From: RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RQ Digest Maintainer)
To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Daily automated RQ-Digest)
Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Tue, 31 Aug 1993, part 1
Reply-To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RuneQuest Daily)
Sender: RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM
Precedence: junk
The RuneQuest Daily and RuneQuest Digest deal with the subjects of
Avalon Hill's RPG and Greg Stafford's world of Glorantha.
Send submissions and followup to "RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM",
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Subject: line from the default Re: RuneQuest Daily... on replying.
Selected articles may also appear in a regular Digest. If you
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Send enquiries and Subscription Requests to the editor:
RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Henk Langeveld)
---------------------
From: ddunham@radiomail.net (David Dunham , via RadioMail)
Subject: re: RQLite
Message-ID: <9308270621.AA21666@radiomail.net>
Date: 27 Aug 93 06:21:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1473
>From: nrobinso@sirius.UVic.CA (Neil Robinson)
>Subject: RQLite
>Unlike some modules from a company in Lake Geneva, the RQ
>and Stormbringer modules usually deal more with plot, descriptions
>and characterization than stats and game rules.
This is exactly why I'm not concerned that a version of RuneQuest revised
to have more mass appeal be able to use current scenarios without running
through a simple conversion process.
>From: f6ri@midway.uchicago.edu (charles gregory fried)
>Subject: more RQLite
>Donald and David: As far as I can tell from your descriptions, Pendragon
>rules fail the convertability test.
As we discussed in email, PenDragon Pass (as an example of a radically
simpler system) is not _compatible_ with RQ, but it is fairly
straightforward to _convert_ to it. I know this, because I use Griffin
Island in my PenDragon Pass campaign. The only difficult part is coming up
with Damage and Armor values (mostly armor since RQ characters don't wear
uniform armor); the skills divide by 5, and the spells stay as is. This is
an example of a reasonable conversion. It's no worse than trying to use
Griffin Island with RQ4 that has different damage bonuses or hit location
tables.
>From: kenrolston@aol.com
>I am a strong supporter of RuneQuest Lite strategies. Our local group runs a
>rough drafted RQ Lite, and I have proposed another RQ Lite strategy
Out of curiosity, are you interested in RQ-Lite which reduces the _rules_
(e.g. drop strike ranks) or the _rolls_ (e.g. unify attack and defense a la
Pendragon)? I see RQ as having two problems: it's hard to teach, and it
takes a long time to resolve combat.
David Dunham * Software Designer * Pensee Corporation
Voice/Fax: 206-783-7404 * AppleLink: DDUNHAM * Internet: ddunham@radiomail.net
---------------------
From: glidedw@sfsuvax1.sfsu.edu (Donald Wilton)
Subject: Daily mail, thursday, August 26, 1993
Message-ID:
Date: 26 Aug 93 22:46:39 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1474
I agree that my ideas on characters can produce immensely overachieving
characters. This explains why I put in the "GM rules on points" statement.
A slight variant might include 2D10>4 * 2 less than a certain muber,
defined by the GM. The idea is to create average charcters quickly, rather
than deal with excessive details. rules optimizers could get made to feel
that inadequacy of their characters. If I have no weapons to speak of,
does this mean that I can use culture inapporpriate ones from another? If
money is too cheap, change it to gold pennies or sp.
Thus a 121 point character, might have a few high stats, but low money.
she might have high money and low skills. If she chooses to have truly
mondo skills, with low skills, and money, she qill quickly develop an
appreciation for the lack.
Greg's rules have a certain number of points average (33) per year. Add a
certain amount of popints for stat development over 10, and buy one for
one down on other stats, if you want to exceed a value. A character with
higher POW than 15 would have to lower another stat below ten. Add the
points for skills, and a variable based on skill total times age past 15
to achieve money, +10% for initate status.
---------------------
From: jacobus@sonata.cc.purdue.edu
Subject: RQlite vs. RQ Glorantha
Message-ID: <9308271521.AA04139@sonata.cc.purdue.edu>
Date: 27 Aug 93 05:21:28 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1475
Call me a 180+ IQ photographic memory sort, but I would rather go for an
all-singing, all-dancing, big perfect bound "RuneQuest Glorantha" instead of
a "RuneQuest Light". However, I could see one good idea being the issuance
of RQ as RQLite with all of the serious detail deferred to RQ Glorantha.
Bryan
---------------------
From: f6ri@midway.uchicago.edu (charles gregory fried)
Subject: Woman ID'd!
Message-ID:
Date: 27 Aug 93 15:27:41 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1476
Greg Fried here.
Mike Dawson:
Thanks for explaining the woman on the cover of SoB (yikes! what an acronym!)
and RoC! I must say, there is really no clue to go on that that "nordic" guy
is the same though. I like the RoC cover especially: I use bone armor in my
campaign, and I show my players that cover and say, "Here, this is what you
look like!" The recent art work has been very good, IMHO, and I put my vote
in for another cover with the woman-with-a-scar. And BTW, what does the
tatoo on her fingers say? "Hate" in Nordic runes?! Almost looks it... Does
her left hand read "Love".....?
---
Neil:
I second your notions. Especially what you say about converting DMs. RQ
will expand as a game only in so far as it gathers more DMs into its fold.
Such new GMs (erg -- I hate "DM"!) can best be seduced by a RQLite that seems
easy for them to learn and adapt to, and get playing with their campaign and
players. Add to that lots of nifty scenario packs and you got yer potential
ground swell moving! As great as Glorantha is though, I must repeat my
observation from yesterday: encyclopaedic info on GLorantha in each module
will just scare prospectic GMs away. THis is NOT the same thing as saying
that the richness of Gl. should not enter into a module!!!!!!! We just need
to be very clear on what will attract new players to this game. I
WHOLEHEARTEDLY agree that the GLoranthan setting MAKES the game, but we old
hands should not delude ourselves that what is comprehensible to us, is
appealing and straight-forward to the newbies who we DEPEND on to keep the
game financially alive. I hate to beat a dead horse, but this is the only
forum for such thoughts, and NOW is the time to wake up and smell the coffee,
folks.
Further, what you say points in the direction of what might be called
"modular" RQ. But this I mean, a set of rules with several layers of
complexity, which can be added or stripped away as needed. FOr example:
layer 1) RQLite <---> 2) Intermediate RQ <---> 3) RQ3 as we know and as is
now being published <---> 4) RQ4 as it is being developed (and now apparently
back-burnered!) by Oliver and Co. SUch rules need not be published all
together. Indeed, I think RQLite should be published alone and cheaply.
RQ4, in a Rules Companion. THis would minimize AH's typesetting overhead: no
need to revamp RQ3.
---
D Dunham:
Amen. See above.
---
Ken:
Thanks for clearing up a few rumors. I for one would like to see your house
RQLite rules. Mind you, a modular RQ might solve your tabletop strategy
needs.
Glad to hear Sun County is doing better than rumored. How well has KoS sold?
Prediction: Strangers in Prax and Cults of Dorastor will sell only as well as
the current (excellent) Gloranthan products. Why? Because they appeal only
to an already converted core of RQ devotees, not to newbies. PLAYERS will
begin to buy them (nad then problably only the Prax one, if their GMs have
any authority over them) only when MORE GMs have been converted to RQ!
"Danger! Danger, Will Robinson!"
GF out.
---------------------
From: yfcw29@castle.edinburgh.ac.uk
Subject: RQLite
Message-ID: <9308271725.aa17692@uk.ac.ed.castle>
Date: 27 Aug 93 16:25:52 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1477
Preamble
--------
A lot of people are talking about RQLite. Many will have their own agenda
and rules prefferences. Ultimately, if RQ is to be successfull, the
final publication of such a rules set is at the discretion of Avalon Hill.
All we can do is produce rules to play with our friends and hope that
what we do has some influence on Avalon Hill's plans for Runequest.
In other words, saying "Hey guys, here is my definitive set of rules for
the ultimate simplified RQ", is pointless. Having said that, I think there
is a concept here that is worth proving.
As a result, these are not specific rules proposals, but a blueprint for
what these rules changes might achieve. The goals are as follows :
1) Complete compatibility with full blown RQ. You should be able
to take a full blown RQ character and play it in an RQLite game with NO
CONVERSION AT ALL. The reverse will not be possible directly, because
RQLite characters will not have all the complex stuff worked out for them.
Also, All RQ scenarios must be completely playable with bot sets of rules,
simply by puting in complete "advanced rules" statistics.
2) RQLite must be a fully playable game. ie not players set/GM's set split,
RQLite must have character generation, combat, character progression,
"monster" statistics, Glorantha background, GM resources, etc. It must also
have some magic, maybe just spirit magic, but fully worked out.
3) RQLite must be all in one book. This is perfectly achievable. Look at
COC5 for example. The game system and character generation only take up
about a dozen pages. All the rest of that great huge book is GM resources.
4) So far as RQLite is concerned, the progression to RQ4 is irrelevent.
It could be simultaneously compatible with both RQ3 and RQ4. The only
difference would be the skills lists, but this could be easily covered.
By prefference RQLite would use the RQ4 skills list.
Sample Rules Layout :
Character Generation
--------------------
Very simple. Characteristics stay the same, but throw out skill category
modifiers, strike ranks and hit locations. A full set of skills is a must.
A points alocation system a la RQ4 is a good move, but maybe just with one
level of experience (average).
Combat
------
No strike ranks or hit locations. Just a streight DEX based initiative system.
Maybe a "major wound" system with a table of effects. Not too deadly either.
Personaly I think a game which leaves maimed and crippled PCs littering
the battlefield is not a good idea.
Some people have stated that AD&D is near ideal with just HP, AC and THAC0.
Well, RQ just needs HPs, APs and skill percentages. Big deal.
To make up for the lower level of detail, drama should be emphasized.
Magic
_____
Only spirit magic, but fully detailed. Including a full spells list. Possibly
including the spirit magic available from some cults (Gloranthan cults).
How about some magic items too, a few crystals and matrices. Maybe a potion
or too. Makes for good treasure in starting scenarios.
Monsters Lists
--------------
NPCs and monsters do not need characteristics, so why have them. Just list
the Hit Points, Magic Points, Move Rate, skills percentages, spells, etc.
Maps and Scenarios
------------------
Show everybody what Glorantha looks like. Give them a map of Dragon Pass/Prax.
A lot of the published material is on Prax, so maybe concentrate on the
River of Cradles. Then they can expand into Sun County, Borderlands, etc.
Later Publications
------------------
Heroes of Glorantha : The complete character generation rules, emphasizing
and detailing the varied cultures of Glorantha. Also, the advanced combat
rules. Strike ranks, hit locations, manoeuvres,etc.
The Magic of Glorantha : Rules for Shamans, Rune Magic, Sorcery, cults &
Malkioni sects.
All this later stuff could wait a year. Also, it need not be in this form.
But this is my shot at a reasonable plan.
Simon
---------------------
From: staats@Athena.MIT.EDU
Subject: RuneQuest Lite
Message-ID: <9308271740.AA16059@al-burro>
Date: 27 Aug 93 17:40:05 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1478
Greetings!
I only have time for a very short note at the moment. I had the
chance to chat with Greg Stafford this past weekend at Necronomicon for
an extended period which was quite nice. I am a little concerned about
how viable RQ is going to remain given recent developments at AH (which have
all been discussed on the net --- sorry! No "top secret" material was
meted out to me! :-) ) It definitely seems like developing an RQ-Lite is
the answer. Does anyone remember the Judges Guild? The company produced
a lot of material. The quality varied greatly, but all of it was inexpensive.
The JG kept down its production costs by producing all of its material on
newsprint with offset printing. What the RQ world could really use is a JG
like company which produces great quantities of inexpensive material. It
would be aimed at a different market segment. Most FRP gamers are between
10 and 16 years old; many of them would be very excited to be able to pick
up a complete module for less than $5 (US). It was certainly nice as a young
GM to be able to get a complete campaign for less than $10 (which included
some nice maps, etc.) No one is going to be excessively worried about
editorial quality if the price is right. By the same virtue, the gaming system
would have to be as simple as possible, and RQ-Lite seems like the answer to
that.
Here is a *very quick* list of possible in/exclusions:
* retain att/parry/dodge rolls
* have hit locations as an optional rule
* eliminate fatigue, weapon damage, knock backs
* do away with sorcery or greatly simplify it
* keep strike ranks, but make the personal add depend only on DEX
* have spell casting occur on spell points + 1 SR
* divine spells go on SR 1
* have poison damage occur on SR 1 of the round after the poison enters
the character's system
Got to fly!
More to follow . . .
In service,
Rich
PS Jack, could you please pass on my good wishes to Greg? I know he does not
read the net, and I wanted him to know I enjoyed chatting with him
greatly. Thank you much, Rich :-)
---------------------
From: paul@phyast.pitt.edu (Paul Reilly)
Subject: Re: RuneQuest Con
Message-ID: <9308272026.AA18576@minerva.phyast.pitt.edu>
Date: 27 Aug 93 20:26:44 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1479
Paul Reilly here. Just a short note: if you are going to RQ -con
and need costumes or other props, e-mail me and I may be able to
arrange something. For Orlanthi types Finula can provide some woad
and also henna for Lunars.
Also if anyone is coming from or through the Pittsburgh area let me know.
- paul
P.S. I hope to return to the list in October as a more regular contributor,
at the moment I am mired deeply in a dissertation.
---------------------
From: MCKAY_MICHAEL@tandem.com
Subject: RQ 3 Sorcery, actually works!
Message-ID: <199308271655.AA32057@comm.Tandem.COM>
Date: 27 Aug 93 09:53:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1480
I heard it said many times that the sorcery system from Rune Quest III is
totally unworkable, or that it leads to grotesque situations. I have held my
tounge, mainly because there is a lot of background information involved with
the explanation. None the less, our group had a multi-year campaign and found
that the Sorcery rules added some nice things to the campaign. First, and
perhaps most importantly, the world setting was not Glorantha. Our players
ranged is all levels of expereince (from a reformed ex-rules hack, myself,
to people who could care less about rules).
A while back on this digest, there was a conversation about how the game
rules influnce the world. This is an example. The world, designed by Bear
Black, is supposed to be a fairly sophisticated world (say Italian Renn.),
with magic rather than technology. There were a number of things that were
never quite explained by the magic system (powerful spells from days gone by).
We found that with a little tweaking, some of the game mechanic side, and some
on the "world description", sorcery did a very good job of explaining these
powerful things. We also played with a group that included two eleven
(high int) sorcerers, which you might imagine as a dangerous (to the game
balance) sitiuation. It proved out pretty well, and we only had to make some
minor modifications to improve playability.
These modifications included: material components increase casting chance;
sorcerer need only make one role under all needed skills to suceed, any failure
only cost 1 MP; modification of damage resist spell; and allowing spells to be
cast in a shorter amount of time if the sorcerer sacrificed Hit Points (for
emergency casting). We also used some of the controls built into the game:
scarcity of spells, strict control of rolling checks, and cultral bias for
and against some spells. This resulted in a very workable set of rules. The
high int elfs could cast 1 week to 2 month spells like fly and damage resist,
which change things around a little bit, but these did not cause too much
upset.
I'd be interested in hearing from other people who have used sorcery. If
there is enough interest, I can probably arrange for more detailed
explanations of our rule tweaking.
Michael McKay (mckay_michael@tandem.com)
---------------------
From: MCKAY_MICHAEL@tandem.com
Subject: Glorantha ? AD&D Conversion Strategy
Message-ID: <199308271731.AA21817@comm.Tandem.COM>
Date: 28 Aug 93 10:29:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 1481
I've been low key on this digest for a while. One of the primary reasons
is that I have not activly played in a Glorantha game since 1984 or so (when
did Pavis come out?). While I have seen non-Glorantha messages from time
to time, this does not seem to be a major part of the digest. Would anybody
object to a medium sized description of using Rune Quest rules in other worlds?
I have a friend (who is also on this list) who has come up with some pretty
good techniques (both general and specific) for converting AD&D into Rune
Quest. Those of you in the San Fransisco Bay Area, or in the South US
(Mississippi actually), may have had a chance to try this system at a game con.
Since Bear has been too busy himself, I thought I'd mention this and find out
if anybody is interested. Currently the game is a cross between Rune Quest and
Storm Bringer (hit location and armor mostly), and incorporates 6 different
magic systems.
To make conversions work successfully, you need to tackle both the game
systems and the world that they are being converted to. The characters
strengths and weaknesses should remain very similar (I remember trying to
convert a Role Master character to AD&D; the character's primary attack was
thrown daggers, a very reasonable method of attacking in Role Master but
virtually worthless in AD&D). If there is enough interest in this subject,
I will post some of the conversion techniques (both general and specific). I
would also appreciate feedback on how appropriate this topic is.
Michael McKay (mckay_michael@tandem.com)