Re: Magical Augments - A little extreme?

From: David Cake <dave_at_...>
Date: Fri, 12 Apr 2002 00:33:01 +0800


At 12:33 PM +0200 11/4/02, Julian Lord scribbled:
>David :
>
>> Fah! I'm a connoiseur of Alan Moore Magick rants myself, but
>> I'm also familiar with good game rules. The problem isn't the number
> > of too many wibbles, its the how.

>The logarithmic design of HQ places this, deliberately I think?,
>but (more important) _successfully_ in the Narrator's lap.

        The logarithmic design of HQ just means it makes even less sense - in theory, it means each additional augment is actually MORE powerful than the one before.

>Every single "solution" anyone's proposed for the "problem" works.

        Its all the 'its not a problem' non-solutions that bother me. All the solutions do more or less fix it. Even if all you are saying is 'as narrator I would never let them do that', thats a tacit admission that there is a problem.

        A good narrator can always cope with bad rules. But thats no reason to encourage them.

>This is because it's actually a NON-problem roolz-wise, and mainly
>a matter of individual GM/Player style/taste.
>
>There's no point in following the Alan Moore thread any further
>(point made), and I don't really like mentioning logarithms on this
>forum : Here There be Wealth Threads * ... <shiver> ...

        Unfortunately, its all about the logarithms.

>But from the Magical Augmentation game mechanics POV,
>and the Glorantha 'realism' POV (Magickal superdimensionality),
>I agree with RR.

        Fah. I think the magical augmentation is the anti-thesis of Gloranthan realism - all the big hero contests I've ever read come down to far more interesting things than 5 rounds of ambush!

>How to get the extra wibbles (answer: multiple Augmentations) is
>a non-problem. The important questions are : How many wibbles feel
>comfortable in your game ? & How many wibbles are right for official HQ
>releases ?

         No, it really is how you get there. The number of wibbles in your game makes almost difference most of the time (sssh, don't tell the powergamers), but how you arrive at that number of wibbles IS your narrative.

>The simple fact is that the Magical Augmentation mechanics _work_
>(except for a few problems at low levels of wibble in HW, hopefully
>not so in HQ), and let all comers decide for themselves what's
>comfortable and what isn't.

        Well, no. They are one of the most troublesome parts of the game, often tweaked and much argued about, and we seem to have identified a few extra problems.

> > The problem is not the guys with incredibly high abilities,
>> its the guys with big abilities being wasted by the guys who aren't
>> as good and have a few rounds to prepare.
>
>Why is that a problem ? Remember Rurik ?

        Eh, what? You are remembering the part of Ruriks Saga about the multiply augmenting trollkin (snuck in from the other game system)? Rurik died due to bad luck - and this multiple augment stuff favours the powerful, not the little guys.

>And there's something similar in Harmast's Saga AFAIK/IIRC
>
>Not to mention David vs Goliath ...

        Again, you have the bible with the expurgated parts about the multiple augments? Because I don't recall that being a significant part of the story, which is why I don't want it being a major part of the rules, which will turn it into a major part of MY story.

        (BTW read the story of David and Goliath yesterday, by an odd coincidence - Kyle Bakers version, which is recommended. Just to keep on that comics creator theme. ).

> > >PPS & What about Spirits, Spells, and various Mystic powers ??
>> >That rule doesn't work at all with these ...
>
>> They are increased separately. Given the general inefficiency
>> of augment, its not a problem at all.
>
>Er, trying to have it both ways ??

        No. Spending 5 HP gets you a +5 increase in an ability, which gives you +1 on an augment, and it doesn't matter that much whether you spread your HP over several abilities or 1. On the other hand, if you allow multiple augments from the one affinity, you can't really tell what level of increase you get for a single point.

>
>> Well, actually, with spells the
>> same rule should apply apply - only one augment from the same
>> Grimoire, as its analogous.
>
>I really disagree with this. Surely, a fragment of the Blue Book
>of Zzabur might provide a little more magickal >oomph< than some
>Esrolian sea-captain's one-spell Grimoire ??

        Lets go back to HW rule number 1 - for purposes of comparison, the ability level is what matters, not what its called, which is narrative.

	Cheers
		David

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