Rather than comment on everything directly, I'll make my points directly. I'll try to identify where Ian (and Greg) and I disagree.
First comment, though : Stop assuming that those disagreeing with you are
'simulationists' whatever that means for a roleplaying game. I don't
believe any game is simulationist. RQ may have falling rules, and fire
rules, but they aren't accurate (even close) and I can't remember what they
are anyway. I've never run any game any differently than I run Hero Wars -
I ignore most of the rules as 'too complicated', wave hands a lot, and say
'sounds cool to me, it works' a lot. Hero Wars is the first game,
admittedly, that I've played where I actually use enough of the rules to
get into a conversation about them.
What I do want from rules is simplicity. Numbers that need to be changed before I can use them are useless to me. Lots of special cases along the lines of "a horse's run fast and a human's run fast are different" complicate matters, and I can't be bothered. I appreciate that if I flick through Anaxial's and there are no numbers that match what I want I have to make up numbers that do. I'm okay with that. Anaxial's is for inspiration only.
One major difference we do have is in our perceptions of mundane abilities. If I have a character with close combat 10W4, I can slaughter the entire fyrd of the average Orlanthi clan. By myself. Before breakfast. Disagree with the number? Add masteries until you do agree. This is, by Hero Wars definitions, a mundane skill. It has no parallel in *this* world, though. It's not really magical as such - lets call it *heroic*.
Now for the slight red-herring of outrunning a horse, why can't a *heroic* runner outrun a horse? Why do the rules allow for heroic swordsmen but not heroic runners? Why can't I tell that story if my players want to? Now, as I said, this is a bit of a red-herring, 'cos as far as I'm aware no one *does* want to outrun a horse. But the general point holds. If I can climb into the otherworld (as is given as an example in the original rule book) using a "mundane" skill, and I can slaughter armies, why can't I outrun horses? What else can I or can't I do - if my skills are of heroic levels. What about being stronger than a bear? Why provide numbers AT ALL if I can't use them against the MAIN characters in the game?
Ian quotes a couple of pieces from Anaxial's. I'll copy them here :
"Hero Wars has no set list of abilities for heroes: one might have Resilient, another Tough. Anaxial's Roster uses a few conventions for describing creatures, so that like can be compared with like. These rules in no way restrict the meanings or uses of abilities for heroes" Anaxial's Roster (p.10-11)
Humans have 'Large 6 and Small 6' in the Anaxial's sense, even if they have
'Large 5W' written on the character sheet. Fair enough. Large was always an
odd cludge. But this barely *hints* at the idea that *all* animal skills
can't be compared to human skills.
"a bird no more needs a Fly skill than a human hero needs a Walk
skill!
Abilities such as Aerobatics reflect excellence at aerial
maneuvering, while those like Fly Fast and Run Fast define speed.
Senses work in the same way. Most natural animals have the same
senses as humans, and many have much better senses. A natural
animal's sense of smell gives it as much information as a human's
sight gives to him. A wolf does not need an Excellent Sense of Smell
ability to sense nearby creatures; this is a natural and automatic
ability."
Interestingly this *specifically* states that "[Abilities] like Fly Fast and Run Fast define speed." I'd read that to say that those abilities are *meant* to be used in contests against heroes. All this says, to me, is that birds can fly without using a skill, and wolves can smell you without using a skill. i.e. These are automatically in the 'no self respecting X fails...'
Nothing here suggests to me that you aren't meant to use the numbers directly in contests with humans.
To summarise :
And where we agree :
6. If you need different numbers, make them up!
And where I'm not sure we agree :
7. Some consistency and guidance helps.
Cheers,
Graham
-- Graham Robinson graham_at_... Albion Software Engineering Ltd.
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