcery should be, too.
RQ should focus on Dragon Pass, and any rules not needed to run a
reasonable game there should NOT be in the basic set.
So instead of trying to figure out what to cut from RQ, how about trying to
figure out what to _defer_ from RQ?
Strike Ranks are an example. Basic RQ could say that all first blows are
considered simultaneous within a round. There could be a sentence, "GMs who
dislike simultaneous blows can resolve the attack with the highest DEX
first, or use the Strike Rank system from RQ Companion. To use the SR
numbers from published scenarios, resolve the lowest combatant first."
Damage to hit locations could be another. We could use something like
Pendragon's Major Wound (half your HP), and in Basic RQ, use the hit
location table only if there's a major wound, to determine where the wound
occurred. RQ Companion would have the full rules for how many HP a location
could take, etc.
Even if you don't like my specific examples, is a binary split a good
thing? Is the idea of _no_ rules for many of the complex things too
crippling (e.g. I propose no rules for sorcery, because nobody from Dragon
Pass learns it -- the GM can get a paragraph on how to improvise sorcery if
he doesn't have RQ Companion)?
---------------------
From: kenrolston@aol.com
Subject: Rolston amends the minutes.
Message-ID: <9308262219.tn32479@aol.com>
Date: 27 Aug 93 02:19:30 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1472
KEN ROLSTON AMENDS THE MINUTES FOR GENCON REPORTS
>>Bad news: Sun County sold no better than Daughters of Darkness. AH has
agreed
>>to at least keep everything which they have already signed for on schedule,
but
>>anything else is completely unsubstantiable and up in the air.
Sun County sold over nine months about 40% better than Daughters of Darkness,
and in the long run will probably sell much better than DoD -- but that is
still less than a stirring endorsement of the virtue of quality in increasing
sales, and a considerable disappointment to AH, who depend on quality
producing vast increases in sales to make the line profitable.
Strangers in Prax and Cults of Dorastor (tentatively renamed Lords of Terror)
remain on the AH publishing schedule, but publishing dates are indefinite.
Other projects remain Juicy Gossip.
>>RQIV is off the schedule. There are currently no plans to produce it as
such.
>>However, a certain ill-tempered little bird (who does a GREAT Skaven
>>impersonation) has said that there might be an attempt to sell Avalon Hill
on a
>>"RuneQuest Glorantha".
RQIV is indeed off the schedule for Spring 94. There are several proposals
under discussion for alternative formats to publish RQIV material. One is a
RuneQuest rules Companion, which would offer one or two RuneQuest Lite
variants, and a compendium of the consensus-approved elements of the RQIV
project. Another proposal is to publish a fat perfectbound supplement with
the working title of RuneQuest Glorantha which presents the RuneQuest rules
as needed for Glorantha (and explicitly does not support Fantasy Earth or
Gateway). This supplement would be all-singing, all-dancing Glorantha, and
would (probably) incorporate the essential elements of the RQIV project. Both
proposals have merit. Neither project is on the schedule yet, and reports on
both must be regarded as Juicy Gossip until they make it to the schedule.
MARK WALLACE AND RACHEL SCHMUTTER SHOWCASE RQ SCENARIO ART
I ran my Gencon game sessions next door (actually, next curtain) to Wallace
and Schmutter running their scenarios. I was amiably ashamed of the ancient
traditional flavor of my scenario, and envious of their roleplaying/dramatic
presentation. Sigh. I shall take it as inspiration.
RUNEQUEST LITE
I am a strong supporter of RuneQuest Lite strategies. Our local group runs a
rough drafted RQ Lite, and I have proposed another RQ Lite strategy (which I
do not think as good as our current house rules). I do not propose it as the
key to a marketing strategy; it may may well be sound as such, but I favor it
because simple systems and fast-paced combats are to my taste.
However, I DO like combat systems that lend themselves to tactical
maneuver on the tabletop, and must recognize that, since RQII and RQIII were
both dramatically deficient in this regard, I am to some extent interested in
adding some level of detail or articulation to the combat rules. Our house
rules work well enough in casual play, but I fear working up a rigorous rules
set for these house rules might be an ugly project. If I get the time [Hah!]
I'll try to get a draft for distribution.
Ken Rolston