Bell Digest v940212p2

From: RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RQ Digest Maintainer)
To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Daily automated RQ-Digest)
Reply-To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RuneQuest Daily)
Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Sat, 12 Feb 1994, part 2
Content-Return: Prohibited
Precedence: junk


---------------------

From: jpolk@opus.starlab.csc.com (James Polk)
Subject: Red Moon; Polestar
Message-ID: <9402111511.AA20776@opus.starlab.csc.com>
Date: 11 Feb 94 15:11:41 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 3080

Greetings to All.

As a newcomer to Unix, Internet & the RQ Daily, I ask your
indulgence while I get used to this medium. 

-----------------

RQ Con

This convention re-awakened my enthusiasm for RQ & Glorantha. 
After a long association with RQ/Gloranth, I felt depressed over
a perceived stagnation.  Avalon Hill was (is) not doing its job
in publishing sufficient RQ material.  Good material submitted
for publication seemed to lie abandoned. (The Imtherian material
submitted by Harald Smith is a good example.)  So I expected to
have a fun time at the con, but not to come away with any
different opinions.  I was completely WRONG!  Instead, I was
inspired and a number of people, beginning with my wife, are
suffering the consquences.  My thanks goes to David Chen and
everyone else who organized and ran the con.

-----------------

Glorious ReAscent

This is a fascinating book.  I recommend it to anyone with ANY
interest in Glorantha beyond their current campaign(s).  

And speaking of the Gods Wall, has anyone given thought about the
Star Goddess (I-25)?  Does anyone think it might be Yelorna? Does
anyone care?

----------------

The Red Moon

David Dunham replied to Alex F's initial questions:

>My other worry is this: since within the glowline the moon is
always full,
>how are days named?  Are they named according to which phase
_would_ be
>visible, which thus varies from Pasha-thing to Pasha-thing?

This is why I've followed Nick Brooke's advice, and inside the
Glowline,
the moon doesn't look full. It is surrounded by a crimson corona,
much the
same way the Empire is surrounded by the Glowline. (The Glowline
counts as
full moon for spell casting, but doesn't prevent the Lunar
faithful from
seeing the phases.)
-----

I like the idea of the "crimson corona" within the Glowline. 
However, I have trouble with the phases of the moon being
different in different regions within the Glowline.  If that were
so, it would make communication within the Lunar Empire very
difficult.  Think of the difficulties we Americans can have with
time zones.  (Was that 9 am Eastern Standard Time, Eastern
Daylight Savings Time, or Central Time?)  Now think about letters
written across the Empire. (Were we supposed to meet next week on
your Full Moon or mine?) Why would people put up with this
confusion?  I suggest that one of the effects of the Glowline is
to make timing of the lunar phases within the Glowline the same.
That way the Moon is the "same (which was misinterpreted to mean
"always Full") within the Glowline. Outside the Glowline, of
course, the phases would differ according to where one was.  This
way a balance would be achieved between the constant phases
within the Glowline and the changing phases without.

----------------

The White Moon

A number of documents concerning the White Moon have recently
come into my possession. It would appear these documents are
unknown to other Gloranthan scholars, so I have been busy trying
to translate them. In the upcoming months I shall try to publish
as much as I can, given this is not my regular job.  In the
meantime, I would be very interested in learning if anyone else
has documents concerning the White Moon, and, if so, what those
documents say.  (I believe David Gadbois recently wrote a comment
about the White Moon being similar to the Peace Corps.)

----------------

Pole Star (Light, Movement, Harmony)

Nick Brooke has said:

"I like to imagine a Polaris-worshipping general having
Star-worshipping captains under him. Like his deity, he stands in
the centre and directs. They move, obedient to his command and
design. This way, "Initiates" of Polaris would in fact worship
other stars under his command (that's the ordinary officers). The
Rune Lords (Generals) would be the true Polaris worshippers."
-----
How would this work? I suggest that such close coordination is
unlikely without rune magic. (Unless, of course, these people
were Dorsai equivalents.)  Also, why should Rune Lord status be
restricted to generals?

Sandy Petersen has said:

"POLE STAR: this is an officer's cult. In my view, this cult has
only rune lords, no priests or initiates. It does, however, have
lay members, and a Pole-star worshiping officer would normally
require at least his non-coms to worship this cult. He has a
spell that allows him to choreograph the actions and movements of
all of his lay members at once (much as Pole Star choreographs
the star dance). I'm  sure his cult teaches some sort of Tactics
skill."
-----
This sounds to me like a Lunar nobleman's viewpoint of Pole Star.
I think that Pole Star worship is restricted neither to the
military and nor to the aristocracy. See below for some of my
reasons.

Roderick Robertson has said:

  "Let's not forget the other 'domain' of Pole Star, Castle
building. In the Redlands, I'd assume that Polarin (Polarisan?
Polaroi?) engineers would be much in demand, and specialist units
of field engineers accompany each Lunar army to make forts (I
assume that the regular Army makes nightly palisades like the
Romans). ..."

-----
I had not thought about the Engineer aspect of Pole Star. 
Hmmm...

But why does everyone assume the cult of Pole Star is only a
military one?  Any god called the "General of the Hosts of the
Sky" clearly has military aspects.  Any god called "King of the
Firmament" is an aristocrat.  But any god called the "Grandmaster
of Dance" is something more than the sum of the previous two. (By
the way, the titles in quotes were taken from Wyrm's Footnotes,
#10.)  I suspect the answer lies in the fact that Pole Star seems
to have more ties to strong female characters than other
Sky/Light gods.  His sister is Ourania, Queen of Heaven.  His
wife is the goddess of Dance. (I name her Terpsicora.)  Yelorna
(if she existed/still exits) either guided him down to the earth
(during the Great Darkness) or guided the first Star Captains
whom he sent.  If Plentonius the Wise, Scribe of Khordavu, is to
be believed, the Sky/Light gods and their worshippers consider
women of much lesser import than men.  Yet here is a King who
works with his wife, his sister and another female star goddess,
apparently in partnership.  It sounds to me, the modern scholar,
as if the nature of Pole Star changed.  And if so, it is probable
the change occurred when Pole Star became associated with the
Goddess of Dance.  (Could the Goddess of Dance be the mysterious
Star Goddess (I-25) on the Gods Wall?)

Given all this, I posit the worship of Pole Star includes Rune
Lords (Star Lords) AND Rune Priests (Star Priests).  Their
initiates are called Star Warriors and Star Dancers,
respectively.  Although the cult is small, it is one in which a
woman may rise on merit as an equal to any man, at least on the
Rune Priest side. (Presumably, this practice would be seen as an
unnatural one by some other Solarians.)  I suggest that the High
Holy day of Pole Star is the week between Godsdays in the Sacred
Time.  This week is known as High Holy Week, or The Great Dance,
during which all of his worshippers celebrate the creation of the
Celestial Dance.  During this week, the chief Star Priest casts
the Ritual Rune Spell known as Great Dance. This spell recreates
the Celestial Dance of the Sky by making all local worshippers to
move, think and act in harmony and co-operation with each other. 


Finally, I would like inflict upon you a quote from an old
document I translated some years ago.

     When Yelm returned in fiery splendor, Pole Star and
     Terpsicora pondered deeply on how they could combine the
     stability of the old ways with the constant change of the
     new.  After much thought, they marshalled all their powers
     and created the Celestial Dance of the Sky.  In this dance,
     all beings in the Firmament were given paths to follow.
     Nothing remained motionless, and yet all returned again and
     again to the same places. (Even those bodies which appear to
     remain stationary are not truly so.) Thus was the perfect
     harmony of the First Era reconciled with the disorder and
     movement of History. Yelm was so impressed he named Pole
     Star "Grandmaster of the Celestial Dance".


 - James Polk



---------------------

From: forester@elvis.srl.ford.com (Brian Forester)
Subject: Ergot and hallucinogens
Message-ID: 
Date: 11 Feb 94 05:05:08 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 3081


> I suppose that if I can't come up with anything better I'll just make up a
> grain, and say it tastes like Rye but is subtly different (the Carmanians
> would say it tastes a lot better) but still susceptible to Ergot (which is
> just too much fun for the GM to ignore).

> Loren Miller              LOREN@wmkt.wharton.upenn.edu

Are you refering to the fact that certain molds and funguses have hallucinogenic
properties?  I don't remember if it was Ergot or something else.  I think there
was a theory that similarly spoiled grain was the root cause of the Salem witch trials.

Perhaps the dark elves have decided to spread a little bit of chemical help to those
dour humans.

>I also gave them the magic Sphere of Obscene
>Agitation which I just made up, which was a glass ball containing a
>couch and two small dolls. When you shook up the ball, the dolls
>engaged in various carnal acts.
>  Sandy Petersen

A quick thought about the Sphere of Obscene Agitation, perhaps its not quite
as useless as it sounds.  Perhaps it shows certain couples engaging in various
carnel acts.  A real handy device for blackmail.  I don't know anything about
Tekumel but I have gotten the impression that the punishment for various crimes
is quite severe and adultry might fit into that category.


Brian (forester@elvis.srl.ford.com)

"The human race will decree from time to time: 'There is something at
 which it is absolutely forbidden to laugh.'"
                                     Nietzche



---------------------

From: oskaro@rhi.hi.is (Oskar Gunnar Oskarsson)
Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Mon, 07 Feb 1994, part 2
Message-ID: <9402111600.AA01594@hengill.rhi.hi.is>
Date: 11 Feb 94 16:00:27 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 3082


Hey Game Fan!


	I just wondered if you'd be interested in some
	software swapping.

	I.e. games etc.

	I especially like games like DOOM, Wolf3D, Spear, Civilization,
	SimCity 2000 and that sort of "stragety games".

	But I'm always willing to try out some new stuff.

Ps.	Do you have (or have seen) OS2 or Chicago?


					Call me, and we'll do lunch!

					*** NOT A SPA AGENT ***

====================== oskaro@hengill.rhi.hi.is ================================
FAX: +354-1-14558        Oskar G. Oskarsson	   Why are BRUNETTES so easy
between 3-5 p.m. GMT     University of Iceland	   to get into bed?
office phone: 694372	 stud.jur.		   
						   Who CARES???
================================================================================






---------------------

From: oskaro@rhi.hi.is (Oskar Gunnar Oskarsson)
Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Mon, 07 Feb 1994, part 2
Message-ID: <9402111601.AA01665@hengill.rhi.hi.is>
Date: 11 Feb 94 16:01:20 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 3083


Hey Game Fan!


	I just wondered if you'd be interested in some
	software swapping.

	I.e. games etc.

	I especially like games like DOOM, Wolf3D, Spear, Civilization,
	SimCity 2000 and that sort of "stragety games".

	But I'm always willing to try out some new stuff.

Ps.	Do you have (or have seen) OS2 or Chicago?


					Call me, and we'll do lunch!

					*** NOT A SPA AGENT ***

====================== oskaro@hengill.rhi.hi.is ================================
FAX: +354-1-14558        Oskar G. Oskarsson	   Why are BRUNETTES so easy
between 3-5 p.m. GMT     University of Iceland	   to get into bed?
office phone: 694372	 stud.jur.		   
						   Who CARES???
================================================================================






---------------------

From: sandyp@idcube.idsoftware.com (Sandy Petersen)
Subject: re: RQ Daily
Message-ID: <9402111637.AA10267@idcube.idsoftware.com>
Date: 11 Feb 94 04:36:57 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 3084

someone asks (can't be bothered to go back and see who it was): 

>I imagined someone pulling out an Excellent Ruby Eye and freezing a  
>whole roomful of people with a few clicks of a button.  How  would  
>people play this?  In the interest of playability there should be 

>*some* way to avoid the 'sudden death' effect?  In AD&D there would  
>be a saving throw - signifying that someone managed to duck at the 

>right moment.  How is this handled in RQ (he says, revealing his  
>ignorance).

I assign the deadlier Eyes an innate Power rating, and match it vs.  
the target's Power. I also let anti-magic spells defend against the  
Eyes. In addition, certain monsters are simply immune to certain Eyes  
(you can't Sleep undead, frex). 


>So there is other material of this sort available?  Where can one  
>get hold of it?

I'll let others answer this who are more computer-literate than I. I  
predict Loren Miller will let you know.

Someone (Alex Ferguson?) asks:
>Does standing in the shadow of a mountain diminish a lunar magicians  
>abilities? Does staying underground do so?

I play no, allowing the Lunar force to permeate the world. One could  
probably make a case for Wintertop blocking some of the Lunar power,  
seeing as it's Orlanth's birthplace, but it doesn't seem to have  
hindered the Lunars much in their conquest of Sartar. 


>I think that at least some effects ought to be impossible out of  
>sight of the moon. 


The Crater Makers probably can't do anything. Maybe you can't summon  
the Full Moon Guard either. I would say that if this hinders moon  
magic, then they should get an extra bonus when within sight of the  
moon. After all, in most roleplaying areas (i.e., outside the  
Glowline) Lunar magicians are punier than other magicians 4/7 of the  
time. Plus it's harder than heck for them to get elementals. 


>Aw, Sandy, you should have known you can't feed us off with "for  
>instance". What values does a dragonewt need to master a set of  
>traits? A sum of 100? or a certain balance?

Since none of my players ran dragonewts, I never bothered to specify.  
In case anyone ever asked (you, frex) my plan was that the dragonewt  
must get to 100 in each requisite trait pairs before advancing, but  
that he only dropped back to the next lower "caste" if one of his  
traits had lowered to a total of 10 or less upon death. This latter  
number is utterly unplaytested. If a warrior wants to go to noble, he  
must not only get 100 in all "Noble" traits, but also he must have  
restored his Warrior traits to 100. 

	In addition, I play that dragonewts do not increase their  
skills by experience in the course of a single life (getting only one  
skill increase per life, as it were). This makes for slow  
improvement, but I have always assumed that it took many years, even  
centuries, for a dragonewt to advance to the next caste, except under  
unusual circumstances. Greg believes that many scout dragonewts have  
been scouts since the Dawn. No wonder the poor things get impatient  
and mutate themselves into monsters like brontosaurs. 

	However, Greg and I at one time concurred that dragonewts ARE  
capable of breeding. They, of course, have five sexes, so breeding is  
pretty slow (there only being one member of the fifth sex in all  
Dragon Pass). 


>What stage has which traits?

Once more, lacking dragonewt PCs, I didn't figure out all the  
details. I don't even recall all the dragon magic listed in the  
Glorantha supplement to RQ. Somewhere I have it all listed, plus some  
new ones, plus the trait they're all attached to. Sorry, guys. 


Scout = none (that's why scouts don't have dragon magic, and have to  
learn spirit magic or sorcery instead). 

	NOTE: a scout mutates himself into a magisaur by getting too  
interested in spirit magic, sorcery, or (Ourouboros forbid!) rune  
magic. Any scout that actually becomes an adept or acolyte is certain  
to become a magisaur next incarnation and then lose his dragonewt  
rebirth ability -- he's still immortal, and just keeps degenerating,  
getting more and more magical, and less and less intelligent.  
Eventually who knows what he'll become? A brontosaurus, I guess. 


>And what passions pertain to becoming a dinosaur?

Triceratops: Lust 

Carnosaur: greed, stinginess (as opposed to Generosity)
Brontosaurs: my own belief is that these are fully-matured magisaurs,  
but this doesn't mean that a single dragonewt can't become a  
brontosaur in a single try. I think they're not associated with any  
one trait, but with the magic ritual which the dragonewts use to try  
to skip a caste in their growth. This always fails, of course, but I  
guess there's enough newts willing to try to keep a tiny brontosaur  
population around. 

Stegosaurs: pride is my belief (as opposed to Humility). 


>Nice concept. [referring to the idea that dragon magic is easy but  
>risky power for humans.] Did this happen to the EWF as well?

I think that the "bad guys" of the EWF used dragon powers wrongly,  
but that the central catastrophe of the EWF was based on something  
else -- a noble but failed attempt to perform a magic effect that  
would transform the world. 


David Dunham asks:
>Where did Ethilrist's simple farmers come from?
They are his original Black Horse Troop mercenaries, now retired.  
Presumably they also include his BHT's children and maybe  
grandchildren nowadays. 


Marc Wilner
>It is my understanding that Dormal didn't break the Curse that  
>closed the seas, he merely developed a ritual that allowed a ship to  
>circumvent it. That means every ship needs a Priest of Dormal to  
>sail. 


Not so. The ritual is the Open Seas sorcery ceremony that anyone can  
cast. Since it's sorcery, it can be taught w/o benefit of Spell  
Teaching or summoning a spirit or anything. And certainly you don't  
need a priest to cast it, just someone with a little Ceremony and a  
magic point to spare (which is all it costs). You don't even need  
Intensity. 

	Every ship must have someone who knows Open Seas. This is not  
the same has needing a priest -- more on the order of hiring a first  
mate, steersman, or other specialist.  

	IMO, the vast majority of Gloranthan sailors don't worship  
Dormal except maybe as lay members. 


>Another point is where did the pirates learn the ritual? Did Dormal  
>broadcast it to everyone?

Yes. He was quite promiscuous in teaching it. He didn't even set up a  
cult structure (IMO) to worship him -- that was done after he left. 


Ferguson (?) asks:
>These demon horses and Hell Hounds are a bit of a puzzle to me. They  
>are creatures of Hell and Darkness, yet not related to trolls. 


Hell is a big place. There's plenty of stuff there that's not on the  
surface world, or even dreamt of by mortals. The troll parts of Hell  
are only one section. There's also the Styx "sea", inhabited by  
horrendous monsters. There's the Hell "Sky", dull gray with black  
dots for stars. There's the ghost of the Spike, huge shattered  
splinters of dead Truestone, still inhabited by some remnants of the  
Celestial Court (not the Gods, their minions). And of course there's  
other terrible places, like the "top end" of Valind's Glacier, that  
wraps around from the north of Glorantha into Hell. 


Loren Miller sez:
>the question got to be what kind of grains are appropriate for the  
>various Grain Goddesses.

They're listed in GoG. For convenience, I'll repeat them (sorry,  
didn't mean to sound didactic -- what I really mean is that these are  
my own suggestions, partly based on Greg's advice, which is why I  
published 'em). 


Frona (Fronela): barley
Krala (Kralorela): rice
Esrola (Maniria): oats
Pelora (Peloria): corn
Ralia (Ralios): wheat
Seshna (Seshnela & Tanisor): rye

Then there's more, from Pamaltela (with things like millet and peas,  
frex). Of course, any grain goddess can provide growing magic for any  
grain, but a goddess's "specialty" gets a slight bonus in growth.