From: RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RQ Digest Maintainer)
To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Daily automated RQ-Digest)
Reply-To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RuneQuest Daily)
Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Thu, 11 Aug 1994, part 3
Sender: Henk.Langeveld@Holland.Sun.COM
Content-Return: Prohibited
Precedence: junk
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From: rowe@CSUA.Berkeley.EDU (Eric Rowe)
Subject: RQ Con Compendium
Message-ID: <199408110246.TAA11179@soda.CSUA.Berkeley.EDU>
Date: 10 Aug 94 12:46:21 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5611
Hello,
David Cheng should be announcing the RQ-Con Compendium soon (probably
today) and I'd just like to note that for those of you planning to
attend RQ Con 2 this is an invaluable aide. It gives you examples of
stories that will help if you enter the Storytelling Contest or plan
to play in one of the LARPs. The seminar transcripts at the back will
keep you from asking the same questions to Greg that have already been
paid for and will help you decide if you want to wake up early for the
same types of seminars at RQ Con 2. Invaluable, especially for the
waking up question. Got Harrek on the cover too.
eric
---------------------
From: garydj@ditard.dit.gov.au
Subject: Disorderly Uleria
Message-ID: <9407117766.AA776631320@ditard.dit.gov.au>
Date: 11 Aug 94 09:55:20 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5612
Gary James here.
Someone was asking why Uleria's High Holy Day occurs in Disorder Week.
I assumed it was because she is associated with Disorder.
There is a myth of how Uleria tamed the boggles. (Boggles are some
sort of Disorder creature; the offspring of Ratslaff, I think. I
don't know if there are any boggles left in Glorantha.) The story
runs something like this. (My apologies for the lack of story telling
skill. This is from memory.)
"In Godtime, Ratslaff and his boggles were causing everyone problems.
The boggles burrowed through the world devouring many good things
which are now lost and s**ting on many others. Many gods and
goddesses tried to control them, but all failed. Then Uleria came
forward. She said she could tame the boggles, but no one believed
her. At last, when the disruption of the boggles became too great,
the other gods and goddesses agreed to let her try.
"Uleria used none of the tricks or stratagems used by the other gods
and goddesses. She did not use force or guile or try to trap the
boggles. Instead she offered what no one, not even Acos himself,
could resist. She offered herself. The boggles ravished her. The
goddess was nearly torn to shreds, but the boggles had no defense
against her Love. They became enamoured of her and would ever after
do anything for her.
"It is said when Chaos came from without the world, the boggles were
foremost in defense of their beloved goddess. Coming as they did from
Disorder, which is closer to Chaos than all other powers, they were
the most effective in combating it. This is why Uleria, alone of
the deities of the Celestial Court, escaped the destruction of the
Spike. And why her High Holy Day is celebrated in Disorder Week."
Comments, flames, better sources anyone?
Gary James
---------------------
From: jmedway@zycor.lgc.com (johnjmedway)
Subject: Britain's and Scotland's Gourmets
Message-ID: <199408110522.AAA19863@cs.utexas.edu>
Date: 10 Aug 94 19:22:13 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5614
>From: Bob.Luckin@tiuk.ti.com
>Subject: Sam's Sartar BG
>X-RQ-ID: 5541
...
>[Did I mention I have a good photo of your haggis being ceremonially carved in
>Geos ? (I also have a shot of Ken lapping it up, and of Greg pretending to do
>so, but in actuality trying not to throw it up...)]
Haggis? It was in the *troll* section, right?
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From: strauss@hopper.itc.virginia.edu (John Strauss)
Subject: rabbit food
Message-ID: <199408110635.CAA49708@Hopper.itc.Virginia.EDU>
Date: 10 Aug 94 22:35:11 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5615
Chalanna Arroy and vegetarianism:
Having played on the bleeding edge of the CA cult
restrictions, I offer the interpretation which has worked for me.
CA imposes restrictions on her initiates based on her use of
the runes Harmony and Life, especially Harmony as she is the
premier holder of that rune. That restriction is "never harm an
intelligent creature or needlessly cause pain to any living thing."
Additional restrictions are spinoffs from this idea and are
imposed, regionally, by various temples. Generally speaking, the
more civilized an area is, the heavier these restrictions. The
specific restrictions listed in the RoC CA writeup, presumably
intended to be Prax-specific, are to become a vegetarian and to
learn no combat skill save dodge.
And yet, the sample CA character supplied in the scenario is
armed with a quarterstaff and has a respectable parry skill with
it, for a Pavis CA prima donna who is setting out for her first
"field trip". At least, thanks be to Issaries, the quarterstaff is
a recognized "harmony" weapon, but still....
I have played that these additional restrictions are subject
to negotiation based on circumstance but that the main restriction
is hard and fast. This approach has made for some highly enjoyable
play.
A specific case: my CA PC, named Bargahz, was a Bison Rider,
raised in the ways of Waha. He went on to follow the cult of Storm
Bull, becoming a Storm Khan of some reknown, a bold and canny chaos
fighter. Bargahz ran out of chaos to slay while berserk once, and
slew his younger brother while in the grip of madness. When he came
to himself, he was unable to face the knowledge of his crime. He
cried out and renounced the Bull, swearing an oath that he would
never lift sword again. He fought One Ear and lost, a shattered
hulk. His bison companion, Father-of-Twins, took him to the
Hornsgate CA temple, not knowing what else to do. There he was
nursed back to a semblance of sanity over a couple of years and
given new tools with which to fight chaos.
Okay, I grant you that this is not the normal starting CA
character background. He isn't suitable for every campaign. But
Phil and I wanted to do something new and crazy. Phil said that he
could handle GMing him if I could handle playing him. To get back
to the point of all this, Bargahz did a great number of things that
would have been unthinkable, given a normal background.
Vegetarianism: Bargahz's idea of "salad" was that sprig of
parsley you see on the two inch thick steak in that Australian beer
commercial. The restriction is to never needlessly cause pain to
any living thing. Well, Bargahz was raised Waha and obeyed the
harsh strictures of the Waha Covenant. As far as he was concerned,
that was how life was to be lived and he could conceive of no other
way for him. He never ate any meat that had not been properly
butchered with Peaceful Cut. He tried to eat the disgusting rabbit
food that they served at Hornsgate, really he did. But he just
couldn't manage it.
Combat: Bargahz was a master of large shield parry, bastard
sword attack and parry, grapple, fist attack, and head butt. He
didn't use the sword, but the rest came into play quite often. He
still considered himself a chaos fighter; he just wasn't willing to
use Death.
Bargahz routinely broke down doors and shield walls in his
haste to get at wounded comrades. He was generally right there in
the thick of battle, parrying like mad or just not staying still
long enough to be engaged. He used that grapple skill to immobilize
attackers and once, to rescue a falling comrade from an unhappy
future as pizza.
He once slugged a patient in the jaw quite violently, knocking
the man unconscious and causing the CA spirit of reprisal to drop
in for a visit. The patient had a dislocated hip, a multiple
compound fracture in that leg, and best of all, had a ripped
artery, spurting bloody hit points every round. It was critical to
move the patient within the next few moments or the entire group
was going to be toast. Bargahz did not know Comfort Song and was
VERY low on magic points. IF the man had not held still for some
very brutal first aid, he would have died. If Bargahz had cast
Sleep, he would have had no power to stop the bleeding and the
patient would have died. So he hit him. The spirit of reprisal hung
around for a while and then left, bemused. I think Phil had a lot
of fun with that one....
I guess the point of all this is Your Mileage May Vary. There
are special fringe cases which can afford your campaign a lot of
fun and excitement. Don't be TOO tied down by every little word in
a cult writeup.
John Strauss
strauss@hopper.itc.virginia.edu
---------------------
From: CHEN190@csc.canterbury.ac.nz (Peter Metcalfe, CAPE Canty)
Subject: The Blue Wizard speaks the Obvious!
Message-ID: <01HFRF9KH7MQECY0NL@csc.canterbury.ac.nz>
Date: 11 Aug 94 12:14:03 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5596
Who is this Only Old One guy anyway?
====================================
ARRGHH! Sandy's relevation that it is an office and not a demigod really lets
the wind out of my thesis. (I suspect this has a lot to do with my winning the
debates in the private postings about human wave tactics we've been sending to
each other 8) )
I shall salvage my thesis and restate that Argan Argar was the 'Basko' of the
Area during the grey age having been brought there by a tribe of trolls. He
was worshipped by the humans, elves (due to his marriage to ernalda) and
beastmen as well as trolls thus providing an outlet for cooperation for those
grim times. The whole area is recognized as a single political unity by the
first council and can send a representative. This is more often than not a
troll as Trolls are the dominant race in Kethaela. The Talars of God Forgot
did not worship Argan Argar but allowed themselves to be thought of as
subjects.
The Gemborg dwarf after reprimands by the Nidan Decamony about being
subserviant to trolls as it is not within the machines plan tells the OOO to
stick it up his waste ejector causing the revolt. The OOO proves he is not a
troll causing the revolt to subside and the first council to intervene. The
resultant agreement sees Gemborg taken out of the control of the OOO and
allowed to send a representattive to the first council. This rankles with the
Argan Argar cultists and the OOO who cause trouble for Gemborg. When the
Council splits, the OOO and gemborg relaunch their private feud. Gemborg is
forced into a state of siege despite help from Arstola Forest before the OOO
is forced into retreat into the Obsidian Castle by Palangio who makes new
political institutions to reward the Gemborg and Arstola Forest. Since the OOO
is in the castle where only trolls live, the OOO is gradually seen as a troll
only office. Thus when Arkat returns, he mistakes the nature of the OOO and
rewards it generously.
Tinker, talar, Soldier, Zzabur...
=================================
Shit! I think I'm onto something with the above heading....
Anyway, Ian, I realize that you asked about the Malkioni in general. I was
thrown off by your reference to Talar rather than Noblemen (sexist socialogy).
IMO, a western nobleman calling himself a Talar would be akin to a patriach of
the Russian Orthodox Church during the publication of the Elder Protocols of
Zion calling himself a Rabbi.
Firstly the Noble faction in its beginning really only referred to the royal
family of the Serpent Kings of Sehsnela. When they were killed (trying to take
out Brithos?), various henchmen tried to claim the rights of nobility for
themselves. IMO eveolution of a heriditary caste gradually evolved over time.
You forget the Rokari faction really only seized power in 1412 ST and thus has
been ruling for 200 years (not 1600). The Kingdom of France lasted at least
500 years, so I don't see this as a problem. As for the Safelstrans who are
the most disorganized culture in extreme, I submit the following.
Malkioni theology teaches that only the Nobles can own land. The peasant can
have a right to plow his fields which can be past on to his descendants, a
Knight can inherit a manor and a merchant can own money and urban goods.
However the ultimate ownership of land belongs to that of the Noble. So if
there is a peasant revolt, the nobles can mobilize the other classes by saying
they want to deprive us of our property rights. First land who knows where
they will strike next. If a knight gets too stroppy, the nobleman could call
upon the church to curse him for going outside his appointed station. If the
church gets too powerful, the nobleman can always invoke a perogative of
cleaning out the churchs as some obscure (but popular!) precedent says that a
church should be ascetic and spiritual. Furthermore the church is supposedly
subject to the nobleman. So the nobleman levies a tax on the church. If the
church refuses to pay up, then the nobleman being higher than the wizards can
pull rank, muster and army and loot a church. Admittedly these are extreme
simplistic examples, but as malkionism has an explicit tradition of the
nobility being higher than the church (as was not the case with Western
Christendom) plenty of dirty tricks in class warfare can be sanctioned by
precedent.
Zzabur as a revolutionary: He did what?!!? tried to grab the power of the
Talars and the Horals? What a complete bastard! With zzabur like these, I
somehow think that have 2000% people skills is an essential commodity among the
Zzabur.
On Uleria and other naughty things:
===================================
Grim Jim raises the question of Uleria actually being a man in some myths. I
actually beileve that Uleria is androgenous (perhaps one or the other) but due
to the male bias of most cultures she is thought of as male. Do the Trowjangi
view Uleria as a desirable male?
Fonrit
======
Having been trying to suss it out for a year now. The Fonritian God of Tap is
Jraktal. It surprises me that Sandy says it is still worshipped in Fonrit as I
thought it was a chaos diety and not worshipped anymore. I can understand the
usefulness of the god in that the Ompalami have special servitor slaves called
Jraktali who tap the blues into submission.
One thing puzzles me. Heroes stated that in Fonrit 5% are ruling class and
retainers, 5% soldiery, 10% are merchants and artisans and another 10% are
minor landowners. This makes at least 70% slaves whereas the proportion of
blues is 25% and mulatoes another 15%. Yet Artmal is the god of slaves whereas
this implies that to be an initiate of artmal you would have to be blueskinned.
I agree with Sandy but say that the lords of Tondiji didn't want Orlanth
freedom bunk floating around. So to prove that Tondiji was the lord of
Glorantha, they chose to make an Umathealan diety, Worlath, as King of the Air
and humble bootlicker of the Great Tondiji.
---------------------
From: sandyp@idcube.idsoftware.com (Sandy Petersen)
Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Wed, 10 Aug 1994
Message-ID: <9408101639.AA03759@idcube.idsoftware.com>
Date: 10 Aug 94 04:40:16 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 5601
Peter Whitelaw:
>the God Learners infiltrated Fonrit with the establishment of
>Kalabar in 679 ST... Kalabar did not itself fall until 11xx ST I'm
>sorry I'm hazy on the date) at the hands of Soseko the Firelord
>making it the last of the God Learner places to fall. (I dunno
>about the six legged empire).
The Six Legged Empire was no longer true God Learners by the
time it fell. But I'm hazy about when it fell anyway. BUT, in any
case the God Learners did not rule Fonrit, just one city.
Fonrit's culture, while certainly influenced by the God
Learners, was not formed and shaped by it, and I don't believe that
the God Learners successfully forced any gods upon it, with the
possible exception of Issaries.
>I believe that the God Learners institutionalised the worship of
>Ompalam in Fonrit. They needed an aerial diety to be worshipped but
>did not want Orlanth shitstirring with his ideas of freedom. thus
>they introduced Worlath.
I disagree with this. I do not think the God Learners had
anything to do with Ompalam's introduction. Such a useful god would
have been spread elsewhere by the God Learners if it was one of Their
Own, and we'd see traces of it elsewhere. But there none. This is an
indigenous god if ever I saw one. In fact, it's rather puzzling that
they didn't attempt to spread it further. (Well, they tried to spread
it to the Pamaltelan savannah with the Six Leggers.) Perhaps there
was a big study project in Kalabar, and they didn't want to chance a
large-scale experiment with Ompalam until the study was finished.
>Presumably Arkat became Humakt's son by [adoption]? After all >the
>Brithini insist that his father was a barbarian warrior, nobody
>special.
Of course, to the Brithini, Humakt IS just a barbarian
warrior, nobody special.
I don't think that the God Learners renamed the suns in Ralios and
Fonrit -- these two areas were among the LEAST influenced by the God
Learners of anywhere in Glorantha.
re: Malkioni nobility
The point made by someone (alas, can't remember who) that
WHOEVER managed to oust the nobles and took over would simply become
the new nobles hit the nail right on the head. Throughout history,
there have been few cases in which a power group ousted its rulers
and then instituted a new social system. Generally, they just took
over the prerogatives of leadership themselves.
I wouldn't be a bit surprised if the Rokari had experienced
several such crises in their history (probably disguised by
establishment historians), at each of which some band of warriors or
wizards managed to oust some of the ruling nobles and took over.
In other words, Ian Gorlick's concern about the Malkioni
instability is perfectly correct -- the nobility, if it gets weak, or
is perceived as unstable, or unstable, or heretical, etc. is in fact
in grievous danger of being deposed. This was also true in Earthly
history. While Louis XIV was an absolute monarch, with both popular
sentimenet and authority backing him up, he was constantly taking
actions to maintain his supremacy, cutting down any group that might
possibly disagree with him before they could get too strong. This
applies to most other strong rulers, too. The Divine Right of Kings
to rule extended only as far as their arm and political savvy could
reach, and I believe that the Divine Investiture of a Rokari noble is
similar. In the long run, this is a good thing, because it means that
if the noble caste gets too enfeebled or decadent, fresh blood gets
injected and these sad sacks are out on the street (or dead). Vive le
revolucione! (sp?)
The nobles are not so helpless that they are vulnerable to
every whim of a popular captain-at-arms. I'm sure that they seek
allies among the various power groups, try to cultivate
politically-important members of other castes, hand out offices with
an eye towards satisfying the rapacity of potential enemies, etc.
Also, BOM mentions that they are seen as legitimate, and that this
enhances their position. This is true, too.
BOM badmouths doves:
>Doves are violent, territorial, bad-tempered, vicious creatures.
>Ever watch them in action?
This is a bit of an exaggeration. I've watched 'em in action.
They are quite affectionate towards their mates, and are not
particularly violent. They eat only things that are incapable of
fighting back, and when one dove violates another's territory and is
assaulted, the trespasser generally flies away at high speed.
I've handled many a dove and neither been pecked nor clawed.
They're quite mild-mannered compared to, say, hamsters or geckos.
Certainly if you put two unmated doves in a cage together one
will kill the other. But this is true of most animals that rely on
flight to save themselves -- they have no inhibitions about killing
other members of their own species because such inhibitions aren't
generally needed. A dove's powers of escape are so exceptional, and
its weapons so feeble, that there's no point in bothering to give it
an instinctual reluctance to kill other doves.
The attacks on doves and hummingbirds as "unsuitable" for CA
familiars because they're so "aggressive" is laughable. By these
standards NO life-form will end up acceptable, since no life-form is
wholly pacifistic, just as no life-form is utterly crazed with
aggression (though some come close). For that matter many butterflies
are territorial, and I've seen them fight and drive off potential
rivals. So have you -- the common sight of two butterflies flittering
around one another as they cruise off in some direction is often two
males fighting. Sometimes it's a male and female courting, though.
And sometimes it's a male checking out another male in hopes it's a
female. It's hard to say with butterflies, since their most
aggressive actions are somewhat impaired by their lack of offensive
capacity. But when you see an elderly butterfly with tattered wings,
those wings are often tattered from fights, not predator attacks.
The scale is relative. A dove is territorial, and will drive
off rivals, and will peck to death an unfriendly rival if penned
together. On the other hand, doves are a hell of a lot milder than
weasels, shrews, cape buffalo, or monitor lizards.
I had to spout off. It was so ludicrous seeing people point
out the "dark side of hummingbirds" et al that I just couldn't stand
it. And yes, hummingbirds are highly obnoxious to others of their
species, though I've never seen one injure or kill another -- just
berserkly drive them off.
BOM
>I'm assuming that Prax is like the US praries.
Prax is not as fertile as the U.S. Prairies. It's more like
the more reasonable parts of the Great Basin (the Wastes is like the
other parts of the Great Basin). I don't think you get 2-3 meter
grass except in Summer Fertile Ground.
I agree that the fuel is dried animal dung (which is mostly
grass anyway). However, I'm sure that the Praxians use dried grass as
tinder. Incidentally, it would seem clear that the Morocanth are
short on fuel, since their own animals' dung isn't particularly good
for this purpose, nor is their own. Good thing they prefer the river
bottoms where there are occasional trees.