Bell Digest v940920p1

From: RuneQuest-Request@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RQ Digest Maintainer)
To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (Daily automated RQ-Digest)
Reply-To: RuneQuest@Glorantha.Holland.Sun.COM (RuneQuest Daily)
Subject: RuneQuest Daily, Tue, 20 Sep 1994, part 1
Sender: Henk.Langeveld@Holland.Sun.COM
Content-Return: Prohibited
Precedence: junk

X-RQ-ID: Intro

This is the RuneQuest Daily Bulletin, a mailing list on
the subjects of Avalon Hill's RPG and Greg Stafford's 
world of Glorantha.  It is sent out once per day in digest

More details on the RuneQuest Daily and Digest can be found
after the last message in this digest.

X-RQ-ID: index

6265:  = 
 - Truestone & SB
6266:  = 
 - line
6267:  = 
 - My DM 0.02 on Truestone
6268:  = 
 - Temporary temples
6269:  = 
 - Gloranthan Geology
6270:  = 
 - line,
6271:  = 
 - Re: RuneQuest Daily, Sat, 17 Sep 1994
6272:  = 
 - Truestone, Earth Deities, etc.
6273:  = 
 - line
6274:  = 
 - Fatigue
6275:  = 
 - Blogg'em...
6276:  = 
 - hearthmother tale
6277:  = 
 - 2nd hearthmother story
6278:  = 
 - Re: Truestone, Rune Magic, Carmanians


Subject: Truestone & SB
Message-ID: <9409190906.AA01003@Sun.COM>
Date: 19 Sep 94 09:09:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6265

Hi All
	To repeat (quickly) an article I posted quite a few months ago:-
1) I believe Truestone does double damage to Chaos creatures (like iron does 
to trolls and elves).  
2) I prefer to think that the original loader of a Truestone does not lose 
the spells permanently, but can regain them after they have been cast from the 
3) The Storm Bull cult have a few very special weapons designed for heroes to 
use to kill Chaos and also reenact their god's defeat of the Devil.  These 
are troll mauls with Truestone heads.  The Truestones each hold the full 
complement of spells of one or more Storm Kahns.  The ritual method for 
dispatching the Chaos foe is an overhand special (or critical) blow which 
crushes the head of the target and piledrives them into the earth.  
NB.  I would rule that chaots cannot regenerate from damage inflicted by a 
Truestone (also it would ignore any chaotic features like +12pt skin armour)!
From a mythical standpoint the close proximity of the Truestone would close 
the temperary gap in the fabric of reality which Glorantha chooses to cover 
with a chaos monster.  



From: (Simon William Jones)
Subject: line
Date: 19 Sep 94 09:24:10 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6266

	Sorry, just another request really.

	Having read about PenDragon Pass, and knowing that it was put as an 
article in Tales #6 or #7, which I ain't got, could some-one, anyone, send me the 
article- the author- I don't know who ever. I've got a sketchy version of my own, 
knowing Pendragon, but, would like to use the version everyone else is using.


From: (Joerg Baumgartner)
Subject: My DM 0.02 on Truestone
Date: 19 Sep 94 09:31:29 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6267

Ok, everybody had their say on Truestone, so here's mine.

My exposure to Truestone started with Elder Secrets, so I had little 
problem to accept the rules stated there, and repeated in SiP:

If a user of divine(-like) magic finds an unset Truestone, he feels the 
overpowering urge to transfer all his divine magic into it. The spells 
are permanently lost to the provider, and they are permanently set into 
the Truestone. Magic Points are not involved at all under RQ3 rules.

Spells in a set Truestone may be cast by the person holding it. 
Afterwards the Truestone knows the spell in the same way a priest knows 
a reusable spell he has just cast - it can be renewed at a temple by 
performing the spell renewal ritual (a day's worth of prayer).

The advantage is that one doesn't need a priest who can cast this 

If a set Truestone is found, in all likelyhood the spells will have 
been cast, and to use it they first have to be refreshed.

This far the picture is clear. Now come possible solutions for the bags 
of worms:

- If a one-use (for priests) spell is set in a Truestone, the same 
amout of POW must be spent to reactivate the spell.

- If a Warding spell is set in a Truestone, the user still needs to 
enchant the rods for the spell.

- If a ritual spell is set in a Truestone, this means the knowledge 
about the ritual has been put into it. To perform the ritual correctly, 
the appropriate ritual skill has to be used. I'd modify this skill with 
a familiarity factor based roughly on the cult relation table (Cults 
Book p.18): the number given divided by four is multiplied with the 
skill. Minor variations could be allowed for sharing runes or traits of 
the other cult.
In the case of Enchant spells, the POW must be provided by the caster.

- Setting a stone: I'd rule that only spells the person touching the 
stone could actually cast at that moment are put into the stone. This 
would allow priests to retain a minimum of their reusable magic even if 
they fill the stone.

- Emergency refilling of set Truestones:
This seems to have been the case in Biturian's encounter with the 
Chalana Arroy priestess: Biturian's stone must have been set with his 
repertoire of Rune spells already, but they had been cast from the 
stone. To activate the stone, Biturian cast his spells into the "slots" 
of the stone, and so gave her access to his magic.

- Truestones set with magic of different religions: Refilling the 
For the maximum game fun I would rule that anybody can refill the 
spell, regardless of cult rank in whatever cult, but that this person 
would have to do so in a place holy or sanctified to the cult which 
gave this spell. Imagine a group of Orlanthi sneaking into a Lunar holy 
place to refill their Mindblast spell...
I wouldn't call this refilling a worship of the deity in question; by 
binding the deity's spell into Truestone, it is effectively moved 
outside this deity's control. If members of appropriate cults (the 
original one, associated or friendly cults) perform the refilling, it 
would be sort of worship. If enemy cultists perform the refilling, 
they'd worship their own deity by overcoming the enemy and stealing its 
power. Beware of spirits of reprisal in this case...
Because Truestones hold part of the divine essence of the original 
cult, they are considered sacred items of that cult. The cult in 
question will do whatever is within its power to recover such a stone.

So, who would profit from Truestone?

Powergamers mainly, I'm afraid, although this includes heroes:

An unset Truestone is very handy if you plan to change your cult. Fill 
it with all your magic, and then be excommunicated or not, as long as 
you have the stone, you have the magic, and reusably so.

A vile use of it would be to force an unset Truestone upon an 
unsuspecting rival, let him fill it, and then take it from him. Saves 
you a meeting on the hero plane...

The deathbed filling of unset Truestone would still be powergaming, but 
by thesociety, not the individual. It is possible, and it would create 
interesting special temple offices as guardians of the stone. Give a 
Rune Lord without reusable divine magic or 1D10 DI such a stone, and 
you have a very distinguished character, and a tough NPC.

I have used a Truestone only once in a scenario, where the Truestone 
was part of the altar at a holy place where no regular worship 
occurred. Worship  was part of the spell collection inside the 
Truestone, to allow also non-Rune levels to perform the holy quest at 
this place. I ruled that the questers would refill the stone's spells 
by their prayer, except the handy escape spells, which would likely 
have to be refilled before the use.

--  Joerg Baumgartner


From: (Joerg Baumgartner)
Subject: Temporary temples
Date: 19 Sep 94 09:31:41 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6268

David Dunham in X-RQ-ID: 6261

> From my Ralios PenDragon Pass game:
> GUSTBRAN        [heat, stasis]
> God of the Forge
> Miscellaneous: Shrines are very rare.

> (Although almost all clan thanes support a smith, there's no way for enough
> smiths and apprentices to gather to support a shrine by the temple size
> rules.)

This is a typical example for the periodical gathering of specialists. 
IMO there will be fairs even in backwater Orlanthi regions, where 
something like a Great Market spell of Issaries is turned in its effects 
to City Harmony rather than a special case of Warding. Just like Issaries 
or other trade gods' initiates can renew spells at such an opportunity, 
you will also get craftsmen's aggregations here which will support shrines 
or larger congregations, and entertainers and other minority groups will 
make their use of these opportunities as well.

In East Ralios there might be horse fairs which will attract blacksmiths 
(ok, bronze working horse-shoeing smiths), who will be the local 
horse-healers as well, and therefore taken along to give their expertise 
on the specimen for sale or for breeding contracts. Excellent background 
for all kind of roleplaying activities...

--  Joerg Baumgartner


From: (Simon William Jones)
Subject: line,
Date: 19 Sep 94 11:46:59 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6270

	Good afternoon Gentlemen and Ladies,
	Just another request, I'm afraid. The continual mentioning of PenDragon 
Pass, has finally spurred to ask, if it's not too much trouble, whether someone 
could mail me the rules. I know it appeared in Tales (6 or 7), and as these are 
unavailable, this is my only recourse. I know David Hall will be reading this, so if 
you object, just yell out. I'm familiar with Pendragon, and use my own draft rules, 
but it would be nice to see the "official" version.
	Thanks for your time,


From: (Sandy Petersen)
Subject: Re: RuneQuest Daily, Sat, 17 Sep 1994
Message-ID: <>
Date: 19 Sep 94 04:28:08 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6271

Martin Glassborow
>Hags get sorcery as their 'magic' according to the Creatures book,  
>do  Gloranthan Hags also get sorcery? 

	'Tis my opinion that they get sorcery. Who taught them? It's  
likely that _they_ taught the sorcerers first. They're older, after  

>Hags can create Shades from darkness simply by expending magic  
>points, do people have any ideas/opinions whether they could use  
>stored power, i.e crystals etc, to produce whopping big nasty  
	Of course. 

>I used this tactic to bind big, big, BIG Shades. 

??? Just 'cause hags can produce big shades doesn't mean they're any  
easier to bind. 

>I haven't got my various troll supplements to hand, but can Dehores 

>(intelligent shades) turn off their fear-shock? 

	Dehores are more than just intelligent shades, and there is a  
whole spread of different Dehori. I don't think they can turn off  
their fear-shock, but the trolls could hide in a Shadow, of which a  
semi-intelligent species lives in Dagori Inkarth. 

Nick Eden:
>According to the G:CotHW books, the Pol Joni number about
>Five thousand. This makes them smaller than the independent tribes
	What you  must remember is that the Pol Joni all live in  
Prax. The bulk of Rhino Riders, Morocanth, etc. live in the Wastes.  
Nomad Gods only shows the Praxians who happen to be in Prax at the  
time -- easily 80-90% are off gallivanting around Graydust Flats or  
the Demon's Quarter. 

Tarry Higgins:
>On the whole though the way that Sandy looks at truestones makes 

>them little more than divine magic matrices
	In my own defense, this is only true when the crystal is used  
for the relatively mundane purpose of storing Rune spells. I play  
that _anything_ can be stored in a Truestone -- skill points, POW  
(regenerable), INT, knowledge, _anything_. A person wasting his  
Truestone on Rune spells would be condemned in most areas I know.

>Are there Morokanth Storm Bulls? 

	Yes, but probably not many, since the main berserker cult  
among the Morocanth is a variant on Zorak Zoran.

>What gear do they use?
	Same as other Morocanth warriors -- i.e., claws, maces. 

>do they mix with other Storm Bulls? 

	Not much -- there's no reason for Storm Bull Berserks to lose  
all their prejudices and racial hatred just because that bastard  
Morocanth has managed to sniggle his way into the cult of the Bull. 

>Do the Pol Joni Storm Bulls worship at the block, or do they  
>dominate the Stormwalk Mountain altar?
	The latter. While the Praxian Storm Bulls violate many cult  
dogmas, if the Pol Joni showed up riding their horses there'd be  
enough squabbles and fights that it wouldn't be worth the trouble. Of  
course, every once in a while the Pol Joni Storm Bulls get a flea in  
their ear and a couple of hundred of them charge over to the block en  
masse to worship there "as is our right" and get in a huge brawl and  
have a grand old time. 



Subject: Truestone, Earth Deities, etc.
Message-ID: <>
Date: 19 Sep 94 16:37:16 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6272

        I have always played Truestone as being the frozen blood of the 
     gods/desses and took the frozen description one step further.  In 
     Truestone, time is frozen.  When you cast a spell into the Truestone, 
     it remains inside, half cast until ultimately released.  So, the 
     caster cannot regain the magic.
        On the subject of Earth Deities, after Arachne Solara cast out her 
     web and whilst Taron keeps the world in balance, the Earth gods/desses 
     are less tied to their ground than they were in the Godtime.  Even 
     with great amounts of worship and much magic point sacrificing, the 
     ground in a wasteland won't improve much.  Things occur in a linear 
     fashion now (for the most part).  Too much intervention by a deity 
     would be taken as a breach in the Great Compromise, and even the gods 
     are not interested in seeing Glorantha destroyed.
        Just some random thoughts,


From: (Mr S.W. Jones)
Subject: line
Message-ID: <>
Date: 19 Sep 94 17:48:23 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6273

	PenDragon Pass
	Sorry, but I've just got a request that I'm hoping you can help
with, having seen PenDragon Pass mentioned quite a few times, and knowing
it to be printed in Tales 6 or 7 (which is sadly out of print)- I was 
wondering if any of you generous souls could furnish me with a copy of 
said article. I have my own version, but would still like the "official"
version (hope there's no complaint from David Hall).
	Thanks for your time,


Subject: Fatigue
Date: 19 Sep 94 07:47:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6274

Does anyone have any material on the amount of fatigue lost to encumbered and 
unencumbered individuals when travelling?  By foot, horseback, everything?  If 
not, what are your rulings on this(I might compose a chart based on your 
experiences with this).

PS: How often does the Digest come out?  And how often do people receive Codex 
magazines?  I ordered some and the check was cashed over a month ago, but I 
haven't seen anything yet.  Anyone help me out here?

David Cowling


From: (Nick Brooke)
Subject: Blogg'em...
Message-ID: <940919202000_100270.337_BHL97-1@CompuServe.COM>
Date: 19 Sep 94 20:20:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6275

Devin asked about the Bloggom Marshes, one possible end location for Jon 
Quaife's scenario "Queen Ogzag's Hall", in Tales #13.

I think the colour Purple associated with them is meant as a giveaway that 
these Marshes are on the shores of Luathela. But if your campaign is better 
served by locating them near Slon, or Winterwood, or any point in between, 
put'em there. The point is, they're very, very far away. JQ said he wrote 
them in because he liked the Voyage of the Dawn Treader so much, if I'm 
remembering his comments straight.

They are off the map.

I'd hope for a ship of passing Wolf Pirates (in an amiable mood), or maybe 
idealistic Loskalmi explorers (Boldly Going, etc.), myself. Or Barran the 
Monster-Slayer, if you want a fully-fleshed-out crew and a tie-in to 
"Strangers in Prax"...

This ship's very next stop is wherever you want your players to end up. 
(Perhaps by way of a couple of God Learner islands inhabited by Silly Old 
Men, etc: I can name you a good source for these).



From: SMITHH@A1.MGH.HARVARD.EDU (Harald Smith 617 724-9843)
Subject: hearthmother tale
Date: 19 Sep 94 11:27:00 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6276

   (A short tale from Imther)
   The Death of the Hearthmother
   by Harald Smith and Peter Michaels
   In the days when Lodrem wandered on and within the earth, he had many 
   children. One was called Enveria, a goddess of fire.  When Yelem fell 
   from the sky, the people called upon Enveria for help and she aided 
   them for Enveria was the Communal Fire.  She lived both among the 
   people on the world below and among the gods in the world above.    
   Among the people, she lived in every fire they lit:  the hearth, the 
   candle, the bonfire, etc...  She helped and aided the people, 
   providing them with  a spirit of community as well as with tools to 
   warm themselves with and to guide themselves thereby.
   One day, Orlantio espied her and desired her for himself.  He came to 
   Enveria as a gentle breeze, but she shied away.  He came to her again, 
   winds swirling around, but she tried to escape and eluded his grasp.  
   Finally, he came to her to show her his great majesty* with a cape of 
   huge clouds and a mighty flail which he waved around himself.  Enveria 
   tried to run from this terror, but the storm was too great.  The 
   ground tore up around her and she tripped upon an uprooted tree.  
   Orlantio, in his lust madness, did not see that she had fallen.  He 
   brought his flail down upon the tree and Enveria, destroying her very 
   being.  Orlantio howled in fury, but it was too late.  Enveria fled 
   upon the path of Yelem and finally escaped from Orlantio's clutches.  
   But upon the earth, the people were left without fire and they grew 
   cold and hungry.**
   * amongst the southern clans:  Orlantio comes to her engorged with 
   ** amongst the northern clans, especially along the border with Tork, 
   a variation is told:
   Enveria ran into the Darkness in an attempt to escape Orlantio.  In 
   her panic, she ran into a horrible demon named Bagog.  When Orlantio 
   saw what Enveria had met, his lust left him and he quietly slunk away 
   amidst the shadows.  Bagog devoured, enslaved, and perverted Enveria, 
   forcing her to become the community focus for her terrible children.  
   Upon the earth, the people were left without fire or a sense of unity, 
   and they grew cold, hungry, and isolated.


From: (Paul Reilly)
Subject: Re: Truestone, Rune Magic, Carmanians
Message-ID: <>
Date: 19 Sep 94 21:36:07 GMT
X-RQ-ID: 6278

  Paul here quoting Henk quoting Jonas Schiott:

>As I've implied before, I want Truestones to just 'freeze' cast spells,
>keep them in Stasis (closely related to Law) if you will, until they are
>called for. This would mean that the person filling the stone _has_ cast
>the spell (and can thus regain it as normal), it just hasn't taken effect yet

  Henk replies:
>Sudden surge of insight: The Truestone acts as a portal in time
>between the original caster and the eventual user of the spell.
>Now originally, I resided in the latter camp,  but I think
>Jonas' model is so good that I'm tempted to switch.

  I'd support this also.  We use something that is functionally similar
but not so elegantly described...  Truestone as a piece of the "old world".
Souls are another such piece.

  I give blank Truestones an effective POW - they only have so much 'potential'
to be 'set'.  Combining this with Jonas' description and Henk's addition,
we would have something with 
a) Game balance - you don't have 'excess' Rune Magic appearing from nowhere.
b) A nice elegant description, very Gloranthan
c) A nice conceptual model - the truestone acts like a 'time portal' but
is only so 'wide'.  And its channels are in a set shape...  this makes more
sense if you subscribe to the model that all uses of a Rune Spell are echoes
of the First use of that spell.


  This brings up:  Rune Magic.

  I run that the 'primitive' form of Rune Magic is gotten by personal questing,
through known methods.  (And sometimes unknown).  For Trickster, this is 
the only way.  For some primitive cultures, it is a way.

  In more complex societies, the process gets formalized and comes under temple
(or at least priestly) control.

  Oh, have to go, more later.