> It's been convincingly argued that ancestor worshipping
> animist traditions don't practice integration as that
> would put the ancestor out of circulation. However, isn't
> the same true for fetishes: if old grandpa is caught in a
> fetish, another descendant who tries to contact him should
> fail.
Maybe it would be helpful to think of fetishes in a slightly different way. Rather than seeing the ancestor trapped in the fetish, either temporarily or permanently, how about this:
Fetishes used for contacting ancestors can be of (at least) two types. The first type of fetish includes items that were highly valued by the ancestor. For instance, the favored weapon of a renowned nomad warrior might qualify as a fetish; his water-skin wouldn't. The second type of fetish includes items made by a shaman or family member to celebrate the ancestor's accomplishments. In both cases, the fetishes should establish an emotional connection with the ancestor (i.e. buying my coffee table at a sidewalk sale is not enough to contact me after I'm dead).
One way to look at permanent "integration," even though that has been argued against, is not that you've trapped the ancestor, but that you have possession of the ancestor's most favored item, or you have created the most meaningful memorial of the ancestor's life. The ancestor feels that emotional bond to the fetish more strongly than any other bond, and therefore responds to requests for magic.
For single-use magic, the same rationales apply, only this time the ancestor requires you to dispose of (or complete a task with) the favored item, or requires that you build a new memorial to receive another favor.
A drawback to this is that the success of contacting the ancestor using the favored item or proudly announcing the memorial you've built is covered by the poorly-named Spirit Combat ability. But didn't Roderick say that the ability really covered multiple means of getting a spirit to do what you want (frequently, but not always, involving spirit combat)?
James
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