Bell Digest v931119p1

From: RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RQ Digest Maintainer)
To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Daily automated RQ-Digest)
Reply-To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RuneQuest Daily)
Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Fri, 19 Nov 1993, part 1
Message-ID: 
Precedence: junk

X-RQ-ID: Intro

This is the RuneQuest Daily Bulletin, a mailing list on
the subjects of Avalon Hill's RPG and Greg Stafford's 
world of Glorantha.  It is sent out once per day in digest
format.

More details on the RuneQuest Daily and Digest can be found
after the last message in this digest.


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From: akuma@netcom.com (Steven E Barnes)
Subject: Sunspear
Message-ID: <199311180917.BAA20146@mail.netcom.com>
Date: 17 Nov 93 17:17:07 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2364


>>The intent when Sunspear was written up was that ALL magic is  
>>ineffective vs. Sunspear. It's a very special spell, and ignores all  
>>them things you mentioned. Perhaps magic designed specially for use  
>>vs. fire/sky spells might have an effect (like Suppress Aether), if  
>>the GM decides. 
>
>This kind of destroys the premise of Griffin Island. Wouldn't Hilme priest
>Taklong Woodheart have long ago hit the evil sorcerer Halcyon var Enkorth
>with a big Sunspear?

Yeah.  Basically, it seems like this is a spell with no defense,
other than some obscure possibilities.  Either protection or
countermagic should work against it.

Another problem is that it is an entirely different mechanic
from the other forms of magical fire:  1) fire blade (3d6 vs armor),
2) salamander attack (3d6, make resistance roll vs the characters
*highest* armor value, including spells; if successful, take only 
half damage).

Seems to me that a sunspear is the same thing as elemental fire,
maybe a bit more intense.  As a rules lawyer, I also favor unified
game mechanics...

The "attack vs thinnest armor" rule is also a bit unclear.  Since
the word  "hit location" was never mentioned in the spell description,
it never occured to my group that this was how the spell was resolved...

-steve


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From: JARDINE@RMCS.CRANFIELD.AC.UK
Subject: Rune Sorcery
Message-ID: <9311181005.AA27946@Sun.COM>
Date: 18 Nov 93 08:49:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2365


Ref: various (Colin Watson)

	Just a minor comment about pairs of powers = a condition = a skill 

1) I am note happy with communication (probably a power) for Range.  
   However I don't know what to replace it with.  
2) I suggest the following for Intensity and Duration:
	Truth + Illusion 	=  Magic	-- Intensity
	Fertility + Death	=  Infinity	-- Duration
   Note that infinity is basically fertility on its side.  

	-----
	Lewis
	-----

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From: rowe@soda.berkeley.edu (Eric Rowe)
Subject: Yet another plant
Message-ID: <199311181019.CAA10953@soda.berkeley.edu>
Date: 17 Nov 93 18:19:40 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2366

 
The following is a short excerpt from Rodin Greenbeak's Compendium of
Gloranthan Fauna.  This well-travelled Grey Sage devised his own
system of Nomenclature based upon Ocron Everseer's Compendium of
Species.  The original work is currently somewhere in the Library of
Kethaela, where Rodin was acting Provost of Apprentices until his
mysterious disappearance in 1619 ST.


CORAL IVY (Blue Avocado)
Scopulus hedera

Very little is known about the major stage in the life-cycle of Coral
Ivy other than rumors passed on by friendly Mermen.  They claim that
Coral Ivy grows to an enormous size, with leaves that have a
fluctuating pigment system resulting in a startling array of color.
Gyndron raise this plant to cover the walls of their great castles of
living coral.  The tremendous depths at which this grows and the
unfriendliness of most Gyndron mean that it will be difficult to
verify the description.  What is known for sure is that its large
seeds are bouyant and are often found washed up on various shores of
the Ocean, particularly in the area of the Solkathi sea.

The seeds of Coral Ivy look like a fairly large blue Avocado.  The
meat of the fruit continues the analogy in its slightly firm
consistency.  While lovely to look upon, the flavor of this blue meat
is reminiscent of rather bitter Pelorian eggnog.  Inside the meat of
the fruit is a hard shell, which a non-professional could easily
mistake for the actual seed.  If this internal shell is broken with a
handy large maul the actual seed is revealed as a tiny translucent
blob that I first mistook for a microgorp, before I realized the
impossibility.  The true seed again fails to stimulate the taste buds,
resembling chewy Praxian marsh grass more than anything else.
However, the hard internal shell if ground to a fine power greatly
enhances the natural flavor of Kokolonni in a light Red Clover sauce.

Planting of the Coral Ivy seed in a suitably moist and fertile
environment led to its sturdy growth into what has previously been
mis-classified as Dust Fern by less observant sages.  While the Dust
Fern does indeed resemble many other Fern phenotypes, it is clear from
my research that it is simply part of the life-cycle of Coral Ivy and
should be classified thus.  This land based part of the Coral Ivy
lasts about four weeks.  After its quick maturation the plant releases
thousands of tiny seeds into the wind, which led to its mistaken
classification as a Dust Fern.  These minute seeds, while very light,
quickly saturated and sank when placed upon water surfaces.

My final anaylsis therefore, is that the blue meat of the Coral Ivy
fruit is used to attract large land herbivores.  After consumption the
hard shell will be broken down some and weakened by the digestion
process.  Subsequent excretion will leave the seed sitting in an
environment friendly to its development with a shell that can be
easily broken through by the seedling.  It then quickly matures and
sends its next generation of seeds to the wind.  Some of these reach
far enough out into the ocean for successful germination once they
reach the ocean floor.  Lucky individuals are then gathered for use by
horticulturaly inclined Gyndron.

As further evidence for this hypothesis I note that the Brontosaur
(Apatosaurus) is often seen wading in the shallows of the shore
rooting around for Coral Ivy seeds.  Also, hunters from Khorst often
use them as bait to lure dinosaurs into pits in the Trachodon Marsh.
Clearly larger herbivores they are not offended by its highly bitter
taste.

Gamemaster Notes
_______________________________________________________________________

(1) Understandably unnoticed by Rodin there is a slight magical effect
from ingesting Coral Ivy seeds.  For roughly fifteen minutes after
eating the blue meat of the seed the consumer will be under the effect
of the strange pigments.  In game terms they will have a
chameleon-like ability to blend with their background, up to a 50%
bonus to their hide ability.  Of course, wearing clothing limits this
aid.

(2) There are no special effects obtainable from the land based part
of Coral Ivy or other seed parts other than that mentioned by Rodin.


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From: f6ri@midway.uchicago.edu (charles gregory fried)
Subject: shields
Message-ID: 
Date: 18 Nov 93 13:51:18 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2367

Greg Fried here.

David:
The trad-off for using the shield as I described is that you cannot parry
blows aimed at on landing on areas not covered by the shield.  The shield
just counts as extra armor for those areas covered, provided you make a
single Parry role.  Also, you cannot roll a critical parry with this method;
all you can do is make a simple success (though you can still fumble).  And
of course, this use of shield use counts as one of your two melee actions in
a round.

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From: eosgg@raesp-farn.mod.uk (Geoff Gunner)
Subject: Crimson Bat
Message-ID: <9311181532.AA28725@raesp-farn.mod.uk>
Date: 18 Nov 93 15:32:02 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2368

Hmmm - killing the Bat ?  In days of yore, I thought that the best way of doing
it was:
 1)  become Issaries, with Spell Trading.
 2)  get lots of Counter Chaos spells from Zorak Zorani / Storm Bulls
 3)   Get lots of Teleport spells
 4) Everyone in the party port onto the Bat's back, kill the priests, avoid
    the lice ("Quick - where's the 'Head-&-Shoulders' super-economy pack ?')
    and stab the bat for all you're worth.
 Never got to try it out, suspected our ref. would have said that as the thing's
virtually a god Counter Chaos is ineffectice, and besides it was a duck planning
all this.  Fwack, Bat-killer ?  Never.  Hope your players manage it, though !
Let us know how it gets on.

Geoff.

---------------------

From: s.manning@ic.ac.uk
Subject: zero
Message-ID: <9311181550.AA14250@giga.ma.ic.ac.uk>
Date: 18 Nov 93 15:50:21 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2369

Nick Brooke says

>Incidentally, I am sure that the Lunars introduced the number "zero" to 
>Glorantha, and its various uses in arithmetic as a place-denoter, etc.

No, I don't think this is correct. The number zero has to be a Malkioni 
invention, because (i) their maths is not at the medieval level, IMO and (ii) 
their creation "myth" runs:
0 The Unknowable
1 The Knowable

etc.--- see the Monomyth in GoG.  Nice try though.

Incidentally, on the subject of numbers, I feel that most Gloranthan societies 
would not, by our standards be numerate.  They may be able to count, but 
probably only up to 2, or possibly 3 and even then maybe only with the aid of 
stick, stones twists of hair or something like that.  I cannot remember the 
author's name, but there is a very good Dover book called "Number Word, Number 
Symbol" (?) all about the development of numeracy.

Personally, getting back to the Lunars, I don't think of them as being a 
particulary mathematical society; they probably get by with the equivalent of 
Roman numerals.  I think that the two most mathematically minded societies are the Malkioni, 
because you need true mathematics for all the complicated 
theoretical/mathematical sorcery and the Kraloreans, because (i) they have such 
a centralised society run by educated mandarins (unlike Whitehall ?) (ii) they 
have so many people that they need an abstract notation of number to count them 
and (iii) their history is so deep and their view of time propbably encourage 
this.  In reality, India has one of the richest numerical vocabularies, because 
while we only got use to the idea of big number late, couldn't make up our mind 
and just used standard notation, in Hinduism the concept of time (Days of Brahma 
etc.) lead to great advances in numeracy.

---------------------

From: 100270.337@CompuServe.COM (Nick Brooke)
Subject: Lunar Cycles, etc.
Message-ID: <931118183738_100270.337_BHB63-1@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 18 Nov 93 18:37:38 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2370

_________________
Joerg accused me:

> I think it was you who uttered the assumption that the Lunars want to 
> suppress the cycles of chaos incursions by imprinting their own cycles 
> on Time.

Nope! I pass the buck to Paul, who said something similar a while ago. It's 
a nice idea, though, expressed in those few words. I can't follow your 
real-world physics argument (was it an example?), and so have ignored it.

______________________
Sandy contradicted me:

>> [I said] Incidentally, I am sure that the Lunars introduced the number
>> "zero" to Glorantha

> I, on the other hand, suspect it may have been the God-Learners, with  
> their sea-spanning mercantile emperor.

Big guy, was he?  Sort of like the Colossus of Rhodes?

Nope, I'll stick by my guns. The Lunars understand the void of nothingness 
better than anyone else, and come from a region with the equivalent of the 
Graeco-Roman philosophical and mathematical traditions. The God Learners 
don't have the same acquaintanceship with the emptiness of non-being, and 
aren't famous for accounting or engineering finesse.

Of course, it could have been "introduced" in two separate places...

________________________
David Dunham reiterated:

> Wouldn't Hilme priest Taklong Woodheart have long ago hit the evil
> sorcerer Halcyon var Enkorth with a big Sunspear?

I think we now know why evil citadels always have brooding cloud cover, and 
why Dark Lord-type sorcerers only come out after dark...


>> The Law Rune wasn't in RQ2. It is not a common Theyalan Rune

> But it's one of Lhankor Mhy's runes... Orlanth's Lawspeaker isn't
> _that_ uncommon...

Where I come from (Greydog Village), we use the Stasis rune for this. After 
all, our Law Rock doesn't have a pointy top...

More seriously, I think LhM has the Law rune when in "Scientific" mode (at 
the great libraries of the Holy Country) or when viewed as Guardian of the 
Stone Scrolls (the Great Compromise, using the Invisible God == Compromise 
theory), but the Stasis rune when revered as the keeper of tradition -- 
lawspeaker and mnemonic reciter of histories and genealogies.

I don't think most Theyalans would recognise a Law rune if they saw one.

_____________________________
Geoff Gunner mourns his Wyrm:

> I'll get that bugger Halgrim yet, just see if I don't ...

Two words in your ear: "Grendel's Mother". There's something even nastier, 
even more malevolent out there -- and she's *really* pissed at Halgrim.

====
Nick
====

---------------------

From: watson@computing-science.aberdeen.ac.uk (Colin Watson)
Subject: various stuff
Message-ID: <9311181739.AA10312@condor>
Date: 18 Nov 93 17:39:35 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2371

_________
Sandy sez:
>Law and Chaos are not Powers because in Glorantha they are not opposites.  

Ah, thanks for clearing this up.

I wonder what a God tied to both the Law *and* Chaos runes would be like?
Something like Judge Death I guess: The Law is broken by the living; so all
the living must be destroyed. (Is there such a deity already?)

_____
Joerg on scenarios:
>Well, some game constructs in Gloranthan Mythology allow us to exchange 
>Humakt for Yanafal Tarnils, Irripi Ontor for Lhankor Mhy, etc., but if 
>there would be a Yelmalio or Pole Star worshipper with Humakti magic, 
>or Dayzatar as Solar Lhankor Mhy (only), I feel abused. Or otherwise 
>there will be characters with magic not available in their culture 
>(City Harmony among Praxians?).

NPC spell lists only really have to include those spells which they are likely
to cast during the scenario. If the plot requires that the NPC casts City
Harmony then, fair enough, it's essential to list it; but in this case you
obviously have a highly constrained plot. Exotic spells are all very
colourful, but a scenario is unlikely to live or die by them. I don't think
a scenario is going to be improved by having exhaustive lists of NPC spells
which are never going to be cast.
Anyway, if I don't like the spells an NPC has I find it the easiest thing
in the world to ignore them (or substitute them). eg. I don't like Sever
Spirit or Resurrect so any NPC Humakti & Chalana-Arroyans lose 'em.

>Where is the scenario which tells the story of the rival 
>inside one's own cult who keeps intriguing against the PC with the 
>priest? Also a generic plot, but to flesh it out, lots of information 
>is needed.

Indeed, this is a classic plot: but to write it you really have to have a
specific PC in mind. More detailed background on cult structures would help;
also sample temple layouts & cultists stats. This kind of thing would be
nice in a sourcebook. Ah, a sourcebook for each cult... I'll keep dreaming.

>All I have seen are Cameos, each and any to be heavily edited by the 
>GM. I have to agree with Nick that a fully fleshed out scenario has to 
>work without more effort than reading it before, at least for a certain 
>situation.

Ok, my plot suggestions were cameos. This is due to lack of time & bandwidth.
Add location & character descriptions, stats and a few more pages of subplot
and you'll have a scenario. Then the GM can add his own background as and if
required.
I tend to find that *any* scenario needs a fair degree of work to prepare
to run it. I usually read "ready to run scenarios" at least twice before
running them and the more detail they have the more I have to read. Now,
it's not that I don't enjoy a good read, but time reading is time spent not
playing. And then I find that it's not really ready to run for *my* campaign
and *my* PCs at all. So I modify it...
...or I start a new campaign with new PCs (which is my intention for RoC).

>Do you want ready to run scenarios, or just cameos, which can easily be 
>fitted into any ongoing campaign?

I'd like ready to run scenarios which can easily be fitted into any ongoing
campaign. Am I being difficult? :-)

____________
David Dunham writes about Sunspear:

>This kind of destroys the premise of Griffin Island. Wouldn't Hilme priest
>Taklong Woodheart have long ago hit the evil sorcerer Halcyon var Enkorth
>with a big Sunspear?

Maybe Halcyon doesn't go outdoors on sunny days. ;-)
But seriously, hasn't he strengthened his Hit Points to counter such a threat?
(I assume that Sunspear doesn't ignore the extra HP). I think if Taklong was
a serious threat then he wouldn't be allowed to live within a thousand clicks
of HvE, let alone 100m.

____________
Geoff Gunner writes about  Unhelpful players:
>Halgrim the miserable, no-good, low-down neo-prophet runs in heroically,
>criticals the thing to the chest with his great-sword delivering 25-odd points
>of damage. Shriek-writhe-screech-thwump. 

I know a guy like that. He has these amazing dice which always seem to pull
out a crit whenever a big monster turns up. A great guy to have in your party.
As a GM you just have to laugh along with the PCs when he nails yet another
sea-serpent.
My advice is to use lots of small beasties rather than one humongous
critical-attractor.

Funniest crit I ever saw was when we were pseudo-HeroQuesting to find a
gateway into Hell. The gate was guarded by a Dwarven stronghold and we had
to petition the aid of a Dragon who was the ancient enemy of these dwarves.
The Dragon was a particularly large version of the standard Monster Book
variety (iron scales, fiery breath etc). We happened to have a Jelmre stone
which would triple the strength of any creature it struck...
So we used it to boost the strength of the Dragon. It was awesome.
Off he flew to massacre the stunties and we followed on foot.
So, there was the dragon bearing down on the walls of the fortress. The
dwarves had a couple of ballistae, but, we thought, even if they did hit
the dragon they couldn't knock him out of the sky.
Wrong!
01 in the head. The bolt flew straight into the dragon's eye and killed it
stone dead.  Oh, how we laughed.
The beast crashed through the walls flattening a large section, and while
the stunties were celebrating we stole through the breach before the dust
had settled.
We never really liked that dragon anyway...

___
CW.