Bell Digest v940203p5

From: RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RQ Digest Maintainer)
To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Daily automated RQ-Digest)
Reply-To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RuneQuest Daily)
Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Thu, 03 Feb 1994, part 5
Content-Return: Prohibited
Precedence: junk


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From: mabeyke@batman.b11.ingr.com (boris)
Subject: RQ Auction on rec.games.frp.forsale
Message-ID: <199402021920.AA02719@batman.b11.ingr.com>
Date: 2 Feb 94 19:20:17 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2992


   I think this will interest some here, anyway.  For those who don't ever
   look at rec.games.frp.marketplace, someone is currently auctioning off
   a bunch of RQ2 stuff.  Here is the posting.

vvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvbegin included textvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvvv
Newsgroups: rec.games.frp.marketplace
From: uf395@freenet.Victoria.BC.CA (Jeff Johnson)
Subject: Runequest 2 & Other Chaosium Things Auction
Date: Mon, 31 Jan 1994 02:55:19 GMT

I have plundered my friends and acquaintances one last time to 
round up enough items for yet another auction of RQ 2nd edition 
material.Some non-RQ stuff by Chaosium is included as well. 
Auction rules are after the item list. 

----------------------------------------------------------------
RQ 2 Material

Pavis [No Bid]
Mint condition.
Boxed campaign set detailing the city of New Pavis, with several
adventures including the epic 'The Cradle'.

Cults of Prax [No Bid]
Very good condition, but original owner's name in ink on inside
cover. Book with complete cult details of a dozen deities 
common to Prax. A milestone RPG supplement with a true feel 
for mythology and religion.

Cults of Terror [No Bid]
Mint condition.
Book of evil and Chaotic cults, including the dreaded Thanatar
headhunters and Malia plague-spreaders.

RuneQuest Companion [No Bid]
Average condition; small tear on cover and some wear.
Book with eclectic mix of Gloranthan material, including a solo
adventure and extensive background info.

RuneQuest Foes - copy #1 [No Bid]
Excellent condition.
Book with detailed encounter stats for most of the monsters in 
the RuneQuest 2nd edition rules.

RuneQuest Foes - copy #2 [No Bid]
Excellent condition, but original owner's name in ink on the 
inside cover.

Gateway Bestiary [No Bid]
Excellent condition.
Book of non-Gloranthan monsters for the RuneQuest game.

Snakepipe Hollow [No Bid]
Excellent condition.
RQ adventure in a notorious Chaos nest. 
This is the 1981 edition (green cover).

Creatures of Chaos 1 - Scorpion Men & Broos [No Bid]
Excellent condition, but with price sticker marks on cover.
List of encounter stats for - you guessed it - scorpion men 
and broos.

Plunder [No Bid]
Excellent condition, but has a price sticker mark on fron cover.
Pregenerated lists of treasure and magic items.

Wyrm's Footnotes #12 (Vol II # 2) [No Bid]
Good condition, but has price sticker and some staining on front
cover. Articles on Agimori, Storm Pantheon, Divine Intervention,
the Lunar governor Fazzur Wideread, and more.

Wyrm's Footnotes #13 (Vol II # 3) [No Bid]
Excelent condition. Articles on the Third Wane, spirit combat,
and the Orlanth pantheon.

Duck Pond (Judges' Guild) [No Bid]
Excellent condition.
RQ adventure, sequel to Duck Tower. Written by Paul Jaquays.

Broken Tree Inn (Judges' Guild) [No Bid]
Good condition, but price sticker and sticker marks on cover. 
Another Paul Jaquays RQ adventure.

Non-RQ Material

Stormbringer [No Bids]
Excellent condition.
Original edition of the RPG now called 'Elric'. A boxed set.

Elric, Battle at the End of Time [No Bids]
Excellent condition.
Multi-player board game of the battle for control of the world
of Michael Moorcock's Young Kingdoms.

Thieves' World [No Bids]
A boxed set with city maps, descriptions, and multi-system stats
for the city of Sanctuary, from the Thieves' World anthologies.

All the World's Monsters [No Bids]
Very good condition.
A 'monster manual' of unique critters for D&D-style games.

Lords of the Middle Sea [No Bids]
Very good condition.
Multi-player fantasy board game.
----------------------------------------------------------------

The rules for this auction are :

1. All bids are in US$ and must be in whole dollar amounts.    
   Conditional bids are accepted. A winning conditional bid is 
   adjusted downwards to a value of $1 more than the 
   next-highest bid.    Conditional bids are marked with an 
   asterisk in email updates.

2. Bids do not include postage and handling, which is extra.    
   Postage for boxed items: $6/$4.50 US to the USA/Canada.
   Postage for 1 or 2 modules: $4/$3 US to the USA/Canada.
   Overseas/Europe costs are higher.

3. Payment in advance via postal money order only (exceptions 
   made for overseas orders); no cheques.

4. Bids will be accepted until midnight February 15, PST.

5. Regular updates will be conducted via email on W/F/Su.    
   Only email updates will include the bidders' names. There
   will be several Usenet updates as well, which will include 
   current high bids but not names (to provide some privacy).

PLEASE INCLUDE A VALID EMAIL ADDRESS WITH ANY BID, to which the
email updates will be sent, especially if you are using a 
different account than normal.
 
Jeff Johnson
uf395@freenet.victoria.bc.ca

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^end included text^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

   I hope this is of some help to those looking for those rare items.
----
   Boris

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From: ROBERTSON@delphi.intel.com (Roderick Robertson, SC1-5, x52936)
Subject: Pentan Sun Gods, Polestar
Message-ID: <3F59F2626001D21A@delphi.intel.com>
Date: 2 Feb 94 18:33:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2993

Nick said (regarding Pole Star)

>I like to imagine a Polaris-worshipping general having Star-worshipping 
>captains under him. Like his deity, he stands in the centre and directs. 
>They move, obedient to his command and design. This way, "Initiates" of 
>Polaris would in fact worship other stars under his command (that's the 
>ordinary officers). The Rune Lords (Generals) would be the true Polaris 
>worshippers.
>
>I may be playing one this weekend, so I'll let you know what happens.


  Let's not forget the other 'domain' of Pole Star, Castle building. In
the Redlands, I'd assume that Polarin (Polarisan? Polaroi?) engineers
would be much in demand, and specialist units of field engineers 
accompany each Lunar army to make forts (I assume that the regular Army 
makes nightly palisades like the Romans). 

   I can see a whole sub-set of stars in the Polaris 'Pantheon', The 
Lieutenant's Star of Archery, The Captain's Star of Cavalry, etc. Each is 
a seperate star worshipped by a single rank and branch of Service. As 
you are promoted you change the Star you worship (or maybe as you rise 
in cult status, you get promoted?). 

   Mindspeech and Glamour would be a natural for all stars (all ranks),
'Branch' stars would also teach spells for their specialty (Archer stars
teach arrow magics, Swordsman stars teach Bladesharps, etc). Rune Spells
would tend more towards Command and Control types - Lower 'rank' stars
have spells for co-ordinating squads or platoons, Higher rank stars can
control regiments or brigades, Polaris teaches Army level spells. Battle
and Leadership skills are taught, along with the weapons/skills of the 
branch of service. (Social Skills? An Officer AND a Gentleman?)



>As I think I've mentioned, the Grazers consider Yelm to be worship of an
>incomplete portion of the original Sun ("it don't mean a thing if it ain't
>got that swing" -- the Dara Happan Yelm doesn't include the Movement rune
>of Yu-Kargzant). Yu-Kargzant worship combines that portion with the deity
>once known as Kargzant the Nomad, and is thus obviously a much better
>deity.

   I'm not so sure that Kargzant *has* the movement rune anymore - He 
was chained by Orlanatus, and the sun no longer careens around the sky. 
Perhapse this cut down on other movement abilities of the Nomads (Could
the Pentans fly before? Did Kargzant have Teleport type powers?) Gotta 
re-read the GRoY to figure out which group had the Bird-Cavalry.

Well, enough babbling,
Roderick Robertson

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From: gstafford@aol.com
Subject: address
Message-ID: <9402021756.tn41195@aol.com>
Date: 2 Feb 94 22:56:20 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2994

Henk, I have lost your address.
Please e-mail it to me so I can send you a copy of Glorious ReAscent.

- g

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From: eosgg@raesp-farn.mod.uk (Geoff Gunner)
Subject: An illuminating riddle
Message-ID: <9402022237.AA28334@raesp-farn.mod.uk>
Date: 2 Feb 94 22:37:01 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2995

Geoff Gunner here.

Riddlers (illuminates) are likely to be  welcomed into most societies.  Without
the joys of the TV, people make their own entertainment.  Asking riddles
is a standard thing.  A riddler, intent on spreading the riddles, will go
and learn lots of normal ones, and slip the trick questions into the flow.
I don't know when the 'victim' would twig they've been illuminated - I don't
think it's an 'a-ha!' thing, more a gradual realisation that your old values
are a hollow mockery (or whatever).  So a few days to weeks, perhaps, before
the effects make themselves fully knowm.

On diseases: a most vexing issue.  Don't like the current rules; don't like my
own replacements.  The trick is to get something that has a big effect initially
but then goes away (or death occurs), leaving perhaps permanent effects such
as loss of INT etc.  IMHO the afflicted should have most of their (CON ? FP ?
STR ? ) wiped out for the duration of the average disease.

Anyway, in the meantime this is what I currently use, which is a bit less
arbitrary than the normal rules.  It's a variation on spirit combat.
Your disease (lets take the Shakes) has a Virulence (rolled on 3D6 - higher
than 15 is pretty nasty).
The character gets exposed to the disease (gripe 1: automatic infection ?
CON * 5 ?) and contracts it.  The disease has an 'effect time'; the period
between rolls.  The victim matches CON vs. VIR, sucess gives -1D3 to it's VIR.
The disease matches VIR vs. CON; sucess and the victim looses 1D3 DEX (or
whatever you define the diseases effects to be).  A special means that 1 point
of this is permanent.

I've found this gives reasonably good durations - after all, most diseases have
some sort of standard lifetime.  But effects still aren't right.

The attribute-like VIR makes adjusting for things like being in bed, tended by
healers, etc, fairly easy to rule on; just add or subtract from either the
CON resistance or attack.

Anyway; sleep beckons.  Geoff.  (szzzzzz)

---------------------

From: carlf@panix.com (Carl Fink)
Subject: Whoops
Message-ID: <199402030106.AA13823@panix.com>
Date: 2 Feb 94 15:06:27 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2996

sandyp@idcube.idsoftware.com (Sandy Petersen) writes in part:

>Carl Fink claims:


>> The Vadeli and Veldang are the same race -- note that the "missing"
>>caste of the Vadeli are blueskinned.  Greg's unpublished "Lunar
>>Book" mentions the conquest of Peloria by blueskins in the God Time.

>I'm not so sure. Mere possession of blue skin is not enough to make
>you racially identical -- the Veldang never, as far as I know, had
>brown or red-skinned racial members, and the Vadeli never conquered
>Peloria -- the God Time conquerors of Peloria were undoubtedly
>Veldang from the Blue Moon. IMO, the Veldang and Vadeli are not the
>same race at all, and only a heroquest to prove otherwise would
>enable the Vadeli to utilize Veldang as their Lords.

>        Note that the red and brown Vadeli have in fact encountered
>Veldang (in Fonrit), and did not appear to recognize them in any way
>as their missing caste.


>So there.

  But I write:

R>  Sandy *told* me this...

  Apparently I remember incorrectly.  Sorry about that.  So why DO those
people on Teleos have all those skin colors?
  

---------------------

From: 100270.337@CompuServe.COM (Nick Brooke)
Subject: One True World?
Message-ID: <940203043642_100270.337_BHB50-1@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 3 Feb 94 04:36:43 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2997

_______________
Joerg appended:

> I like the philosophical implications of this:
> The only way the Red Moon embodies Law is when Dying.
> For the Red Moon, the Compromise is to die.

 Nice one! I hadn't generalised it quite so far, but something like that 
would explain how the Lunar Goddess sees herself as a revitalising force in 
a stagnant cosmos.

________________
Bryan burst out:

> This sort of priviliged knowledge one-true-worldism is one of the
> things that really irks me and really irked a few newcomers to
> Glorantha whom I had recently introduced to RQ.  Either all the
> information should be freely available or people should stop
> preaching "corrections" from sources that cannot be had, even in
> facsimile.

Not a "correction", Bryan. Just mentioning an odd fact.

I enjoyed what you wrote, and would prefer to see things done that way. It 
was an entertaining, interesting and new approach to Lunars & Humakti. My 
reference to the tongueless Humakti beggars of Pavis, mentioned as an one- 
line joke in the old Pavis Pack, was an attempt to remind others of one 
colourful background detail from an old source. I am very sorry to have 
irked you so greatly by mentioning them.

I am also *absolutely* baffled to be accused of one-true-worldism. The only 
way to be a "one-true-worldist" in Glorantha would be never to have any new 
ideas; to base everything on published material; to clear whatever original 
thoughts came up with Those Who Know; and to fear *absolutely* the smallest 
risk of contradicting published/accepted information. Does anybody think I 
do this?

One True Worlding is impossible. I don't do it. Nobody I know or work with 
does it. And that includes all us folk at Tales, and Greg Stafford himself. 
What would a One True Worlder say to Elmal/Yelmalio, eh?

Your exasperation has led you to say something I hope you don't mean. I'm 
not about to start restricting my analysis and examination of Glorantha to 
the lowest, most-recently-published denominator, and think this list would 
become terribly boring if everybody on it did so. I try to drag up old, 
no-longer-available ideas for the *benefit* of guys like you who don't have 
access to them. Often these are one-liners or passing references from older 
sources which resonate surprisingly with more recent thoughts/ideas.

Anyway, that's one of the things I like most about Glorantha.

====
Nick
====

---------------------

From: 100270.337@CompuServe.COM (Nick Brooke)
Subject: Chariots of the Gods
Message-ID: <940203054457_100270.337_BHB21-2@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 3 Feb 94 05:44:58 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2998

(Lost this from my last posting: ho hum. Better resend it now it's back.)
(Oh, BTW, remember those exams I was hassled by last autumn? I passed!!!)

____________
Paul opined:

On the Orlanthi analogues. Celts or Hellenes, what's the difference? 
Everyone out there has read the Iliad and the Tain, right?

> Old Carmania:  I am sure that there is a lot of the 'barbarian warlord'
> strain left in modern Carmanians - it's just hidden under a clever Lunar
> veneer of politeness.  Still nasty down deep.  But even deeper down, you
> find the 'nice' Carmanians of the Light Side.  However, still deeper
> down, they're even nastier than you thought...

That's a very true observation, and things like this (I hope!) will be the 
pay-off at the end of the Carmanian History project. Cultures aren't mono- 
lithic: they evolve and develop. The "Lunarisation" of Carmania in the late 
Empire (last couple of centuries) can only be a veneer over their existing 
beliefs and structures. Hasn't had long enough to go deeper. Of course, as 
many "Lunar" concepts/doctrines came (via Irrippi Ontor, a Carmanian mage, 
and Yanafal Tarnils, a Carmanian nobleman) from Carmania to begin with...

Round and round it goes... (very cyclical).

_____________
MOB informed:

> It also mentions "Vegemite sandwiches", which is where many Americans
> first heard of the stuff. 

I imagine many Americans heard of vomit before meeting Vegemite, though few 
can have met it in such concentrated form...
Oh, that wasn't what you meant? 

====
Nick
====

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From: jjm@zycor.lgc.com (johnjmedway)
Subject: Friends and Citizens of the Empire
Message-ID: <9402030809.AA10429@hp0.zycor.lgc.com>
Date: 3 Feb 94 08:09:28 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 2999

Proclamation from the Office of Luxius Interioris,
	Honored Senator from the City of Alkoth

Friends and Citizens of the Empire,

Stories have been circulated regarding an over abundance of "intelligence"
agents of the Empire, who act in opposition to each other, to the detriment 
of all of us, and the way of the Goddess. Rumors have been passed, telling 
of organizations, with fantastic names, who work for themselves, and not 
for the whole.

Such thoughts are entirely fantasy. There are no large scheming groups,
lurking in the wings, awaiting oportunities to prey on each other, and on
our loyal populace. That is not the way of the Goddess. The servants of the
Goddess in this world are one in thought and deed. We are the instruments
of her wishes. Would one think our Goddess was not of one mind? Of course 
not!

We are here to further her faith - our faith - in this world. To bring 
balance and clarity to the lives and minds of all. Those who see the Lunar
Way, speak the Lunar Way, and live the Lunar Way are our ideals. We must
all strive to live in this way. 

We must help others along this path, by whatever means are appropriate. 
Persons, vigilant in their service to the Empire and our Goddess, who help 
us guide others are our most valuable friends. Others who would impede our 
glorious procession, who attack our Emperor and the Senate with satire and
absurd farce, must be helped to see and understand their error. Once they 
understand, they aid in our mission in this world, as well. Help us guide 
others who would otherwise not be able to travel with us. 

Trust in the Goddess, and her servants, for we know The Way. Give care to 
what rumor you trust. Our enemies are deceitful, and try to sway us from 
our path, with falsehood and inuendo. We must all work together toward our
common goal. Trust in the Goddess, and her servants.

Luxius Interioris,
	Society for the Ascendency of the Red Moon,
	Scimitar of Yanafal Tarnils, 
	General of the Army, Retired.








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