Bell Digest v931124p1

From: RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RQ Digest Maintainer)
To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Daily automated RQ-Digest)
Reply-To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RuneQuest Daily)
Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Wed, 24 Nov 1993, part 1
Precedence: junk

X-RQ-ID: Intro

This is the RuneQuest Daily Bulletin, a mailing list on
the subjects of Avalon Hill's RPG and Greg Stafford's 
world of Glorantha.  It is sent out once per day in digest

More details on the RuneQuest Daily and Digest can be found
after the last message in this digest.


From: STEVEG@ARC.UG.EDS.COM (Steve Gilham Entropy requires no maintenance)
Subject: Seeing the Block
Message-ID: <01H5N0EBI89E006T73@UG.EDS.COM>
Date: 22 Nov 93 19:33:38 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2402

>I'm pleased to learn that the Block is 2 km tall and 500m on a 
>side.  Can any of the math wizards tell us how far away it could 
>be seen on Earth?

Distance to horizon ~ root(radius of earth * height * 2)

so for a 2m man, ~ 5km
for a 2km Block ~ 160km

total ~100 miles.


From: (Thom Baguley)
Subject: The Block
Message-ID: <9311231231.AA25941@Sun.COM>
Date: 23 Nov 93 11:07:19 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2403

>From: (Mark Sullivan -- Michigan Library Consortium)
>>  The Block
>>  This giant rectilinear block of rock, 500m on a side and 2km tall...

>Thanks, Mark! Mt Rainier is about 4.4 km tall, and I could barely see that
>from Othello. So the Block is probably not visible from anywhere it'd be
>obscured by mountains (i.e. most of Sartar).

I looked at Elder Secrets over the weekend ... according that source the block
is approximately cube shaped and almost 2km long on each side. At least the
height is constant .... ;-)



From: STEVEG@ARC.UG.EDS.COM (Steve Gilham Entropy requires no maintenance)
Subject: Re: Balance of the Sexes
Message-ID: <01H5N04FVHC2007JUX@UG.EDS.COM>
Date: 22 Nov 93 19:25:41 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2404

Sandy says
>I feel that Glorantha is probably the most accepting of females 
>of  any roleplaying world made. Look at the various pantheons 
>and arrays in GoG. 

I say : just look at the actual balance of males & females of 
importance in the Glorantha book.  This tells a *very* different 
story.  For example, the important women of the Lunar Empire 
happen all to be of the Imperial line w/the blood of the Red Moon 
in their veins.  Solar dominated Pent is actually the most 
balanced so far as important females as a proportion of the 
important folk!

I say : just look at the balance on male over female (even 
discounting the gender-free) gods in "Gods of Glorantha"

I say : just look at the post-hoc rationalisation about the "King 
of the Trolls" in Sazdorf.


From: (C. Hartley Data Processing Division)
Subject: Bat killing again
Message-ID: <9311231256.AA27002@Sun.COM>
Date: 23 Nov 93 12:56:28 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2405

I was pleasantly surprised to see that other groups want to get the Crimson Bat

I also liked the idea of going for the Cult and thereby putting it out of
control. However, I can't help thinking that the Storm Khan PC in my group
would not accept that. It seems to actually make the Chaos worse rather
than better. Unless, of course, it was clear that the Emperor would not
then step in   to ensure the destruction of the Bat.

I guess this is the crux really. The PCs are of rebel spirit but have no
fixed ties with rebel groups and are therefore more interested in the
Bat from a Chaos killing/glory point of view than part of a concerted
rebellion. Maybe I should be at least giving them the opportunity to get
involved in such things.

Do other people relate anti-Lunar and Cultic activities? What I mean is,
do you good people have Cultic policies against the Empire that could
actually become orders to Cult members ? Maybe this is well documented
somewhere but I'ld like to hear views and rationalisations. I think
it would not be too harsh to order Orlanth/Storm Bull Rune Levels
to aid opposition groups. These orders would come from High Priest
level, or some kind of council as appropriate.

Does anyone do this sort of thing? What Cults are considered suitable
to behave in this way?



End of Message


From: (Allan Henderson)
Subject: What is Credo ?
Message-ID: <>
Date: 23 Nov 93 13:07:29 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2406


Please fogive my ignorance but what is Credo ?

So far I have worked out that it is a game from Chaosium, and that Chris Gidlow
has a copy, but I have seen nothing that says what it is.

So a review and release dates in the UK would be appreciated.


From: (Allan Henderson)
Subject: Climbing Wintertop Mountain
Message-ID: <>
Date: 23 Nov 93 13:21:13 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2407

Good People,

>(Mark Sullivan -- Michigan Library Consortium)

>If it is two kilometers tall it doesn't compare with Wintertop's 12
>(please say it's a typo) kilometers [from p61 of Genertela Book, GoG]. I
>mean just how high *is* the atmosphere?  That there middle air must go up
>pretty damn high or those Shakers are breathing with oxygen tanks. 

I know that 12Km sounds a lot but Mt. Everest is 8.9Km high and humun beings
can climb that without Oxygen in tanks. If life is designed to go up that high
(or spends a lot of time acclimatising) then life on earth can live up to 21,000
feet. Nothing else lives at this altitude so there is no need for people to go 
to this height. In reality the problem of oxygen is normally superceded by the 
problems of extreme cold, and very high winds.

Which bring me to how to make an adventure of players climbing Wintertop.
This is a fantasy world so let the player climb to the top without worrying 
about oxygen, which they can do very little about. You can quite freely worry
them with any of the following above the snow line:

1) Bedevil them with frost bite. Any extermities encased in metal, or unprotected
   will take damage for example 0.5 points per hour, until they get warmed up. 
   I estimate that 5 points of damage is worth a finger or toe. 

2) Hurricane force winds. If they attempt to do anything during a storm
   then excessive application of the knockback rules should see them dig in 

3) Impenetrable mists or white outs. The air need not be calm for a pea soup
   fog to decend on a mountain. If vision is impared then "we go up" is not 
   smart. It is very easy to get lost, and just as easy to find yourself 
   trapped on a spurr from the main mountain.

4) Got them pinned down for a few days, good. Now spring the "your water is 
   frozen and you're running low on food". Above the tree line there 
   is little or no fuel for fires, so a long cold night is in store. Eating snow 
   for water is not good for you, but it is better than dying of thirst.

5) Throw in the odd monster at inconvenient times. Sylphs are fun on ridges, and
   mountain trolls digging into your snow hole are a real scream at night.

Some DM tips for running this :

1) Check the eqipment lists carefully. Arguements like "But of course I would 
   have brought fur lined waterproof boots" cut no ice with me. In the real world
   people die every week on mountains because they thought they wouldn't need
   any fancy equipment.

2) Make sure that you know who is tied to who at all times. This can make for 
   interesting role playing. 

3) Just when all hope/food/fuel is gone have the players find a snare with a 
   mountain hare in it, or an adventure frozen for decades with a pack 
   of firewood and an ignite matrix. Most of all give them hope, have the clouds 
   part briefly showing them the summit, or a dream of the safe end to the 
Movement rates are 3 miles or 2000 feet (650m) of ascent per hour, with no more
than 8 hours per day spent moving.  

Why would people climb Wintertop ?. I think that religious reasons are best
elivation to Runelord, atonement etc. There may be something at the top of Winter
top, a temple, a means to enter the hero plane, who knows ?. 

>STEVEG@ARC.UG.EDS.COM (Steve Gilham) 
>impressive than the little hills dotting the British Isles.

Steve you can come climbing with me some day in the Scottish mountains. 
As they say "size isn't everything")

	Bye Y'all
	       	 Allan Henderson


From: ECZ5RAR@MVS.OAC.UCLA.EDU (Anthony Ragan)
Subject: Syndic's Ban
Message-ID: <9311231613.AA19570@Sun.COM>
Date: 23 Nov 93 16:13:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2408

Hi all,

I've seen many references to the Syndics' Ban.  But I can't find any
explanation as to who these Syndics themselves were.  So.....who were
the Syndics and why did they lay this ban down on western Genertela?

  Rune Chia Pet of Ernalda -OR-


From: staats@MIT.EDU (Richard C. Staats)
Subject: Divine Interventions (DI's), One GM's Spin on Things
Message-ID: <9311231642.AA09229@MIT.EDU>
Date: 23 Nov 93 10:39:47 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2409


        I have always treated the DI's as varying in both capability and 
form from cult to cult.  So, although one cult may allow a d10 roll for 
a runelord, it does not follow that another cult would in my campaign.  
Some specific examples of DI's might help.

        It would be perfectly reasonable for an Orlanth initiate to make 
a DI to teleport his band out of some danger (or into it).  Likewise, a 
Storm Bull initiate might be get a DI to grant him/her some particular 
immunity to a chaos creature for a limited period of time.

        On the other hand, a Death Lord would almost certainly not get a 
DI to resurrect someone, just as a Chalana Arroy cultist would not get a 
DI to sever a character's spirit.

        As to the question of how do you prevent 10% of a dying force 
from DI'ing itself back to life...there are a couple of ways.  I would 
not allow most cults to have their members be DI'd back to life (*never* 
with Humakti).  Also, most ancient battles did not end with the forces 
being obliterated; that is a recent "innovation".  Most battles ended 
when one group fell into absolute disorder and was either captured, 
routed off the field of battle, or just surrendered.  In the 
extraordinary circumstances one finds in Glorantha where heroes are 
fighting Chaos for the very survival of the world, there are most likely 
more fatalities as folks would probably fight to the death against some 
vile Chaos spawn (*phew*  *phew*) rather than surrender and be eaten.  
In these cases, the gods and goddesses are no doubt kind and grant DI's 
to heroes to allow them to keep fighting, but in a typical battle 
between tribe "A" and tribe "B" out on the Prax, it is unlikely that 
there are many life saving DI's.

        Hope you find this helpful!

        In service,



Subject: 8k
Message-ID: <>
Date: 23 Nov 93 18:25:15 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2410

Each installment of RQ daily which I receive is cutoff abruptly at about 8k. 
Am I missing more thanjust a few words or lines?


From: (Paul Reilly)
Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Mon, 22 Nov 1993, part 1
Message-ID: <>
Date: 23 Nov 93 18:47:41 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2411

  Paul here.

>This quote implies that the Lunar Army uses 64 man units.
>Is there any particular reason to create a different model
>for the Lunar Army?

  We've been using forty-nine man units in our campaign for more than
ten years... my comments on army organization are based on what we
did, long before SUn County came out.  Seven seems a more logical base
for the Lunar organization than eight.

  Dwarf units in our campaign are organized around an eight-dwarf squad.
Ten is heretical...

 - Paul Reilly


From: (Paul Reilly)
Subject: Lunar Armies
Message-ID: <>
Date: 23 Nov 93 18:52:34 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2412

  Paul continuing...

>  Seems like the regiment (chiliarchia) is the right size for
>  a Dragon Pass game Lunar regiment.  If the Sun County Templar
>  organization is typical of traditional Yelmic military i.e.
>  Dara Happan organization, perhaps the Lunar Army (with its Dara
>  Happan influence) has this same organization.  The military mind
>  is typically very traditional and its hard to see a change in
>  the army structure just to get a seven in the TOE.  If the army
>  structure is working (i.e. Dara Happan style hopolites) why
>  mess with it?

  If you look back in my original comments you'll see that I believe
that the Dara Happan units are still organized in the traditional
way (of course in our campaign this was decimal, like the Mongols, rather
than octal.)  However the new regiments organized by the various Daughters,
i.e., Yara Aranis, Hwarin Dalthippa, etc. are on the new organization (7's).
As you say if something is working why change it but I would say that
in the period during which Sheng Seleris was sacking the Moon the army
structure would perhaps not be best described as "working" very well.
 - Paul R.


From: (Sandy Petersen)
Subject: re: RQ Daily
Message-ID: <>
Date: 23 Nov 93 08:18:25 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2413

Sandy Petersen here

Joerg Baumgartner asks:
>In the description of the Silver Shadow Sultanate/Satrapy it is 

>mentioned that the region basks in the silver shine. Does this mean 

>that tne Red Moon is translucent, and focusses the stars' light onto 

>the crater, after filtering out the red glow it sends out?
>And how high is the Crater, how high above it is the moon?

The Silver Shadow sultanate is where the moon blocks out the sun's  
light. Presumably, since the sun circles Glorantha while the moon  
stays still, this is primarily a magic effect. Either that, or the  
eclipse only happens at noon. 

The Crater's surface is, in fact, on the moon itself. There's a magic  
connection between the two.

>this is not different from how they trade the oasis folk, only the  
>oasises (sp?) are bigger, and wealthier.

The plural of "oasis" is "oases" (pronounced oh-way-seize).

>The statement that the Hungry Plateau sables moved there in the Dawn 

>Age makes them mercenaries of the Theyalan First Council,  
>participating in the Battle of Argentium Thri'ile (Dorastor p. 7:  
>"Instrumental in the battle were the Praxian animal riders, whose  
>leaders received grants of land in Peloria and began several  
>dynasties of Pelorian animal-riders."), and maybe a second wave in  
>the wake of Arkat's human allies who scoured Peloria while the hero  
>and his troll allies scorched Aggar, Talastar and Dorastor (Vorwaha  
>Bisonlord, Dorastor p.13). This would make most "native" Pelorian  
>nobility Praxian in descent, I'd suppose - Duke Raus has just gone  
>back to the roots. Any takers?

"Several dynasties" of animal-riders does not make most Pelorian  
nobility Praxian in background, though several are, as already  
pointed out. Only the Hungry Plateau sable riders have managed to  
keep any of their ancestral ways. I don't think that the armies  
accompanying Arkat founded any dynasties. They were just invaders and  
raiders, not conquerors. On the other hand, in the EWF's wars against  
the Dara Happan Tripolis, they may well have used Praxian  

re: Tada

Tada's Golden Age people were pretty much all wiped out during the  
Darkness. Their allies in the war on Chaos have now inherited their  
ancient land -- the beast riders. The oasis people might possibly  
represent the last traces of Tada's folk. Perhaps the reason they're  
so spiritless and inferior is because of the destruction of their  
god, who gave them their strength. 

Nick Brooke asks:
>What animals do Argrath's Praxian secret societies (Bullocks, Twin  
>Spears and Sword Brothers) ride?

They are cross-tribal societies. Of course, the various tribal  
contingents would stick together.


From: 100270.337@CompuServe.COM (Nick Brooke)
Subject: Enemies Without Friends
Message-ID: <931123201654_100270.337_BHB66-1@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 23 Nov 93 20:16:54 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2414

Joerg asked:

> Where else than in the Dragon Pass Ruins, the Rubble and the City of 
> 10,000 Magicians in Aggar are we likely to find EWF artifacts?

The EWF at its height spread along the whole body of their Great Genertelan 
Dragon: its wings were the Rockwoods (East and West), its spine the Oslir 
(they took over the Dara Happan Empire for a time), its head in Dragon Pass 
(with a fire-breathing mouth at the Vent, and its Eye at ... you got it!). 
In other words, they didn't have the bits of Peloria that were neither 
highlands nor river valleys, but scooped up most of the rest. So I'd 
imagine you could find EWF artifacts throughout that range: from the Elder 
Wilds across to Brolia, with some ancient sites in the midst of the great 
cities of Dara Happa (but not Alkoth) -- though I imagine these would have 
been very thoroughly trashed and looted by now. The True Golden Horde 
didn't leave much standing...

> If any adventurer party wants to play a part in the upcoming Hero Wars,
> quest for these artifacts, and deliver them into the focus of fighting, 
> Sartar.

Might be stiff competition from that Garrath Sharpsword in Pavis... I think 
he's got pretty much the same idea.

> Does that draconic school in Nochet (Glorantha Book p.19) still exist
> (at least in ruins)? Where is that Drolgard cult situated? Where can
> one contact Orlaront Dragonfriend?

Maybe, nowhere, and dunno. I'm sure the school isn't still functioning, but 
you can find all kinds of odd things in Nochet if you look (a bit like 
Lankhmar or Ankh-Morpork in that respect). The Cult of Drolgard surely had 
its forked tongue gouged out at the time of the Draconic betrayal of the 
EWF, when people forgot how to talk to dragons. Orlaront would be on the 
Hero Plane somewhere, perhaps in a dragonrest (or maybe even as a Dragon, 
by now?). We're pretty sure Argrath made friends with him.

> And what kind of Malkioni were those from Nochet? How many were there? 
> How important was their bishop in city politics? How important is he 
> now? Is it Nochet where the highest religious authority of the Trader 
> Princes of Maniria lies, or is it Ralios?

My theory: they're a peculiar old-style sect of pacifist white-robed types 
who live in the catacombs beneath the city and still defend some ancient 
secrets entrusted to them by Arkat the Conquerer at the end of the First 
Age. Their bishop *was* important a while ago, maybe, but is now pretty 
well removed from the official centres of power. I use them like the early 
Christians in Rome ('round about Nero's time): good for rioting against or 
persecuting, and with oodles of secret converts and recognition-signs.

The Issarian sect of the Trader Princes would probably be centred around 
their mercantile hub at Venice -- sorry, that's Handra -- but would be 
pretty decentralised in any case. Not related to the Nochet sect (except 
insofar as they're all Malkioni together, for what that's worth), though 
they'd certainly have trade missions with accompanying church officials.



From: (Carl Fink)
Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Tue, 23 Nov 1993, part 2
Message-ID: <>
Date: 23 Nov 93 16:02:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2415 (Geoff Gunner) writes:

R>Wyrms - I'd have put them at a stage PAST dragonewts; perhaps those dragonewt
 >who have left the Wheel but still have some earthly ties to work off ?
 >Sort of a 'practice dragon' stage.

  Published material says that they're screwed up dragonewts, who tried
to "cheat" the progression from Scout to Inhuman King, and are now
stuck, unable to progress or change their status at all.

100270.337@CompuServe.COM (Nick Brooke) writes:

R>I don't know anything about Toon. But Boggles are a Disorderly race, not
 >"just" spirits (though, given their basic nature, they probably *can* be
 >spirits -- or anything else -- from time to time). There's a Castle of
 >Boggles on top of the Plateau of Statues, but I can't honestly recommend
 >the decor or cuisine. There's a myth of the Boggles in WF#5 (Celestial
 >Court myths), which ought to be in Wyrms Footprints when that happens, and
 >some stuff about them in the Prosopaedia (under Ratslaff, I think). They
 >mostly work for Uleria, these days, but obviously wouldn't be committed to

  I don't agree -- I quite enjoyed my dinner with the Boggles of the
Plateau.  Of course, this was only a week or so after My Dinner With
Ralzakark, so perhaps the contrast made the boggles seem homely.